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Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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TheChickenLover
Joined: 17 Dec 2007
Location: The Chicken Coop
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 Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 6:44 am Post subject: The F Visa Social Network thread (AFEK) Moderated |
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The organization will consist of people who reside in Korea on F-class visa's only at the beginning. This organization needs a base of people who live here, have roots here, are able to utilize years of experience and most importantly will be staying here for a long time to come.
I will be calling this organization AFEK - for "Association of F-class Expatriates within Korea"
The goal of this organization will be simple.
- to meet and greet and get to know the real movers and shakers in this country
- to network amongst ourselves
- to provide a social atmosphere where people can get away and potentially make solid friendships
- a support structure for people who may need help and those who are in the greatest position to provide is possible
- No money will be involved. This will be a purely internet based community with (I hope) monthly meetings in various parts of the country.
For most of us who have cars, it can be a nice chance to get to see a different part of the country since we may be working near there someday. It would be nice to know a few people wherever we go.
Question: How will this start?
It's going to start right here with this posting. You can send me a private email to me here or my email at [email protected] (I'll be sure to delete buymybook's hate mails).
I don't want 500 short term members (though that may happen after awhile). I want a solid group of long term high quality people who can appreciate each other's accomplishments and life on this tiny peninsula.
Sincerely,
Chicken
 
Last edited by TheChickenLover on Mon May 04, 2009 7:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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T-J
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Seoul EunpyungGu Yeonsinnae
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 7:12 am Post subject: |
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| Sign me up. |
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The Grumpy Senator
Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Location: Up and down the 6 line
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 7:33 am Post subject: |
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| I may be willing to help out. Not sure what I can do other than support. Not a lot of free time. |
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John_ESL_White
Joined: 12 Nov 2008
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 9:58 am Post subject: |
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I'm in. register www.afek.org
hurry |
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Savant
Joined: 25 May 2007
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| The organization will consist of people who reside in Korea on F-class visa's only at the beginning. This organization needs a base of people who live here, have roots here, are able to utilize years of experience and most importantly will be staying here for a long time to come. |
Some E-2 holders on this forum meet your "joining" criteria. Will you accept them even if they don't have F-Class visa status? |
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Chamchiman
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Location: Digging the Grave
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 2:05 pm Post subject: |
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Wife, family, career, house, Korean relatives to support... I've jumped into Korea with both feet, so I welcome an association like this one.
Good to see you back ChickenLover. |
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cdninkorea
Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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I have some questions about this new organization:
1) It's only for F class visa holders. Does this include gyopos, on F4 visas, or is it only F2 and F5?
2) Many people holding F class visas are not teachers; business owners, office workers, farmers (Vietnamese brides), etc. Can they join too?
What I'm getting at is: is this group for F class visa teachers, or F visa holders? |
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saw6436
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon, ROK
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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| I'll join in. |
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TheChickenLover
Joined: 17 Dec 2007
Location: The Chicken Coop
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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| cdninkorea wrote: |
I have some questions about this new organization:
1) It's only for F class visa holders. Does this include gyopos, on F4 visas, or is it only F2 and F5?
2) Many people holding F class visas are not teachers; business owners, office workers, farmers (Vietnamese brides), etc. Can they join too?
What I'm getting at is: is this group for F class visa teachers, or F visa holders? |
Since this is not a formally registered organization that is created to generate income for the higher ups, it is more a social one, the comments about me 'excluding' others on this board are completely within our bounds. In reality, anyone can create a personal club (such as the "Swell Fella's Club") and if we won't want someone such as buymybook to force himself into it..then we don't have to.
To answer this more clearly to (1), this is an Expatriate club. Teaching is not a precondition, but having an F-class visa is. Even if you're no longer teaching but would like to keep in touch with people who still are or would like to network, you're more than welcome to join the discussions and future meetings and functions. Remember, this is a organization (club) that is for people who LIVE here. If buymybook decides to crash a meeting claiming discrimination, we can simply send him away or if he persists, have someone remove him. By being this way, we can avoid any limitations or restrictions that are imposed on formal organizations. Besides, we are not looking for publicity, we're just trying to get people who live here in contact with one another for both a social and professional enjoyment.
For (2), if an F4 visa holder is a foreign national, they are indeed themselves expatriates. They are welcome to join the discussion, but keep in mind that I'm not forcing people to make friends, if they come off in a very negative way that makes people want to avoid them, like in most cases, what most likely happens is they never get their calls answered and their networking opportunities will fall off.
Chicken |
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TheChickenLover
Joined: 17 Dec 2007
Location: The Chicken Coop
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Rumple wrote: |
| You can't exclude people on the basis of national origin, according to Korean anti-discrimination laws (which saying "F-series only") does. Good luck with the impending lawsuit. |
Watch me. Better yet, go complain to the police and say that I won't let you in our social club.
Let me know how that goes.
Chicken |
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lifeinkorea
Joined: 24 Jan 2009
Location: somewhere in China
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 6:51 pm Post subject: |
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| What do you hope to achieve by splitting groups up like this (only F visas)? Will it work? |
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T-J
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Seoul EunpyungGu Yeonsinnae
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TheChickenLover
Joined: 17 Dec 2007
Location: The Chicken Coop
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 8:52 pm Post subject: |
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| lifeinkorea wrote: |
| TheChickenLover wrote: |
| lifeinkorea wrote: |
| What do you hope to achieve by splitting groups up like this (only F visas)? Will it work? |
This is NOT only a teaching group but an EXPATRIATE group. As I earlier mentioned, people who are not teaching are also welcome to join us if they wish.
