|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
dmbfan
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
|
 Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 12:01 am Post subject: Kids Gone Wild |
 |
|
Once again, Bill sums it up.
| Quote: |
Kids Gone Wild
By Bill O'Reilly for BillOReilly.com
Thursday, April 16, 2009
These are dark days for traditional Americans-folks who believe that the Judeo-Christian principles of right and wrong should be considered when making public policy. The other day, former "Focus on the Family" chief Dr. James Dobson actually told his crew that the culture war was being lost in America. And it is hard to argue with Dobson's opinion.
All over the USA, secular-progressives are on the move, promoting gay marriage, legalized drugs, unfettered abortion, and attacking almost all judgments on personal behavior. And nowhere is the movement more intense than in the nation's most liberal state: Vermont.
The legislature in the Green Mountain State recently voted to legalize gay marriage, overriding the veto of Governor Jim Douglas. Vermont is the first state to actually legislate in favor of homosexual nuptials, as Massachusetts, Connecticut, and Iowa all had gay marriage imposed on the citizenry by judges.
It is worth noting that Vermont is one of the few states that voted down Jessica's Law, the tough mandatory prison sentence legislation against child sexual predators. An investigation into Vermont's criminal justice apparatus reveals the state embraces "restorative justice," whereby criminals often receive "holistic" treatment as part of their sentence for even heinous crimes like child rape. The goal is not so much to punish the offender, but to "restore" him or her to their rightful place in society. That is a secular-progressive hallmark.
While Vermont is coddling child predators, it is also sending a message to kids: Hey, you can do pretty much what you want. Somewhat incredibly, the Vermont senate has passed a bill decriminalizing consensual "sexting." That is the process by which children send sexual pictures of themselves to other children using cell phones or computers. The proposed Vermont law says that 13- to 18-year-olds will be allowed to do that, but not distribute the photos to more than one person or an adult.
Supporters of the sexting law say it's necessary so that teenagers will not be prosecuted as sexual offenders and have their lives ruined. There is some validity to that, as dopey kids do dopey things. However, the sane solution would be to categorize sexting as a misdemeanor breach of the peace, thus sending a message that it is unacceptable for kids to send other kids sexual images.
But secular-progressives are loathe to make that judgment. Remember, these are the same people who believe a girl has the right to an abortion without telling her parents. So if a kid can undergo a major life altering operation (especially for the fetus), why should it be a big deal to do a little sexting?
With a liberal federal government and media, there is little opposition being voiced to what is happening in Vermont and other secular-progressive enclaves. Culture war issues have been forced to the back room by the awful economy, and the S-P's are taking full advantage. If American children are legally allowed to send explicit pictures of themselves to other kids, then say goodbye to traditional boundaries of behavior.
The slippery slope is here |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ubermenzch
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
Location: bundang, south korea
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 12:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
| haha you pregnant women best watch out! secular progressives are apparently now "promoting... unfettered abortion". i paraphrase gore vidal when i warn that soon we will all be required to do our part by waking up at dawn to commit abortions all day long under the red flag. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mole
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Act III
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 12:35 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Just don't let kids exchange pix of these procedures via sexting txt msg. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JMO
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Location: Daegu
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 2:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
mmm well I have the same questions as before..although some are worded differently.
If you have teenager dmbfan and they did do this, even after you told them it was completely unacceptable, what would you do? Call the police?
Secondly why does the state have to give these kids boundaries in this area? Why not the parents?
Thirdly and most importantly, are you telling me that until you reached the age of 18 you didn't have sex, get a blow job or hand job from a girl your own age? I doubt that you didn't. Are these worse offenses than sexting?
Girls and boys have managed to appropriate every new communication technology to sexual ends since forever. That is traditional behavior. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| With a liberal federal government and media, there is little opposition being voiced to what is happening in Vermont and other secular-progressive enclaves. |
Sounds like old Bill is nostalgic for a good old conservative federal government to insert itself into people's sex lives. That's so much more acceptable than allowing states freedom to make their own sex laws. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kikomom
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: them thar hills--Penna, USA--Zippy is my kid, the teacher in ROK. You can call me Kiko
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 5:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
"unfettered abortion" -- That's the phrase that jumped out at me too. Is he saying we don't have FETTERED abortion? He just wants more fettering. And what becomes of the off-spring when abortion becomes so difficult that kids keep having kids, grandparents pay the price of raising both. Or they can always turn them over to the good Catholic charities to adopt out?
