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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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 Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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Mohammed is regarded in Islam as the 'perfect man' uswa hasana, al-Insān al-Kāmil and his example is one to be emulated by all Muslims. Thus, his actions and deeds, as recorded in the Hadith, are not some kind of sideshow to 'true Islam', but central to it.
Hence, Mohammed's actions and deeds are the basis of much Islamic practice and law. That is a simple fact. I have already demonstrated this with regard to the Islamic punishment for apostasy. To say that his actions are 'incidental to Islam' is unbelievably ignorant. I suppose it would be nice to believe that the behaviour of such a deeply 'flawed' man, a model of behaviour for hundreds of millions of Muslims was merely 'incidental', but clearly it is not.
Let's not forget that one of Ayatollah Khomenei's first acts of office was to lower the legal age of marriage for girls to 9 years old, presumably because he did not consider the acts of the 'perfect man' to be incidental to the practice of the religion. |
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CyberGuy
Joined: 27 Dec 2007
Location: Daejeon, Korea
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| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Koveras wrote: |
| Spreading Hatred is the opposite of Celebrating Diversity. |
Thats correct. Alas, bigots choose the first one. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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The bigots don't realize that their rants also make some of us more sympathetic towards Muslims.
Perhaps if I lived in Europe, I'd be a little more sympathetic, but since there are so few Muslims here in America, and are a relatively small % of immigrants, I'm not exactly shaking in my boots. Plus I am pretty confident that Americans would be much more vehement in their opposition than their Canadian and European peers if those numbers quickly changed.
And crap, out of all the Muslims I've met here in the US, none have come across as fundamentalist by a long stretch of the imagination.
Excuse my ramble, just putting off my paper on Islamic finance, which is as much hogwash as any religion. |
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CyberGuy
Joined: 27 Dec 2007
Location: Daejeon, Korea
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| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
Oh, c'mon. Islam is corrupted or golden or somewhere between based on the daily practice of the worshippers, the theology, the dogma, the philosophies.
Its weak. I suppose nobody agrees with me, though.
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Actually I have posted a commentary over the verses which one of the haters talked about. Here is the commentary:
http://islamicstudies.info/maarif/surah65.htm
I didn't see these morons ever (and I mean EVER) reading and giving critique and questioning the sources I provided. All they have to do is refer to jihadwatch.com and other s**tty websites talking on the behalf of Islam.
Could these haters give a chance to what Muslims and their websites have to say as well?
Enough ironic that I learned about "If I kill civilians or die as suicide Muslim then I'll get 72 virgins in paradise" solely and SOLELY from non-islamic or anti-islamic websites.
I tried such analysis a number of times and I think you can try too. For example: just write "72 virigins" in youtube and search and you will see dozens of videos talking and mocking about 72 virgin thingy. All of'em made by nonmuslims and I was yet to find a single one of them made by a Muslim.
So, it is non-muslims preaching all over the net that I'm gonna get 72 virgins if I kill some civilians through suicide bombing.
Sorry dudes, I am not convinced.
I am some American patriot soldier who fought with great bravery in the war and nobody even dares to talk bad about me and my family, and if anybody does then he should get the hell out of America?
In another situation, realize I am a Muslim and I fought in a war with same bravery. Suddenly every news channel knows I am terrorist and I died for 72 virgins?
I thought you invaded my country, robbed my land, massacred my relatives and families, raped our women, melted down my friends by phosphorus?. Yoohoo !!! Hello !!! are you blind??? Got some dirt on your eyes which came out of a box having the label of "fascism" on it?
What are you patriot for? You believe that you owe to this country cuz it is your motherland and catered your needs, its your home sweet home. Guess what? Muslims do not hate their own countries/places either. They do realize and are thankful patriots too, in the same fashion they believe God is the supreme creator of their sweet home, so they be thankful to him as well.
Oh well, these Muslms dont matter, let me visit jihadwatch crap and Tarraaaaaaaaaaa !! Muslims are bunch of freaks terrorists, they just want blood , blood and more blood they are draculas, they kill people for laughing(?) they kill people for fun. Since they are terrorists, so they have no reason to kill.
And...there go you get brainwashed and come out on eslcafe with the nicks like mises, Axl and bigverne; Look at Islam from your s**t-hole narrow perspective; borrow some venom from "intellectual-looking brainfart" websites, and......spread it all over the place.
