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If there was ever a reason to support atheism, this is it
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some waygug-in



Joined: 25 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kuros wrote:
ED209 wrote:

We could go on all year like this. But as one poster points out, this was lack of oversight. A problem with any institution that cares for the vulnerable.

Harold Shipman killed so many because people trust doctors. These priests and nuns were trusted too. We have to stop automatically trusting people because of their occupation. Religion should no more have a free pass to morality than that strange man in the park who mummy chased away.


Yes, here's a reasoned response.

Unlike the people comparing the Catholic Church to Nazi Germany. Rolling Eyes



I suppose you refer to me here, It is documented history that the Catholic Church worked together with Nazi Germany and aided in the committing of atrocities.

http://www.cuttingedge.org/articles/RC130.html

http://www.geocities.com/serpentofgnosis/Vatican.html


Hitler himself said that he designed his "SS" on the patterns and principals
established by the Jesuit order.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KD_lBstvptE


http://www.nobeliefs.com/nazis.htm



Click on the reviews link, I think the first review sums it up pretty well.

http://www.amazon.com/Unholy-Trinity-Vatican-Nazis-Swiss/dp/031218199X
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Enrico Palazzo
Mod Team
Mod Team


Joined: 11 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kindly do not go over 400 words when posting from other sites. Someone posted what looked like a 1000 words or so. Can't you just quote part of it and post the link? An announcement was posted about that on the forum. We can't attend to such things so often, so please respect other websites and just quote part of what they wrote.

Thank you,

'Rico


Last edited by Enrico Palazzo on Thu May 21, 2009 6:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Manner of Speaking



Joined: 09 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EP,
Okay sorry. It's just that when I went to look this information up, I was stunned at how widespread the abuse has been and didn't know it had been recorded in so many countries. I didn't think the participants on this thread knew of it either.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kuros wrote:
Sergio Stefanuto wrote:
The Taliban girl-stoners, the Wahhabi rape victim-lashers, the Irish boy-rapers......another great day for atheism as the religion tragedy continues.


The rape of Irish boys is a great day for atheism?



For militant atheists it very likely is. They're overjoyed when they read something like that, as it gives them a chance to attack religion.

I used to know quite a few people like that. They were unable to contain their glee whenever something like this would come up. One day I pointed out that using the victims of these tragedies solely to advance their personal agenda didn't make them all that much morally superior. Funny thing was how they became so quiet after that.
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Enrico Palazzo
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Joined: 11 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Manner of Speaking wrote:
EP,
Okay sorry. It's just that when I went to look this information up, I was stunned at how widespread the abuse has been and didn't know it had been recorded in so many countries. I didn't think the participants on this thread knew of it either.


Fair enough. This is one part of the TOS that we haven't really dealt with too much, because it's hard to deal with. Many posters go over the limit.

Do your best to stick to not going over say 400 words. Dave wrote down 300, but we won't come down on you if you put down 400 words, but when you go over that, it becomes hard to read. I appreciate that you were trying to be informative. I am not trying to be hard on you all.
It is just to encourage more consideration on the board for the other posters.

'Rico (EP)
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bacasper



Joined: 26 Mar 2007

PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 11:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Manner of Speaking wrote:
It's amazing how someone so interested in the minutae of mythical experiences like the JFK assassination theories, the 911 conspiracy theories and "the secret people behind Obama" is so reluctant to face the minutae of the biggest REAL conspiracy of the 20th century.

The systematic, organized conspiracy by the whole Catholic clergy to conceal, protect and nurture a culture of pedophilia and child abuse within its ranks.

Now who's the conspiracy theorist?

I find it fascinating that you choose to believe in certain conspiracies, but call others "conspiracy theorists" when you disagree with them.

A megalomaniac who believes he has a monopoly on the truth is calling me crazy Exclamation Rolling Eyes
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Manner of Speaking



Joined: 09 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 12:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay bacasper, you want to hear a REAL conspiracy? A really valid conspiracy theory? Here's one for you.

For most of the 20th century, the Roman Catholic church was the primary supporter and driver of pedophilia and child abuse in the world.

In every single country where they operated and still operate, they established institutions whose PRIMARY purpose was to create safe havens whereby a hidden clique of priests and lay clergy could sexually assault children.