Unlike ATEK, AFEK requires a STABLE and MATURE base before we move onwards. F-class visa holders are stable, have roots and are generally more reliable and have a vested interest than E-visa holders.
This is not a transient social group. If you are a transient worker here for a year or two, join ATEK.
Chicken |
The numbers don't add up. It doesn't matter to me, I am not leading this lunacy. You have decided to exclude E-2 users who have to be in Korea a while before they become F visa holders.
So, what that does is keep them away from the solution your "club" is set up to address until they become F visa holders. Another person just has to do the same as you are doing but open the doors to E2 visa holders and they get a larger support group.
You will end up with a small clique (like back in high school) feeling superior over the rest because you are "in the club".
This will not be seen in the upcoming months. No one will realize this. It will appear when 1,000 member groups are being compared. This might take a few years to see the effects.
Waste away your time if you want. It will be funny to watch what will happen when the F visa clan needs more support and have to delegate down the chain of command. Your whole set up will be organized with the F visa holders, but how will you incorporate E2 visa holders when you need them?
And on a final note, just because people have an E2 visa doesn't make them transient. It just means they haven't been in Korea long enough. They don't have a chip on their shoulder like the F visa holders do who form groups restricting others from joining, LOL.
Let's watch the childish games as they are played out E2 visa holders.
| Quote: |
| more reliable and have a vested interest than E-visa holders. |
Actually, E2 visa holders who intend to get an F visa are your best bet. They will be the most likely to be "stable" and "mature" if there is a group. I think it is utter nonsense though to put one group above another. I stayed in Japan for 4 years. That doesn't make me more mature than someone who only went there 1 year. In fact, spending too much time dumbs you down. You don't look for a different tomorrow because it's the same old same old. You have spun the gerbil cage more than the E2 visa holder. Whooptee doo!!!
Oh well, I intended to stop posting paragraphs ago. Have fun. Hope you get what you are looking for whether it be dominance, retribution, or just mere attention. |
Again you've missed my point with a very big lens. This is a social networking organization. We're not here to change the laws of the country (though many of us have the right to vote), we are not here to put down E-class visa holders (many of them are decent folk).
What we are going to become is a social network of people who have settled in Korea. We will all have common ties (F-visa) which is symbolic of the committment each of us have made to this country. We are here to share ideas, thoughts, and may even one day lobby the gov't legally since a good number of us ARE registered voters and hence constituents of gov't officials.
I'm sorry you feel excluded, but I'm more interested in meeting and getting to know people who've decided to make Korea their home and avoid the never ending noob questions of E-class visa holders. We are NOT like you. We live here. We work here. We have family here. This is not an AFEK vs ATEK group. ATEK has no impact on our lives. ATEK has no legal standing to change the laws. AFEK's registered voters DO have that right.
Can you see the difference?
Either way, I'd rather have 50 or 200 F-class visa holders than 1000 E-class visa's. Those who wish to join are free to do so with no money involved and no demands whatsoever.
Chicken |
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lifeinkorea
Joined: 24 Jan 2009
Location: somewhere in China
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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| What we are going to become is a social network of people who have settled in Korea. |
"3: of or relating to human society, the interaction of the individual and the group, or the welfare of human beings as members of society <social institutions>"
It ceases to be a social network when you exclude certain groups because you can't even have social classes when you don't all play a part. I haven't missed the point of your intentions here, as we will see in the next part of your post.
| Quote: |
| We are here to share ideas, thoughts, and may even one day lobby the gov't legally since a good number of us ARE registered voters and hence constituents of gov't officials. |
So, it's not just a group intended to meet for tea and crumpets and share "common ties". There is a set underlying agenda to change things which, with great certainty, will affect E2 visa holders also.
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| We are NOT like you. |
A stranger telling me I am not like them. You are a stranger to me, I am a stranger to you. How could you possibly know how different or how much the same we are?
That whole "we are not like you" crap is nothing more than cultish lingo.
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| ATEK has no legal standing to change the laws. AFEK's registered voters DO have that right. |
Which is why it would be nice to get the feedback of E2 visa holders, so when F visa holders do do things which affect E2 visa holders they can make a more informed decision. Only looking out for F visa holders doesn't help the society of teachers as a whole, and as a network. This was your original slant on this in your post to make a network. Nothing could be further from making that a reality when you exclude groups from that social network.
In fact, what you are doing is rewarding the Korean system of doing things which treats E2 visa holders poorly and gives concessions to F visa holders. You are telling the Korean government that they are doing the right thing.
| Quote: |
| Those who wish to join are free to do so with no money involved and no demands whatsoever. |
EVERYTHING COSTS MONEY!!! Apparently, you haven't thought this out beyond the "Let's form a club and exclude the girls (E2 holders) from entering our treehouse" stage. |
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TheChickenLover
Joined: 17 Dec 2007
Location: The Chicken Coop
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| Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 9:40 pm Post subject: |
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Not really lifeinkorea. You've made it clear that you are against what I am doing and that is fine. You are well within your rights to simply not participate in the formation of this new group.
You are also welcome to go to the local police station and complain that you are not getting your way (this feels like deja vu).
Either way, this group is for F-visa holders. E-visa holders are not an issue with us. Anything we do will be for those who are residents here, not transient workers.
Chicken |
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