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yawarakaijin
Joined: 08 Aug 2006
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 Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2009 6:24 pm Post subject: So the decriminalization of drugs does work. |
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I have to admit that I had no idea that Portugal had actually decriminalized drug use. It appears from this study that a western nation has actually gone this routhe and it seems to bepaying off.
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html
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| Although its capital is notorious among stoners and college kids for marijuana haze�filled "coffee shops," Holland has never actually legalized cannabis � the Dutch simply don't enforce their laws against the shops. The correct answer is Portugal, which in 2001 became the first European country to officially abolish all criminal penalties for personal possession of drugs, including marijuana, cocaine, heroin and methamphetamine. |
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| The Cato paper reports that between 2001 and 2006 in Portugal, rates of lifetime use of any illegal drug among seventh through ninth graders fell from 14.1% to 10.6%; drug use in older teens also declined. Lifetime heroin use among 16-to-18-year-olds fell from 2.5% to 1.8% (although there was a slight increase in marijuana use in that age group). New HIV infections in drug users fell by 17% between 1999 and 2003, and deaths related to heroin and similar drugs were cut by more than half. In addition, the number of people on methadone and buprenorphine treatment for drug addiction rose to 14,877 from 6,040, after decriminalization, and money saved on enforcement allowed for increased funding of drug-free treatment as well. |
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Interested
Joined: 10 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2009 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Making them illegal pushes up their market value. By making them legal, the price drops, thereby making them less lucrative to peddle. Fewer pushers around for introducing or 'marketing' them to new clients. |
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Robot_Teacher
Joined: 18 Feb 2009
Location: Robotting Around the World
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| Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2009 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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| When alcohol was illegal during prohibition, people wanted it more and it was destructive to society to just criminalize users. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:46 am Post subject: |
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| Robot_Teacher wrote: |
| When alcohol was illegal during prohibition, people wanted it more and it was destructive to society to just criminalize users. |
I used to be against decriminalization, but I see that it would take out the sails out of the ships of the gangs, so to speak and not disproportionately punish minorities and give people records for life for doing nothing that harms anyone per se. |
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Pluto
Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:23 am Post subject: |
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Glenn Greenwald, who normally writes for Salon, put this entire study together on behalf of those cantankerous old libertarians over at Cato. I've only read the executive summary, but the whole thing is 28 pages (plus a 6 page bibliography) replete with all the data, charts and graphs that your heart can handle.
whole thing here
For those of you who don't know who Glenn Grenwald is, he is probably one of the better known advocates of civil liberties in the US. For those of you interested in civil liberties, I suggest you also check out Radley Balko 's site.
Last edited by Pluto on Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:49 am; edited 1 time in total |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:42 am Post subject: |
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Greenwald is with Salon..
Anyways.. The declines in degenerate behaviour is stark given the bed of dysfunction that the society rested upon at the time of decriminalization, from the policy of criminalization. As the years and decades pass and the impact of criminalization is further in the past, the dysfunction will decrease more and more. |
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Pluto
Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:50 am Post subject: |
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| ^You're right, he is with Salon. Sorry, Didn't mean to confuse anyone. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:59 am Post subject: |
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| He's often on Cspan. If you search youtube you should be able to find some of his appearances. |
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Pluto
Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri May 01, 2009 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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Glenn Grennwald talking about Portugal with Reason.
Decriminalize Drugs(Video 9min15sec) |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Mon May 04, 2009 7:43 am Post subject: |
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From:
http://skepticaltexascpa.blogspot.com/2009/05/our-failed-drug-war.html
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"But are US vital interests more threatened by what happens in Anbar or Helmand than in the war raging along our southern border? ... For this is where the fate of our republic will be decided, as the fate of Europe will be decided by the millions streaming north from the Maghreb and the Middle East, sub-Sahara and South Asia. ...
Add a collapsing global economy to a losing war with drug cartels, and Mexico is at grave risk of becoming a failed state, a narco-state, with a 2,000-mile border with the [US]. How does one win a drug war when millions of Americans who use recreational drugs are financing the cartels bribing, murdering and beheading to win the war and keep self-indulgent Americans supplied with drugs? There are two sure ways to end this war swiftly: Milton's way and Mao's way. Mao Zedong's communists killed users and suppliers alike, as social parasites. Milton Friedman's way is to decriminalize drugs and call of the war. ...
Americans are never going to adopt the Maoist solution. ... Which is the greater evil? Legalized narcotics for America's young or a failed state of 110 million on our southern border", Pat Buchanan (PB), 6 March 2009 at |
http://www.vdare.com/buchanan/090305_mexico.htm.
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"Conservatives tend to assume that, unlike dirty, treasonous liberals, they are on the side of truth, justice, liberty and the American way. This is not without reason, as most of the time, they are. However, for nearly 30 years, conservatives have been guilty of one of the greatest abuses of American liberties in American history, and have actively abetted the growth of central government by their thoughtless support for the war on drugs. ... There is nothing--absolutely nothing--conservative about the war on drugs. ... And, as everyone knows, the "coca' in Coca-Cola refers to the extract coca leaf that was once an ingredient in the popular drink. Coca-Cola was not entirely cocaine-free until 1929. ...
Advocates for the drug war often hypothesize nightmare scenarios where the legalization of drugs will lead to chaos and toal social breakdown, constructing fantasies about legions of chemically addled criminals preying upon the helpless citizenry while in search of their next high. But, as has been seen in Colombia and more recently in Mexico, it is actually the illegalization of drugs that causes social devastation, as the drug war's efforts to interdict supply only increases the price of drugs and therefore the profit of the criminal gangs willing to trade in them. ... Americans should have learned their lesson from prohibition. ...
Thus, I was encouraged to read Pat Buchanan's recent article on WorldNetDaily, in which one of America's leading conservatives finally recognized the stark choice that so many conservatives have sought to avoid facing for three decades. ... The fact that the Obama administration is now citing Mexico's narco war as an excuse to limit Second Amendment rights should suffice to prove to conservatives that the time has come to end the war on drugs. Yes, Mr, Buchanan, America must raise the white flag in the drug war", Vox Day, 9 March 2009, at: |
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?pageId=91102.
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Welcome aboard PB, you're just 40 years late. America can't adopt Mao's solution? Why? With over 200 million firearms in the US, it will be open season on cops. Millions of Americans will join the Mexican cartels. Few if any drug salesmen will be taken alive by policemen if each expects to be executed. The drug war is over.
I've said this for over 40 years. We passed the Harrison Act (HA) in 1914. Was every American a drug addict in 1914? The nightmare scenarios are a cover for religious influence. Drugs, like demon rum should be outlawed. Ask Carrie Nation. Many of the same people, like the Women's Christian Temperance Union pushed the HA. The US's highest percentage of opiate addicts was in 1865, following the Civil War. Think about why. Some of our drug war resulted from anti-Chinese animus. Those of you old enough to remember Paladin on television, 1957-63, may remember where "Hey Boy" was warned not to go: his uncle's opium den! San Francsico had opium dens in 1875? Yes. |
Interesting.. The right making a choice between their guns and their drug war?
Anyways, I feel confident that we're in new territory here. More and more people, from across the political spectrum, are making noise about decriminalization. |
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