Really, abortion is an agonizing experience for those choosing to go the fettered route. For the sexters, the unfettered variety is more of an out to help start their life not quite fresh, but at least UNFETTERED. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 5:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ubermenzch wrote: |
| haha you pregnant women best watch out! secular progressives are apparently now "promoting... unfettered abortion". i paraphrase gore vidal when i warn that soon we will all be required to do our part by waking up at dawn to commit abortions all day long under the red flag. |
LOL Bloody funny! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dmbfan
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 7:40 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| mmm well I have the same questions as before..although some are worded differently. |
OK.
| Quote: |
| If you have teenager dmbfan and they did do this, even after you told them it was completely unacceptable, what would you do? Call the police? |
It's not a matter of what I would do. It is a matter of social values.
| Quote: |
| Secondly why does the state have to give these kids boundaries in this area? Why not the parents? |
Well, you give teenagers an inch...and they will take a foot. Really, lets look back into the past. Fifty years ago.......
1. Kids respected (or at least acted like it) their parents.
2. The divorce rate was much lower then it is today.
3. Family values, integrity, love of country and sacrifice were common values.
4. Kids did what their teachers told them, at school......because their were consequences.
5. Parents were allowed to discipline their kids without having the fear of child services being called in for a spanking.
6. Teen birth rates were not common....eventhough kids were having sex, it was very hush hush (yes, kids have been finding ways to break boundaries for ever...I'll give you that).
| Quote: |
| Thirdly and most importantly, are you telling me that until you reached the age of 18 you didn't have sex, get a blow job or hand job from a girl your own age? I doubt that you didn't. Are these worse offenses than sexting? |
I don't recall making that claim. So, don't point the finger and assume other behavrior justifies current behavior. In regards to being worse offense then sexting.....the point it, is that these sexting photos are in public view. No, doing the dirty deed on the couch while the parents are away, out of the public eye, does not justify the action.
| Quote: |
Girls and boys have managed to appropriate every new communication technology to sexual ends since forever. That is traditional
behavior. |
Yes, we already agreed on that first point. But, saying that it is "traditional behavior", saying it applies to conversatives is crap. You are using that only to say that sex, pornography, disrespect are traditional values. Not so........it seems more along the far left side of thought.
dmbfan |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 8:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I'd be interested to know how Vermont's youth crime rate compares to other states.
Oh wait, let me google it ...
| Quote: |
| Vermont has the lowest juvenile arrest rate in the United States.12 |
12 Vermont Task Force on School Violence, Preventing and Responding to School Disruption and Violence, Department of Education, June 22, 1998 citing paper by Peggy Miller, Planning Division, Agency of Human Services, citing Juvenile Crime Rankings by State, 1997.
http://www.vtnea.org/vio-2.htm
While the stats are 10 years old, it still sure says something. I wonder how conservative states with great Christian, family values like Texas do in comparison to Vermont. Oh well, don't let facts get in the way of rhetoric when dealing with American conservatives. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dmbfan
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 8:23 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
I'd be interested to know how Vermont's youth crime rate compares to other states.
Oh wait, let me google it ...
Quote:
Vermont has the lowest juvenile arrest rate in the United States.12
12 Vermont Task Force on School Violence, Preventing and Responding to School Disruption and Violence, Department of Education, June 22, 1998 citing paper by Peggy Miller, Planning Division, Agency of Human Services, citing Juvenile Crime Rankings by State, 1997.
http://www.vtnea.org/vio-2.htm
While the stats are 10 years old, it still sure says something. I wonder how conservative states with great Christian, family values like Texas do in comparison to Vermont. Oh well, don't let facts get in the way of rhetoric when dealing with American conservatives. |
OH, so it's a Christian thing? Funny, these days it is acceptable to slander Christians about anything/everything but heavan forbid we slander the Muslims/far left, etc.
Anyway, thats beside the point.
You forgot to mention the populiation of Vermont....AND... you forgot to mention their judicial system, laws and what the state considers a crime.
I'm wondering why Vermont does not have Jessica's Law?
dmbfan |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DorkothyParker
Joined: 11 Apr 2009
Location: Jeju
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
It shouldn't be a crime for stupid horny kids to send each other dirty pictures. I can't help but find conservative values confusing. First you want the government out of your life, then you argue that it's the government's responsibility to punish your kids for sexual experimentation. Please make up your mind! Parents should be the ones parenting their children IMO. To me, "sexting" sounds like a very simple problem to fix.
BTW, this is the general "you" and not necessarily anyone who is reading this or has posted before me.
I am younger and was raised in a VERY unrestricted household. Based on my experiences, and what I would do if I decided to breed, responsibility and trust are what build character in youth, not spankings and random rules. The kids I know who got in the worst trouble often came from the sternest households. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dmbfan
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 10:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| I am younger and was raised in a VERY unrestricted household. Based on my experiences, and what I would do if I decided to breed, responsibility and trust are what build character in youth, not spankings and random rules. The kids I know who got in the worst trouble often came from the sternest households. |
Well, even a blind carrot finds a rabbit once in a while.
(no disrespect intended).
I was never in favor of having teenage children being convicted as sexual predetors for sexting.
I do agree that good parenting is the major factor. Yet, there need to be guidlines and consequences outside the home environment.