In order to facilitate this, the Catholic Church encouraged and sponsored an authoritarian, hierarchical structure that discouraged discussion and debate among informed Catholics on church and religious issues. The Pope was boss, and the only way to be a good Christian was to do what the Catholic church hierarchy and the parish priest ordered. Don't read the bible, don't debate, don't think for yourself, just do what the priest tells you to do.

WHATEVER he tells you to do.

In the minds of their victims, the church pedophile created a psychological environment that made it impossible to resist their sexual advances and still be considered a good Catholic. What the priest says is what God says. So psychologically the victim had no choice but to submit.

In order to further facilitate this environment, the Catholic Church spent hundreds of millions of dollars worldwide establishing hospitals, charities, schools, and orphanages in order to further facilitate the submission of the average Catholic to their will. "See what good works we do? You have to listen to your priest and submit to us because we are the moral authority in the world. Our good works give us the moral authority to tell you how and when you should submit to us."

And while the number of pedophiles in the Catholic church was few in number, the establishment and nurturing of this pedophile sanctuary was actively supported by the secrecy policies of the higher clergy, as well as by the thousands of parish priests who, while finding their actions personally morally distasteful, knew about it and did nothing to stop it. They were willing dupes as well as "useful idiots" of the pedophiles who controlled them.

To further facilitate this, the pedophiles promoted the idea that sexual assault of children should be dealt with secretly within the Church, as a "failure of faith", and that particularly grievious offenders should be transferred out of parishes and spirited away.

To some place where the pedophile could seek fresh flesh.

This was further facilitated by the doctrine of celibacy for priests. Because if priests could marry and have children, their wives, as mothers who care for children and their welfare, could act as a bulwark and a threat to the cherished sanctuary that the pedophiles worked so hard to establish.

In short, the sexual abuse which took place within the Catholic Church was not an aberration...the secret, real purpose of the Catholic church was to encourage, nurture, and sustain pedophilia as an institution worldwide.

And they were spectacularly successful at it.
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Manner of Speaking



Joined: 09 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bacasper wrote:
Now who's the conspiracy theorist?


So you finally admit that you peddle conspiracy theories.

Nice. Looks good on you.
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bacasper



Joined: 26 Mar 2007

PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 5:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Manner of Speaking wrote:
bacasper wrote:
Now who's the conspiracy theorist?


So you finally admit that you peddle conspiracy theories.

Nice. Looks good on you.

Only to the logic-challenged.
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djsmnc



Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Dave's ESL Cafe

PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Manner of Speaking wrote:
Okay bacasper, you want to hear a REAL conspiracy? A really valid conspiracy theory? Here's one for you.

For most of the 20th century, the Roman Catholic church was the primary supporter and driver of pedophilia and child abuse in the world.

In every single country where they operated and still operate, they established institutions whose PRIMARY purpose was to create safe havens whereby a hidden clique of priests and lay clergy could sexually assault children.

In order to facilitate this, the Catholic Church encouraged and sponsored an authoritarian, hierarchical structure that discouraged discussion and debate among informed Catholics on church and religious issues. The Pope was boss, and the only way to be a good Christian was to do what the Catholic church hierarchy and the parish priest ordered. Don't read the bible, don't debate, don't think for yourself, just do what the priest tells you to do.

WHATEVER he tells you to do.

In the minds of their victims, the church pedophile created a psychological environment that made it impossible to resist their sexual advances and still be considered a good Catholic. What the priest says is what God says. So psychologically the victim had no choice but to submit.

In order to further facilitate this environment, the Catholic Church spent hundreds of millions of dollars worldwide establishing hospitals, charities, schools, and orphanages in order to further facilitate the submission of the average Catholic to their will. "See what good works we do? You have to listen to your priest and submit to us because we are the moral authority in the world. Our good works give us the moral authority to tell you how and when you should submit to us."

And while the number of pedophiles in the Catholic church was few in number, the establishment and nurturing of this pedophile sanctuary was actively supported by the secrecy policies of the higher clergy, as well as by the thousands of parish priests who, while finding their actions personally morally distasteful, knew about it and did nothing to stop it. They were willing dupes as well as "useful idiots" of the pedophiles who controlled them.

To further facilitate this, the pedophiles promoted the idea that sexual assault of children should be dealt with secretly within the Church, as a "failure of faith", and that particularly grievious offenders should be transferred out of parishes and spirited away.

To some place where the pedophile could seek fresh flesh.

