Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Summer Wine]

Your comments are interesting.

I have simply responded to postings made on daves. You have responded to such postings by implying that my responses are determined by certain religious feelings.

I have responded by stating that those postings were not determined by religious issues or feelings but by political feelings.

You have stated that you do not understand my postings and that I am seeking your postings to respond to them.

I would like to say that it isn't the case and while I support the idea of a jewish state (within parameters) it is not a religious issue to my mind. The reason that I mention religion is because of certain responses that you have made that imply that I am a religious person.

[Summer Wine]

After re-reading our postings, I guess that BB and I can say that

"we agree to disagree" on certain issues.

Its probably the best as if the whole world agreed on everything, it would be pretty boring.

[Big_Bird]

Summer Wine,

this is what really gets on my nerves.

People who want to talk about the I/P conflict always come after me. Even when I am somewhere else.

I could be discussing abortion/North Korea/Animal rights/the NHS/the second world war but some people will ignore the topic of the thread and start gabbling on "Big Bird, blah blah....Hamas....blah blah.........Israel.....blah blah" and I think What the Fork?

Am I the ON DUTY ISRAEL/PALESTINE DEBATER? Some people, like ManintheMiddle and Postfundie just can't stop thinking about debates long past from the 2006 war on Lebanon. Jesus, guys. It's not my JOB to talk to you about Israel/Gaza/Hamas or what have you.

If you love the topic so much, post on the appropriate threads. Or start your own threads. And don't start threads demanding I come and talk to you. That's sheer bollocks.

Talk about Israel. Talk about Hamas. Talk about Lebanon. Do it to your heart's content. But don't constantly involve me. I'll get involved if I'm in the mood and I feel I've got something to say. If not, I'm perfectly within my rights not to bother.

Got that?

[Summer Wine]

I guess people involve you in these discussions because you involve yourself in them.

Maybe its not intentional, but you do sometimes come across as a palestinian/ muslim/ anything goes supporter.

If that isn't your desire then I am sorry to involve you in the debates.

[Big_Bird]

[bacasper]

Galloway leading largest US convoy ever to Palestine

We were all moved to tears of grief and anger when Israel launched its murderous bombardment against the people of Gaza in December and January. Millions of us took to the streets in unprecedented protests around the globe. Each and every one of us has asked ourselves what more we can do to help stop the suffering.

The inspirational anti-war and pro-Palestinian British MP, George Galloway, decided that while it is necessary to speak out � in his case with great force and eloquence � it is actions that speak louder than words.

While the bombs were still showering down on what has been called the largest open-air prison in history, Galloway decided to organize a humanitarian convoy that would start in Britain, drive through France and Spain, and across North Africa to arrive in Gaza with aid, even as all borders to the devastated region were under complete blockade. In just five short weeks, he pulled together 107 vehicles � including ambulances and a fire engine � 255 people and $2 million of aid, which set off from London on February 14. Some 23 days and 5,500 miles later it arrived in Gaza to tumultuous acclaim.

The fact that so many people come from Britain whose government had, along with George W Bush, backed the Israeli aggression had an enormous impact on the besieged people of Gaza.

Now, Galloway is heading a second convoy � this time from the USA. The Vietnam War veteran, Ron Kovic, whose experiences in the war led him to become a life-long advocate of a more just US foreign policy, has readily agreed to be co-leader of the convoy.

The convoy�s aim is to take hundreds of US citizens in 500 vehicles, bearing $10 million in medical aid from Cairo to Gaza. Convoy participants will leave from JFK airport on July 4, bearing the simple yet powerful message that Palestinian independence is as precious as US independence. The group will organize the convoy in Cairo and proceed to Gaza the following weekend, proudly waving US and Palestinian flags, as well as banners declaring thousands of supporting organizations and institutions.

This is set to be the biggest single aid effort for Palestine ever to leave US shores. It will be a source of great strength and hope for the Palestinian people. It will also have a major impact here in the United States, helping to stir US public opinion about the conflict in the Middle East and to bring about a permanent shift in government policy.

The US has a chance right now to step into a more progressive role in the world. But Viva Palestina USA needs your help to make this venture successful and to get this aid through the siege that has been strangling the people of Gaza for three years.

What you can do at link

[Summer Wine]

BB wrote:

[ddeubel]

Interesting UN articles never replied by Israel....

