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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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 Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:37 pm Post subject: What a few Korean men think about NK and US |
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I spoke with a few Korean men about this topic. The men are well educated, and work for large companies in Seoul. The prevailing thought is that the United States purposely escalates tension between North and South Korea, so they can sell more weapons to the South.
They said that weapons were the "real" reason between tensions. Obviosuly, they blamed the Bush administration, saying Bush was pro-Defense spending, so he manipulated the 6 party talks so that they would fail. The end result being increased arms sales into South Korea.
Also, they said it is the US and Japan who do not want reunification of the Korean penninsula because then Korea would no longer buy weapons from the US. All the other Korean men there were in agreement.
What do you folks think about their view? That the entire Korean penninsula conflict is perpetrated by the US, so that they can sell more weapons to a wealthy South Koreans? |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Ask them if they're ready to see their taxes double to pay for reunification. Ask them if they're ready for 5 million North Koreans streaming south to look for work. That's the real reason why the SK government isn't keen to see it happen soon. |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:54 pm Post subject: Re: What a few Korean men think about NK and US |
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| pkang0202 wrote: |
| What do you folks think about their view? That the entire Korean penninsula conflict is perpetrated by the US, so that they can sell more weapons to a wealthy South Koreans? |
SK wasn't wealthy 50 years ago. I suspect the US has spent much more on SK's defense than SK has paid for weapons. |
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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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I forgot to say, they are also convinced that North Korea would never attack South Korea.
What is alarming is MOST South Koreans believe this. With that kind of thinking, the North will always have the "Surprise Attack" advantage. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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Out of the Korean adults I know, I've heard a fair bit share similar views... but after a few minutes of questioning and counter theories, their position quickly fades.
They spend too much time reading the Hanky and think they know what's going on. |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Funny... most Koreans I know think reunification would be far too expensive. They realize it's a sort of pipe dream, and that it would cost them dearly. |
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Rusty Shackleford
Joined: 08 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
| Ask them if they're ready to see their taxes double to pay for reunification. Ask them if they're ready for 5 million North Koreans streaming south to look for work. That's the real reason why the SK government isn't keen to see it happen soon. |
Short term, re-unification would be wrenching but long term it would benefit both countries. There is a massive low wage labor force up there who are dying to work and would be relatively easy to train as they speak a common language. The flow of capital from south to north would help both sides through investment and higher output.
Obviously it would take a lot of aid in the short term to simply provide the necessities of life for 30 million people, but providing that aid and building the required infrastructure would be a massive boon for the Souths construction and transport industries.
In the medium term the NK "middle class" would start demanding things like washing machines, fridges and cars. Items the south produces in abundance.
In the long term it probably wouldn't have a massive impact on the Souths groth rate but would increase the Norths exponentially.
As for the predicted refugee crisis, depending on the immediate aftermath of the conflict, the same mechanisms that stop NKs from crossing the border now, should be effective in keeping them from doing so then. |
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Robot_Teacher
Joined: 18 Feb 2009
Location: Robotting Around the World
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Interesting conspiracy theory, but it doesn't hold up. I too would bet it costed the US more money to help South Korea than the US received from South Korea. |
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Julius
Joined: 27 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 7:50 pm Post subject: Re: What a few Korean men think about NK and US |
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| pkang0202 wrote: |
Also, they said it is the US and Japan who do not want reunification of the Korean penninsula because then Korea would no longer buy weapons from the US. All the other Korean men there were in agreement. |
There are several logical questions you could have said that would have defeated their stupidity instantly...
1) If North korea would never attack the south, why did they do so in 1950?
2) If the ROK know that North Korea would never attack them, why do they buy weapons from the US? A waste of money surely.
3) The US spends billions of dollars propping up the south. If all they were interested in was profits, they'd make more money by leaving South Korea to defend itself.
To be honest Koreans, even the "educated' ones are ignorant and ungrateful fools, and the sooner they are forced to wake up to reality the better. The US should have pulled out of this country after the mass anti-american protests a few years back.
Korea is not an ally, and its high time the white house realised it and reformed their policy here. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
Out of the Korean adults I know, I've heard a fair bit share similar views... but after a few minutes of questioning and counter theories, their position quickly fades.
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That's been my experience. With the exception of one or two miitant leftists(members of the infamous teachers' union), the Koreans I know, if pressed on the matter, will say that the US troops are needed for the security of Korea. And this is in Gwangju.
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To be honest Koreans, even the "educated' ones are ignorant and ungrateful fools, and the sooner they are forced to wake up to reality the better. The US should have pulled out of this country after the mass anti-american protests a few years back.