So, to the people who listen to these bunch of low lives: Listen to them or not, but better try to find what Islamic websites have to say as well. Fair enough?
Some of Islamic websites are:
http://www.sultan.org
http://islam.thetruecall.com/
http://www.islam-guide.com/
Learning trimmed, twisted and misquoted stuff from the malicious potty mouths is very easy, but unlearning it takes much of time and effort which I think not many people have motivation for.
CG. |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 3:09 am Post subject: |
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| CyberGuy wrote: |
| Koveras wrote: |
| Spreading Hatred is the opposite of Celebrating Diversity. |
Thats correct. Alas, bigots choose the first one. |
A Muslim talking about celebrating diversity! Thanks for the laugh. |
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CyberGuy
Joined: 27 Dec 2007
Location: Daejeon, Korea
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 5:37 am Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
Oh, c'mon. Islam is corrupted or golden or somewhere between based on the daily practice of the worshippers, the theology, the dogma, the philosophies.
Its weak. I suppose nobody agrees with me, though.
|
Actually I have posted a commentary over the verses which one of the haters talked about. Here is the commentary:
http://islamicstudies.info/maarif/surah65.htm
I didn't see these morons ever (and I mean EVER) reading and giving critique and questioning the sources I provided. All they have to do is refer to jihadwatch.com and other s**tty websites talking on the behalf of Islam.
Could these haters give a chance to what Muslims and their websites have to say as well?
Enough ironic that I learned about "If I kill civilians or die as suicide Muslim then I'll get 72 virgins in paradise" solely and SOLELY from non-islamic or anti-islamic websites.
I tried such analysis a number of times and I think you can try too. For example: just write "72 virigins" in youtube and search and you will see dozens of videos talking and mocking about 72 virgin thingy. All of'em made by nonmuslims and I was yet to find a single one of them made by a Muslim.
So, it is non-muslims preaching all over the net that I'm gonna get 72 virgins if I kill some civilians through suicide bombing.
Sorry dudes, I am not convinced.
I am some American patriot soldier who fought with great bravery in the war and nobody even dares to talk bad about me and my family, and if anybody does then he should get the hell out of America?
In another situation, realize I am a Muslim and I fought in a war with same bravery. Suddenly every news channel knows I am terrorist and I died for 72 virgins?
I thought you invaded my country, robbed my land, massacred my relatives and families, raped our women, melted down my friends by phosphorus?. Yoohoo !!! Hello !!! are you blind??? Got some dirt on your eyes which came out of a box having the label of "fascism" on it?
What are you patriot for? You believe that you owe to this country cuz it is your motherland and catered your needs, its your home sweet home. Guess what? Muslims do not hate their own countries/places either. They do realize and are thankful patriots too, in the same fashion they believe God is the supreme creator of their sweet home, so they be thankful to him as well.
Oh well, these Muslms dont matter, let me visit jihadwatch crap and Tarraaaaaaaaaaa !! Muslims are bunch of freaks terrorists, they just want blood , blood and more blood they are draculas, they kill people for laughing(?) they kill people for fun. Since they are terrorists, so they have no reason to kill.
And...there go you get brainwashed and come out on eslcafe with the nicks like mises, Axl and bigverne; Look at Islam from your s**t-hole narrow perspective; borrow some venom from "intellectual-looking brainfart" websites, and......spread it all over the place.
So, to the people who listen to these bunch of low lives: Listen to them or not, but better try to find what Islamic websites have to say as well. Fair enough?
Some of Islamic websites are:
http://www.sultan.org
http://islam.thetruecall.com/
http://www.islam-guide.com/
Learning trimmed, twisted and misquoted stuff from the malicious potty mouths is very easy, but unlearning it takes much of time and effort which I think not many people have motivation for.
CG. |
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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:08 am Post subject: |
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| samcheokguy wrote: |
| Christians may have a bad rap, but at least the founder of the sect wasn't a paedophile. |
There is no evidence that Mohammed a preferential sexual attraction to prepubertal children.