[bacasper]

Speaking of Israel, http://www.911missinglinks.com/

[bacasper]

[bacasper]

Let�s Talk About Terrorism � From Warsaw to Jenin

April 19, 2002 � 11:47 am

Today, 19 April 2002, is the 59th anniversary of the outbreak of the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising by the Jews in Nazi occupied Poland. If I were to be a Jew today, I would be deeply ashamed of how history has repeated itself on the eve of this anniversary.

The irony is simply too incredible to ignore: A totally isolated and starving civilian population confined in a dreadful ghetto with endless curfews. An oppressed and wronged people with little hope of salvation. An expansionist enemy with an elected sadist at its helm who blames the subjugated victims for their miserable predicament. A desperate uprising that knows it has no chances of military victory, but a resistance movement that is nevertheless determined to die fighting. A long and suffocating military siege, followed by a relentless and indiscriminate onslaught. A bloodbath, heroic martyrdom, a crushed uprising, but the inevitable and unstoppable rebirth of a people.

The shame that decent Jews must feel today is compounded by the fact that the Israeli generals who are bent on crushing the will of the Palestinians today have themselves unremorsefully declared recently that they must learn from the German tactics of suppressing the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising in their current war against the surrounded Palestinian ghettos (see report by Amir Oren in Haaretz, 25 January 2002). The Jews who perished at the hands of the Nazis must be turning in their graves at such repulsive news these days.
...
Of course, you will hear and read none of this in the mainstream Western news organisations. They will not tell you that, for example, like their Palestinian counterparts, the Jewish resistance in the Warsaw ghetto used to execute Jewish collaborators with the Nazis (contemptuously called Kapos) without trial. Far from it, the obedient Zionist media troops are too busy waging an incessant propaganda war against all manifestations of Palestinian aspirations for freedom.

Recently, after the carnage in the West Bank could not be blacked-out any longer, the only remaining effective weapon of this actively combatant media machine in the West has been to continuously point out the criminality and immorality of intentionally targeting and murdering innocent Israeli civilians by Palestinian suicide bombers � and you can be sure to hear or read little else from them about the origins and sources of the fear and loathing in the hearts of Palestinians.

This manipulative tool of persuasion has been effective because, unfortunately, there has been no focused counter response from the Palestinian side that earnestly and boldly confronts the issue of the suicide bombers outside the popular discourse of glorification or the traditional indulgence in metaphysical certainties.

So, while Israeli tanks and planes have been wreaking destruction and death on the already besieged ghettos of Palestine, and while Israeli soldiers have been destroying ambulances and preventing them from attending to � or even burying � the Palestinians who have been left to bleed to death on the sides of the roads or under the rubble of their destroyed shacks in the refugee camps, the �usual suspects� of pro-Israeli commentators have been coming out yet again in blind defence of Israel, nauseatingly screaming �suicide bombers� and �terrorism� over and over again.

It has all been about stopping the suicide bombings, they remind us, while wickedly drawing outrageous parallels to the September 11 massacres. The random killings of Israeli civilians by Palestinian men and women wrapped with explosives, they tell the world, are simply intolerable and need to be eliminated. So the actions of the Israeli army, according to the Israeli apologists, somehow become a justifiable means of self-defence against the indefensible acts of intentional murder of civilians by the Palestinian Kamikaze men and women.

With this simplistic approach, the shameless warlords disguised as journalists in this crucial media war didn�t have to do much to deceive their audience and readers; on its face value, any position stating that the intentional murder of innocent civilians is wrong � and ending the argument there � does not need much arguing to sound convincing.

The latent, yet immense, evil, however, of this seemingly ethical stand against murder lies not in its rightful condemnation of the act itself but in its deliberate omitting of the full picture. The grave act of deception and dishonesty of the media is manifested in the disgraceful failure to point out not only that the premeditated intentional killing of civilians is an atrocity perpetrated by both sides in the conflict today, but that the leading precedents in this criminal form of warfare have been set by the Israelis and not by the Palestinians.

To unveil this deeply suppressed reality, it is incumbent upon us, Arabs and Palestinians, to remember our history and keep reminding the world of the truth. We cannot tire of reiterating the fact that the deplorable acts of intentional and targeted murder of civilians of which we now stand accused were the novelty not of the Palestinians, but indeed the patented invention of the Israeli colonizers of our land from the very start of this conflict until the present moment

It is always refreshing, therefore, in such clouded times to recount some of the glaring chapters in the biography of Israeli terrorism. Here are but a few.

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