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Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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Scouse Mouse
Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Location: Cloud #9
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 Posted: Thu May 14, 2009 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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I made this site after consulting with Chicken: http://www.afek.info
There are sign-up instructions in place. Some checks are necessary, and I tried to make sure that they were as painless as possible, allowing for anonymity whilst still verifying credentials.
The site is little more than a forum and PM system at the moment, as I wanted to wait for member input before stamping all over it. Once you sign-up, you can access the forums and make any requests you want.
This is a site for networking and discussion, NOT a political movement.
If you have any questions about joining, please email [email protected]
Any questions about E-2 visa holders joining will be ignored. This is a site for F-Visa holders, and I expect that the manual set-up of accounts will take enough of time, without having to field unrelated questions. |
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polonius
Joined: 05 Jun 2004
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| Posted: Thu May 14, 2009 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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| My son has an F-3, can he join on my behalf? He is 19 months old. My roots are long here, having lived here for 7 years, married in Korea, child born in Korea. Married a Canadian, so I can't get the F series. |
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chrisbacke
Joined: 09 Jan 2008
Location: Seoul and Bangkok
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 2:53 am Post subject: |
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At first glance, I did a double take. Here we go about an exclusionary group whose only goal was to sound better / cooler than someone else. At first.
And yet, the more I think about the points that have been raised (which are not only put together and well-written, but seemingly done in a reasonably cordial way), yeah. On some level, a person living in Korea that has made the country their home DOES have different needs than a teacher who needs some legal protection to ensure they get what has been promised them. Talks of marriage, children, finances, in-laws, and quite a few other topics (hat tip to ruraljuror) aren't nearly as relevant to the teacher on an E-2 who's trying to learn the language, travel around the country, and learn something more about the culture.
As they currently exist, I'm not eligible for entry, much like I wouldn't be eligible to join a Porsche club if the requirement was to own a Porsche. Since the two groups both sound fairly delineated and membership carefully defined, I would presume there's room for both groups to peacefully co-exist. We do live in different worlds, even if we are all Korean expats.
Chicken, may your group go well. |
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pocariboy73
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 3:27 am Post subject: |
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| chrisbacke wrote: |
At first glance, I did a double take. Here we go about an exclusionary group whose only goal was to sound better / cooler than someone else. At first.
And yet, the more I think about the points that have been raised (which are not only put together and well-written, but seemingly done in a reasonably cordial way), yeah. On some level, a person living in Korea that has made the country their home DOES have different needs than a teacher who needs some legal protection to ensure they get what has been promised them. Talks of marriage, children, finances, in-laws, and quite a few other topics (hat tip to ruraljuror) aren't nearly as relevant to the teacher on an E-2 who's trying to learn the language, travel around the country, and learn something more about the culture.
As they currently exist, I'm not eligible for entry, much like I wouldn't be eligible to join a Porsche club if the requirement was to own a Porsche. Since the two groups both sound fairly delineated and membership carefully defined, I would presume there's room for both groups to peacefully co-exist. We do live in different worlds, even if we are all Korean expats.
Chicken, may your group go well. |
As long as ATEK doesn't propose to throw the F visa holders under the bus AGAIN to further their own agenda, as they did with the foolishly thought-out "Equal Checks For All Foreigners" campaign, then I, too, think we can "peacefully co-exist."
Cheers... |
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kprrok
Joined: 06 Apr 2004
Location: KC
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 3:51 am Post subject: |
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This is a 100% serious, honest, no BS post...
Can I join this group and still be a member of ATEK?
I think ATEK has its positive points (not perfect) and AFEK could also be good. I don't agree with what some people did in the ATEK thread to Tony, but I still feel that I would like to be a part of AFEK.
I've got my F5 and can prove it, so that's not an issue. Basically, will you admit someone to your group who is opposed to you on the ATEK issue? |
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Scouse Mouse
Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Location: Cloud #9
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 5:25 am Post subject: |
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| kprrok wrote: |
This is a 100% serious, honest, no BS post...
Can I join this group and still be a member of ATEK?
I think ATEK has its positive points (not perfect) and AFEK could also be good. I don't agree with what some people did in the ATEK thread to Tony, but I still feel that I would like to be a part of AFEK.