This was further facilitated by the doctrine of celibacy for priests. Because if priests could marry and have children, their wives, as mothers who care for children and their welfare, could act as a bulwark and a threat to the cherished sanctuary that the pedophiles worked so hard to establish.

In short, the sexual abuse which took place within the Catholic Church was not an aberration...the secret, real purpose of the Catholic church was to encourage, nurture, and sustain pedophilia as an institution worldwide.

And they were spectacularly successful at it.


It's true! Here's the truth about the holocaust too.
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bacasper



Joined: 26 Mar 2007

PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

djsmnc wrote:
Manner of Speaking wrote:
Okay bacasper, you want to hear a REAL conspiracy? A really valid conspiracy theory? Here's one for you.

For most of the 20th century, the Roman Catholic church was the primary supporter and driver of pedophilia and child abuse in the world....


It's true! Here's the truth about the holocaust too.

Now there's a nice conspiracy theory:

Quote:
Today the Vatican is a tremendous religious and political power. It has a billion citizens and controls the wealth of the world. Its goals are to make America Catholic, to set up diplomatic relations, destroy our Constitution, negotiate a Concordat, and work through our legal system which would make it possible to carry out their plans to "purge" the U.S. of all non-Catholic and Protestant opposition.
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Stones1962



Joined: 26 Nov 2008
Location: Europe/Asia

PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 10:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is no reason to support atheism. But it sounds as if the op is assuming atheists would never do anything as horrific as these things mentioned...only Catholics, or Christians in general, are capable of these things? please.....

Those of you without sin, cast the first stone.....
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bacasper



Joined: 26 Mar 2007

PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 1:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stones1962 wrote:
This is no reason to support atheism. But it sounds as if the op is assuming atheists would never do anything as horrific as these things mentioned...only Catholics, or Christians in general, are capable of these things? please.....

The Awareness Center has almost 500 cases of rabbis, cantors, and other Jewish trusted officials involved in child sex abuse compiled on its website.

And of course, many claim that Mohammed's marriage to Aisha was consummated when she was nine, and even today the practice of child brides continues in places like Saudi Arabia, so this is certainly not something on which Catholics have a monopoly, nor are they engaging in some deep, secret conspiracy.
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Manner of Speaking



Joined: 09 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 6:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stones1962 wrote:
This is no reason to support atheism. But it sounds as if the op is assuming atheists would never do anything as horrific as these things mentioned...only Catholics, or Christians in general, are capable of these things? please.....

Those of you without sin, cast the first stone.....


Oh, so we ARE going to discuss this after all. Okay.

I submit that Catholicism - at least in the 20th century - is and has been nothing more than the systematic, widespread, organized practice of pedophilia on an international scale. Some would suggest that pedophilia within the Catholic church hierarchy has simply been an aberration and that the organization exists to promote religious and charitable activities.

I posit the opposite. The organization's primary purpose, clearly, has been to provide a safe harbor for the nurturing and practice of pedophilia on a global scale.

Its religious and charitable activities merely serve as a smokescreen to achieve that end. And they have been spectacularly successful at it. For decades, if not centuries, millions of practicing Catholics have been duped into believing that smokescreen. And millions of children, attempting to do what they have been told is the religious right thing to do, have been duped into submitting to their friendly neighborhood pedophile as well.
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bacasper



Joined: 26 Mar 2007

PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 6:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Manner of Speaking wrote:
I submit that Catholicism - at least in the 20th century - is and has been nothing more than the systematic, widespread, organized practice of pedophilia on an international scale. Some would suggest that pedophilia within the Catholic church hierarchy has simply been an aberration and that the organization exists to promote religious and charitable activities.

I posit the opposite. The organization's primary purpose, clearly, has been to provide a safe harbor for the nurturing and practice of pedophilia on a global scale.

Its religious and charitable activities merely serve as a smokescreen to achieve that end. And they have been spectacularly successful at it. For decades, if not centuries, millions of practicing Catholics have been duped into believing that smokescreen. And millions of children, attempting to do what they have been told is the religious right thing to do, have been duped into submitting to their friendly neighborhood pedophile as well.

Damn those crafty pedophiles! Establishing leper colonies just to fool parents into believing they are really nice guys just so they could get at the kids.

Is there no level they will not stoop to?

Rolling Eyes

This is really just an episode of Paedogeddon, isn't it?
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