Korean Job Discussion Forums

climber159 · Joined: 02 Sep 2007

Maybe it's just because I've been contemplating the act as well, but there seem to be more people coming here looking for information on the infamous midnight run. Am I wrong?

To most of us it's obvious that the ESL system in Korea is in dire need of overhaul. I'd venture to say that the majority of us have had issues at our school or hagwon that have caused us to question what we are doing here. Sometimes these issues are normal teacher issues that you would experience in your own country. However, many times these issues have nothing to do with the teaching profession. Issues such as desk-warming, witholding pay, witholding your passport or other documents, illegal firings, and so on.

If you want to pull a runner on your school, then do it. Don't ask others if they think you should. Just go. Hand in your ARC as you pass through airport immigration. No one will stop you.

There will probably be some short-term repercussions for the rest of us from some schools and hagwons. But, in the long-term, the more teachers who just abscond the better. Some contracts will become more restricting; but, eventually people will stop signing those. At certain point the Korean ESL powers that be will be forced to change their habits.

Sadly, I am aware of the history of how slowly systems change when action from such large numbers of people is called for. I still hope.

BTW I am currently desk-warming for the afternoon and am bored.

TheUrbanMyth · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Location: Retired

Unfortunately, you are incorrect in your assumptions of how the market works and the attitude of "the powers that be".

There will always be a certain amount of recent grads looking to pay off bills.

And the "powers that be" don't care about teachers doing runs...An official from the MOE is on record as saying experience doesn't matter and calling for high turnover of foreign teachers at public schools.

climber159 · Joined: 02 Sep 2007

I am incorrect so far.

rationality · Joined: 05 Jul 2007 Location: Some where in S. Korea

rationality · Joined: 05 Jul 2007 Location: Some where in S. Korea

climber159 · Joined: 02 Sep 2007

Indeed it is insulting. But when you look at a website like this (http://www.sejongpac.or.kr/english/introduction/ceo.asp) the situation becomes funny.

bassexpander · Joined: 13 Sep 2007 Location: Someplace you'd rather be.

Ramen · Joined: 15 Apr 2008

Otherside · Joined: 06 Sep 2007

I think a lot of the runner requests have to do with a large increase in the number of teachers here (obvious point).

Previously, ESL jobs would either attract a more adventurous soul, looking to travel and experience the world, more willing to put up from cultural differences or adapt....or, it would attract qualified teachers looking for a break from the system and hoping to broaden their horizons. (broad strokes, but you get the point).

With the large unemployment figures in the West, I think ESL (and specifically korea with it's relativly high salary and low requirements) is attracting a large number of people who have little desire to travel and experience the world or have any love of teaching. Rather they just need a job, any job.

When someone winds up doing something they hate, in a place they hate, there is going to be a lot more dissatisfaction and a lot of people looking for a way out. The ESL practices and dishonest Hagwon shenanigans are just gravy on an already cold meatloaf.

Kurtz · Joined: 05 Jan 2007 Location: ples bilong me

It could also be this disposable society we live in; if something isn't working, don't bother fixing it, just throw it away, or in this case, run away.

Maybe I'm old school, but unless there was serious moneys not being paid, or horrible bullying, I think running away is just cowardly and gutless. Just quit and do the right thing.

climber159 · Joined: 02 Sep 2007

Otherside: Nicely put.

Kurtz: I agree in principle. But, I have learned from my first and secondhand experiences in Korea that if a contract is going to be terminated someone will be getting screwed. And, my experience here has taught me that if I do the right thing in Korea, I will propably lose out. Doing the "right" thing in a selfish society...Hmm...Better to look out for #1.

Tobias · Joined: 02 Jun 2008

lifeinkorea · Joined: 24 Jan 2009 Location: somewhere in China

I don't think cumulative effort will amount to much. They will just replace a teacher who they screwed for another one. You would have to plug up the entry point for a newbie to go there. There will always be an uninformed newbie willing to sign to take over a runner's spot. In the end, the runner only wins if they truly got screwed.

Tobias · Joined: 02 Jun 2008

tenchu77491 · Joined: 16 Mar 2009

I think a majority of runners are people who go to Asia to teach English and have little to no connection or knowledge of anything Asian. More than likely the cultural shock and differences build up to the point where they simply can't handle it any more.

I don't feel bad for people that run. Obviously people have different breaking points and you never know what is going on in a persons life. People are too quick to judge someone's actions without really knowing the underlying issues.

I ran from Avalon (hagwon) and it had nothing to do with cultural difficulties or any shock at all. In fact I was quite happy with my own Korean ability and insight into Asia as a whole. I have a BA in east Asian studies and I can speak Chinese, Korean and Japanese. I have also lived most of my life alone and far, far from home and abroad most of the time. I don't think running is as simple as people make it out to be. Everyone has a reason so don't be too quick to judge.

It's pointless to place all your faith in the idea that everyone should 'complete their contract' with no difficulties and then go home. We live and work in a country where people dishonor contracts daily.

It's equally true that a majority of people at this board know that in Korea you can't simply tell your boss what is going on in your mind without some sort of serious back stabbing in your near future. Can you imagine telling your boss you are thinking about quitting before your contract is up? People are even afraid to tell their boss they are thinking of not resigning up for the same school. Obviously a Korean boss will take a full out early termination much harder.

The sad truth is in a majority of cases running is in fact a more profitable way to leave. I would also bet your chances of working here again are equal with completing a contract and/or not completing the contract. Really terminating a contract early the 'right' way will cause more problems and open your self up to getting screwed by most companies. It's not our fault the system works like that.

The people I think lose out the most are of course the kids. I really could not care less about the companies and businesses involved but it's the kids and their families that get to me. In my case I ran from Avalon at the very end of the semester so the kids parents could sign them up for another semester or resign them at another school. I would have actually felt bad if I didn't run at the end of the semester. I could not care less for any businesses out there and I do hope Avalon burns in hell. Anyway, after I ran from that Avalon the other 2 teachers ran as well (after they got 2 more new teachers after I ran!) within a 2 month period. All in all I don't feel bad about what I did and I never will.

Those other 2 teachers ran on their own and not because of me. I was in full contact with them. They told me the school kept creating new rules and regulations. Such as, screwing over time with clever book keeping (which I basically gave up fighting), a rule that was '1 min late equals 10,000 won fee', coming in early for elementary school lesson demos (while I was a middle school teacher) etc. The other teachers also said they just gave up.

That school was a hell of a grind on everyone in it. The teachers and the kids. I will never go back to a hagwon again. Those late hours really grind you down... I mean working late and staying up later and sleeping throughout the day until you wake up to go to work again... really cuts off your whole social life and family life, and puts a big bind on your love life if you got one. That's ultimately what did it in for me (I think).

However now I am happy in an after school program where I work 12-5pm. I really enjoy the time and I am able to really get out and do stuff. If I had known my issues before maybe I could have resolved my situation without running but things didn't become clear until I ran and came back...