How are will things keep going? Really, thats the question.
dmbfan |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 10:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| dmbfan wrote: |
| I was never in favor of having teenage children being convicted as sexual predetors for sexting. |
| Hater Depot wrote: |
| dmbfan wrote: |
| Kids need boundaries.....period. |
And the state has to provide them, along with criminal histories and sex offender registration? |
| dmbfan wrote: |
| Yes.....kids need boundaries. Parents can't watch their CHILDREN 24/7. |
| JMO wrote: |
I'm actually curious.
If you have teenager dmbfan and they did do this, even after you told them it was completely unacceptable, what would you do? Call the police?
Secondly why does the state have to give these kids boundaries in this area? Why not the parents?
Thirdly, what should the punishment be for this crime?
Fourthly, teenage girls are having sex with teenage boys. I lost my virginity when I was 16 to a girl of the same age. Most of my friends had already lost theirs. Don't you think you are ignoring this in your outrage over sexting?
Fifthly, why do you feel the need to write period when it is right there at the end of the sentence.....question mark. |
Quotes are from the Take Vermont.....please. thread. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dmbfan
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 10:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
dmbfan wrote:
I was never in favor of having teenage children being convicted as sexual predetors for sexting.
Hater Depot wrote:
dmbfan wrote:
Kids need boundaries.....period.
And the state has to provide them, along with criminal histories and sex offender registration?
dmbfan wrote:
Yes.....kids need boundaries. Parents can't watch their CHILDREN 24/7.
JMO wrote:
I'm actually curious.
If you have teenager dmbfan and they did do this, even after you told them it was completely unacceptable, what would you do? Call the police?
Secondly why does the state have to give these kids boundaries in this area? Why not the parents?
Thirdly, what should the punishment be for this crime?
Fourthly, teenage girls are having sex with teenage boys. I lost my virginity when I was 16 to a girl of the same age. Most of my friends had already lost theirs. Don't you think you are ignoring this in your outrage over sexting?
Fifthly, why do you feel the need to write period when it is right there at the end of the sentence.....question mark.
Quotes are from the Take Vermont.....please. thread. |
We all know that you are using what I posted out of context.
It is clear that I have not even defined in what I think are "boundaries".
You've also edited out quite a bit of other dialouge so that it LOOKS like it supports what ever arugement you may have......by the way, what IS your take on all this? But that is fine............that is what I expect of you.
As I said, before....kids need boundaries.
After all , we do have stop lights for a reason.
dmbfan |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JMO
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Location: Daegu
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:09 am Post subject: |
|
|
| dmbfan wrote: |
It's not a matter of what I would do. It is a matter of social values.
|
If my child vandalized a building they deserve punishment from the state, I would turn them into the owner. I find a sext message on my child's phone, I'' be pissed but it wouldn't go outside the house. That is an easy gut check to see if something is a crime or not.
| Quote: |
Well, you give teenagers an inch...and they will take a foot. Really, lets look back into the past. Fifty years ago.......
1. Kids respected (or at least acted like it) their parents.
2. The divorce rate was much lower then it is today.
3. Family values, integrity, love of country and sacrifice were common values.
4. Kids did what their teachers told them, at school......because their were consequences.
5. Parents were allowed to discipline their kids without having the fear of child services being called in for a spanking.
6. Teen birth rates were not common....eventhough kids were having sex, it was very hush hush (yes, kids have been finding ways to break boundaries for ever...I'll give you that).
|
1. How do you know?
2. Irrelevant.
3 How do you know? How did you quantify the difference between these values then and now?
4. You want corporal punishment brought back? My dad and mom were teenagers 50 years ago, they would not agree.
5. Not sure how this is connected. I'm pretty sure if kids had phones back when spanking was allowed, they'd be sending dirty pics.
6.The latest info on teen birth rates i could get was 2006 for the states. Vermont has half the national average. More conservative states(states that tend to vote republican) are generally higher.
| Quote: |
In regards to being worse offense then sexting.....the point it, is that these sexting photos are in public view. No, doing the dirty deed on the couch while the parents are away, out of the public eye, does not justify the action. |
A sext message is a private message. It is not in the public view. If the person who is sent the message, then puts it on a website then I'm sure there is a law that applies to that not connected to the initial act of taking the pic and sending it to your girlfriend/boyfriend.
| Quote: |
| Yes, we already agreed on that first point. But, saying that it is "traditional behavior", saying it applies to conversatives is crap. You are using that only to say that sex, pornography, disrespect are traditional values. Not so........it seems more along the far left side of thought. |
I don't really understand your point here. Sexual experimentation in conjunction with new tech is traditional in the sense that it has always existed. The 'traditional' values you talk about seem to be ideals that probably have never really existed.
Let's face it, I'm sure every generation has said 'Kids have gone wild'. These same kids that are sexting will say the same thing when they grow up and forget all about the shenanigans they got up to.
http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparemaptable.jsp?ind=37&cat=2 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