I've got my F5 and can prove it, so that's not an issue. Basically, will you admit someone to your group who is opposed to you on the ATEK issue? |
The group is not an anti-ATEK group, and if you look at the sign-up page, there is no mention of ATEK. It is not a political group. That said, there is a forum for discussions regarding ATEK as they present a real threat to F-Visa holders, and so should be discussed.
What I would ask (but could never enforce) is that the pro-ATEK people do not disclose what is discussed on that board even if they do not agree with it. If F-Visa holders want to organise against ATEK they should be able to do so privately. You can always influence discussions with a pro stance (and that would be welcomed) but it would nice if conversations carried on were considered 'confidential'.
YOU should decide if you want to join AFEK. If you want to disclose information discussed on the board, the moral judgement is yours and yours alone. If confidentiality is breached, then the "anti's" will convene secretly (and yes, I can make a secret board for the radicals if it is needed), but it is believed that allowing all F-Visa holders to take part in the discussions would be better for the community.
Right now, the forums are young and the membership is small, but one thing Chicken said (that I agree with) is that it would be cool to make it a community for F-Visa holders to come together regardless of nationality. Imagine having a place where people from all over the world can come together, unified by the fact that we married into Korean society... We teachers make up a tiny % of the people eligible to join. It could be fun  |
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Scouse Mouse
Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Location: Cloud #9
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 5:30 am Post subject: |
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| polonius wrote: |
| My son has an F-3, can he join on my behalf? He is 19 months old. My roots are long here, having lived here for 7 years, married in Korea, child born in Korea. Married a Canadian, so I can't get the F series. |
Great Question, Check PM |
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Hanson
Joined: 20 Oct 2004
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 1:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Scouse Mouse wrote: |
| polonius wrote: |
| My son has an F-3, can he join on my behalf? He is 19 months old. My roots are long here, having lived here for 7 years, married in Korea, child born in Korea. Married a Canadian, so I can't get the F series. |
Great Question, Check PM |
Can my daughter join, too? She may not have much to contribute, being three years old and all, but having married a naturalised Australian, my having an F-visa is impossible, even though I've been here 9 years... |
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kprrok
Joined: 06 Apr 2004
Location: KC
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Scouse Mouse wrote: |
The group is not an anti-ATEK group, and if you look at the sign-up page, there is no mention of ATEK. It is not a political group. That said, there is a forum for discussions regarding ATEK as they present a real threat to F-Visa holders, and so should be discussed.
What I would ask (but could never enforce) is that the pro-ATEK people do not disclose what is discussed on that board even if they do not agree with it. If F-Visa holders want to organise against ATEK they should be able to do so privately. You can always influence discussions with a pro stance (and that would be welcomed) but it would nice if conversations carried on were considered 'confidential'.
YOU should decide if you want to join AFEK. If you want to disclose information discussed on the board, the moral judgement is yours and yours alone. If confidentiality is breached, then the "anti's" will convene secretly (and yes, I can make a secret board for the radicals if it is needed), but it is believed that allowing all F-Visa holders to take part in the discussions would be better for the community.
Right now, the forums are young and the membership is small, but one thing Chicken said (that I agree with) is that it would be cool to make it a community for F-Visa holders to come together regardless of nationality. Imagine having a place where people from all over the world can come together, unified by the fact that we married into Korean society... We teachers make up a tiny % of the people eligible to join. It could be fun |
Thank you for the response. I would not join and then spread the discussions outside the group, that's not my cup of tea. I just wanted to make sure that you were open to admitting someone that views (as of now) probably the biggest single issue that I'm guessing would be discussed opposite of most of you.
It seems you are, so I shall fully consider it now. |
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Scouse Mouse
Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Location: Cloud #9
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 9:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Hanson wrote: |
| Scouse Mouse wrote: |
| polonius wrote: |
| My son has an F-3, can he join on my behalf? He is 19 months old. My roots are long here, having lived here for 7 years, married in Korea, child born in Korea. Married a Canadian, so I can't get the F series. |
Great Question, Check PM |
Can my daughter join, too? She may not have much to contribute, being three years old and all, but having married a naturalised Australian, my having an F-visa is impossible, even though I've been here 9 years... |
Give me a little time, and I will get back to you on this.