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Again, the idea persists here that the US keeps troops in Korea out of some desire for the warm gratitude of the Korean people. They don't. And the self-interested objectives of US foreign-policy are as much a part of any "reality" as is the threat posed by North Korea.
Last edited by On the other hand on Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:31 am; edited 2 times in total |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:29 am Post subject: Re: What a few Korean men think about NK and US |
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| pkang0202 wrote: |
I spoke with a few Korean men about this topic. The men are well educated, and work for large companies in Seoul. The prevailing thought is that the United States purposely escalates tension between North and South Korea, so they can sell more weapons to the South.
They said that weapons were the "real" reason between tensions. Obviosuly, they blamed the Bush administration, saying Bush was pro-Defense spending, so he manipulated the 6 party talks so that they would fail. The end result being increased arms sales into South Korea.
Also, they said it is the US and Japan who do not want reunification of the Korean penninsula because then Korea would no longer buy weapons from the US. All the other Korean men there were in agreement.
What do you folks think about their view? That the entire Korean penninsula conflict is perpetrated by the US, so that they can sell more weapons to a wealthy South Koreans? |
illogical and along the lines of "truthers". Others in this thread have noted the faults in their logic. |
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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 8:24 am Post subject: Re: What a few Korean men think about NK and US |
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| Julius wrote: |
2) If the ROK know that North Korea would never attack them, why do they buy weapons from the US? A waste of money surely.
3) The US spends billions of dollars propping up the south. If all they were interested in was profits, they'd make more money by leaving South Korea to defend itself. |
You speak as if these governments were individuals acting rationally. It is the individuals who shuttle in and out of government and defense contractors like a revolving door who peddle war and reap obscene profits.
| bucheon bum wrote: |
| pkang0202 wrote: |
I spoke with a few Korean men about this topic. The men are well educated, and work for large companies in Seoul. The prevailing thought is that the United States purposely escalates tension between North and South Korea, so they can sell more weapons to the South.
They said that weapons were the "real" reason between tensions. Obviosuly, they blamed the Bush administration, saying Bush was pro-Defense spending, so he manipulated the 6 party talks so that they would fail. The end result being increased arms sales into South Korea.
Also, they said it is the US and Japan who do not want reunification of the Korean penninsula because then Korea would no longer buy weapons from the US. All the other Korean men there were in agreement.
What do you folks think about their view? That the entire Korean penninsula conflict is perpetrated by the US, so that they can sell more weapons to a wealthy South Koreans? |
illogical and along the lines of "truthers". Others in this thread have noted the faults in their logic. |
Capitalism requires permanent war. |
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vonjunk
Joined: 31 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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I had a surreal conversation with a Korean man, who had done well in Korea and now is doing well in the US. He told me one time, when I asked what he made of North Korea testing a nuclear weapon, that the South would have been better if the North had won.
Then Korea would be totally self-reliant!
When I mentioned the USSR (Russian) aid before and Chinese aid now are the reason NK survives he kind of gave me a blank stare, shrugged and said he didn't believe they needed them either, whereas SK was a prisoner of the US.
I also mentioned that with Kim Il-song planted rice fields in infertile land, wasted money, energy and led the death of 200,000 to 500,000 people. Again, NK was being independent and that's the most important thing.
All I can figure from this rather bewildering view of a man who has benefited so much from SK ties to the US is that it is a Korean tradition and one of the ways in which they kept their own culture for all of the years they were under Chinese and then Japanese control of one form or another.
So, I decided to not take it in the wrong way. It seems just a cultural defense mechanism rather than an insult (but it so often comes out that way). |
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vonjunk
Joined: 31 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Capitalism requires permanent war. |
Wow. Perhaps to clarify, would you say defense companies require constant wars, or threats of wars? Yes. Capitalism? Nope.
When the US was neutral or better Switzerland is neutral, they are capitalists and thrive.
If you have a chance read Adam Smith's The Wealth of Nations. Here's a link for a free online version:
http://www.bibliomania.com/2/1/65/112/frameset.html
The richest countries in the world all use to one degree or another capitalism. If you really want to move back to a less prosperous time with no computers, air conditioning, cars, steady stream of food, division of labor (better give up that teaching job, you're going back to the fields my boy) and on and on. |
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kg2095
Joined: 23 May 2009
Location: Hwaseong City
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 12:36 am Post subject: Re: What a few Korean men think about NK and US |
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| bacasper wrote: |
| Capitalism requires permanent war. |
What's your reasoning behind this? |
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