Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Juregen]

I have a few false beginners who can put some sentences together and understand most of what I say, but, when I tried to see if they could break a simple sentence apart, they weren't really well aware of "Subject Verb Object" kind of thingy.

I always assumed that this is a basic no one should miss, being able to look at simple sentence, know what is what and be able to play around with it.

Is it necessary?

I think so, how about you?

[Cerriowen]

I think that if they can make sentences, even simple ones, and understand what is said, that they aren't really beginners. (more like elementary level)

As for grammar, I'd say it depends on the age. I don't think it's really all that important for people to learn it, in order to speak.

Also, I wouldn't say that learning "subject, verb, object" is important, but if they can group words, that's enough

Eg... write 4 words on the board... Run, eat, jump, hit and ask them for more words like those. When they give you a wrong answer ... make a new catigory... "Sweet, pretty, funny, hot" and keep having them group the words together. They don't need to know what they are though, just be able to identify similar words.

This is my not-so-humble opinion

[Juregen]

Nah that is already a good approach thx,

BTW age is around 8 years old.

It's just weird to me that I can have a conversation with them but they have no idea of the underlying structure of very simple sentences

[Straphanger]

This is going to sound like a huge troll, but the reason they don't know simple grammar is because (if they're advanced enough to have a conversation) either the hakwon never taught it or the foreign teacher wasn't a teacher, he was an engineer in an elbow-patch coat. I'm teaching sentence structure right now. We start with subject-verb-object. Noun, Verb, Adjective, Adverb, Article.

We're starting over, in English this time.

[HapKi]

If they are 8 years old, I would not call them false beginners.
They probably have not even been taught their first language's structures and rules yet (but can speak Korean well enough), so why do it with their second language.
Teaching about the language is very different from students speaking the language. Any SLA theory will show that.

Just my opinion, something to think about, my 2 cents, etc..

[Insidejohnmalkovich]

I teach structure rather than grammar. I may call it grammar sometimes, but I actually do not teach grammar.

What I mean is this: I do not teach grammatical jargon like noun, verb, adjective; subject, object, indirect object; prepositions, conjunctions, et cetera. Now I have a Masters in History, and I can parse all the parts of speech and decline a Latin noun in its various cases or conjugate a French verb in its various tenses, but I see no need to burden little children with what I did not comprehend well until university.

I simply teach the children to be careful and aware of the parts that make up a sentence and how to make a sentence. But we do not name those parts.

Think about it: we learned how to make more and more difficult sentences, but we did not actually study grammar until middle school and most of us did not understand grammatical terminology until we studied a foreign language in university. (Not a conversational one like French in Canada or Spanish in America.)

So my children understand that a cat and a chair and darkness are things. And they get used to using a or the or some or nothing. They know that doing is now, do is any time and did is before.

Now it is true that at a certain level of writing I need to teach grammar, but most of my students are some ways from that. Besides, I like to see how much I can get them to understand without burdening them with jargon. I figure when another teacher startes teaching grammar, their basic structure will be so good that the grammar will seem common sense.

[losing_touch]

I taught my older elementary kids some really basic grammar. I wouldn't know what else to call the parts of speech, so they get the name thrown in. I got really irritated when they couldn't put a sentence together, so I stopped the show and went back to the drawing board with them. They can now construct paragraphs with simple sentences, and this pleases me!

[D.D.]

[Straphanger]

[Privateer]

[DCJames]

[oldfatfarang]

[yawarakaijin]

[poet13]

"It's just weird to me that I can have a conversation with them but they have no idea of the underlying structure of very simple sentences"

Woah....for a second there, I thought you were talking about North American college students.

[Juregen]

Thx for the feedback and the different points of view.