A single sex act with a child does not automatically make one a pedophile. In fact, the differential diagnosis of someone presenting with such a history is long and varied, with pedophilia just one among the many included diagnoses. |
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RJjr
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Location: Turning on a Lamp
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:15 am Post subject: |
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| bigverne wrote: |
| CyberGuy wrote: |
| Koveras wrote: |
| Spreading Hatred is the opposite of Celebrating Diversity. |
Thats correct. Alas, bigots choose the first one. |
A Muslim talking about celebrating diversity! Thanks for the laugh. |
"Islam accepts all people, regardless of what nationality or ethnicity you are. As a student, I read that, and I thought I understood. But it wasn't until I actually went to Mecca for the first time that I really understood. I thought I would be the only Chinese Muslim there. That couldn't have been further from the truth. There were Muslims of every color and ethnicity, from every country in the world." -- Captain James Yee, US Army |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:32 am Post subject: |
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| RJjr wrote: |
| bigverne wrote: |
| CyberGuy wrote: |
| Koveras wrote: |
| Spreading Hatred is the opposite of Celebrating Diversity. |
Thats correct. Alas, bigots choose the first one. |
A Muslim talking about celebrating diversity! Thanks for the laugh. |
"Islam accepts all people, regardless of what nationality or ethnicity you are. As a student, I read that, and I thought I understood. But it wasn't until I actually went to Mecca for the first time that I really understood. I thought I would be the only Chinese Muslim there. That couldn't have been further from the truth. There were Muslims of every color and ethnicity, from every country in the world." -- Captain James Yee, US Army |
And you think that Jame Yee is a reasonable source? Maybe google his name and then look for his comments about the Fort Dix jihad trial. Even if the guy wasn't a spy, as he was accused and incarcerated for, he is a sympathizer of radical jihad. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:47 am Post subject: |
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| bigverne wrote: |
Mohammed is regarded in Islam as the 'perfect man' uswa hasana, al-Insān al-Kāmil and his example is one to be emulated by all Muslims. Thus, his actions and deeds, as recorded in the Hadith, are not some kind of sideshow to 'true Islam', but central to it.
Hence, Mohammed's actions and deeds are the basis of much Islamic practice and law. That is a simple fact. I have already demonstrated this with regard to the Islamic punishment for apostasy. To say that his actions are 'incidental to Islam' is unbelievably ignorant. |
So calling me ignorant is supposed to make up for the fact that you've not yet come up with a credible link.
I knew you guys were milquetoast haters but this is weak. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:52 am Post subject: |
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| You could just google ual-Insān al-Kāmil. Google shows 15,200 English references. That ought to get you started. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:57 am Post subject: |
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It doesn't matter. Surely Muhammed is revered. But is he emulated when men have sex with 9-year-old girls?
Again, only three Islamic countries allow that. And not the enlightened ones.
Yes, Muhammad's marriage to a 9-year-old girl is incidental to Islam. Drown in your spite, gentlemen. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:00 am Post subject: |
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| I don't think I said it wasn't incidental. If is just one small turd in a big pile of crap. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:11 am Post subject: |
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| mises wrote: |
| I don't think I said it wasn't incidental. If is just one small turd in a big pile of crap. |
I agree. Focus on the big pile of crap. Seriously.
My thoughts on Islam are posted elsewhere on this forum. You guys can run a search if you'd like. |
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Kimbop
Joined: 31 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 11:06 am Post subject: |
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Cyberguy, I urge you to use your time more constructively. Drop the Koran, and opt instead to improve humanity by contributing something of value to the achievements of western civilisation: find a cure for cancer. Encourage science, math and literacy worldwide. Develop cold fission and alternative energy sources. Oh--wait-- THIS one you definitely DON'T want to accomplish since doing so would make your saudi-oil-funded jihad that much more difficult.
You could spend hours a day praying to mohammed and studying the koran, but what would that accomplish? I can see from your posts that you are angry and frustrated; the islamic cause is supported so LITTLE in the civilized world that the only way your religion can grow is by forcing your children to submit. A majority of the muslim whackos who move to the states embrace beer and bikinis. I urge you to send me a PM. I'd gladly meet with you to spread happiness into your life, and help you forget about this koran stuff. Yeah, yeah, you're muslim in order to honor your family and muslim roots, but I KNOW that I can convince you of the benefits of freedom and atheism. Send me a PM. |
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