The issue is a little tricky - we realise that parents of F's who have been in Korea a long time have a lot to contribute, and should be allowed to represent their children.
By the same token, we want to keep AFEK clear of the short-term workers, and an F-3 holder could be here on his 10th year, or 10th day (and looking forward to the 365th day).
It is unlikely there will be blanket sign up policy for F-3 visa holders (or their parents), but it does like there will be some system in place.
If any F-2/4/5 visa holders want to have a say, come join! The membership is still very small. Come join, then invite your F-visa holding friends. If we can get a decent membership in the early days, AFEK can be an excellent resource. Without the membership, it is nothing. |
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Easter Clark
Joined: 18 Nov 2007
Location: Hiding from Yie Eun-woong
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| Posted: Mon May 18, 2009 6:52 am Post subject: |
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As a new F2 holder, I was interested in joining but I'm not going to make a copy of my visa status and email it in. Good idea at the time but instead of being a website where anyone who has questions related to F-visa interests can go for help and information; it's just a group of people who seek to exclude those who don't qualify. Bad idea asking for verification of visa status--it just sends the wrong message.
I'll continue to get my info and advice from other websites, thank you very much. I'd post the links but I don't trust that you guys would "qualify." |
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Scouse Mouse
Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Location: Cloud #9
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| Posted: Mon May 18, 2009 7:44 am Post subject: |
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| Easter Clark wrote: |
| As a new F2 holder, I was interested in joining but I'm not going to make a copy of my visa status and email it in. Good idea at the time but instead of being a website where anyone who has questions related to F-visa interests can go for help and information; it's just a group of people who seek to exclude those who don't qualify. |
I just want to clarify that nobody is asking for personally identifiable information in case anybody gets the wrong message from your post. There are a number of ways to join, and emailing ID is just one way (and is the quickest). If you choose to email the ID, you delete all personally identifiable information (except DOB on the ARC, just to make sure no jokers use the same ID over and over again) and there are other options that don't even require that! I posted my own 'info' up as examples on the sign-in page!
It isn't foolproof, but it's the best we have for quick access, and I figure that most people stick there CV's up on websites and email passports to Korean recruiters... an non-identifiable copy of your ARC won't hurt much!
(And yes, the point is to exclude people who do not qualify. This is about F-Visa holders networking and helping each other out without distractions.) |
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vk33
Joined: 26 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Wed May 20, 2009 12:43 am Post subject: |
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| Ruraljuror wrote: |
| I like this idea. Everyone time I meet somebody new who has an F visa I always pick his brain about his life as I have so many questions (I've only had my F visa for less than 2 years). These questions are invariably exclusively F visa concerns. |
Ruraljuror is the first person that is making any sense in this ATEK/AFEK, E2/F2, us/them hullabaloo. |
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Scouse Mouse
Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Location: Cloud #9
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| Posted: Wed May 20, 2009 6:34 am Post subject: |
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Sign-up for F-1 and F-3 visa holders is being considered on a case-by-case basis. If you know a current member, you can have them make a case for you. Failing that, you can apply via the main site
If you are the E-2 parent of a minor F-3 holder, you may well be eligible too. Ideally, you will have been in Korea for some time on an E-2 visa, and have long-standing ties here.
If you want to join to push the E-2 agenda, please don't. This is a site about F-Visa issues. many of them are common with the long-term E-2'er in Korea (housing, schooling) and that is what you should want to discuss  |
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polonius
Joined: 05 Jun 2004
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| Posted: Wed May 20, 2009 7:31 am Post subject: |
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| Scouse Mouse wrote: |
Sign-up for F-1 and F-3 visa holders is being considered on a case-by-case basis. If you know a current member, you can have them make a case for you. Failing that, you can apply via the main site
If you are the E-2 parent of a minor F-3 holder, you may well be eligible too. Ideally, you will have been in Korea for some time on an E-2 visa, and have long-standing ties here.
If you want to join to push the E-2 agenda, please don't. This is a site about F-Visa issues. many of them are common with the long-term E-2'er in Korea (housing, schooling) and that is what you should want to discuss |
That is good to hear. I know some who fall into that catagory who may want to discuss a few things. I hope you guys can make a strong community that is helpful. Good luck to you. |
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