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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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 Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 11:49 pm Post subject: Most US voters don't support Israel |
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Poll: American voters� support of Israel drops
June 15, 2009
JERUSALEM (JTA) -- American voters' support for Israel has dropped 20 percent in the past nine months, a new survey found.
Some 49 percent of American voters call themselves supporters of Israel, down from 69 percent last September, according to the poll conducted for The Israel Project.
The number of voters who called themselves undecided rose during that same period, and the number of Palestinian supporters remained steady at 7 percent. The number of Israel supporters hit a low of 38 percent immediately following the 2005 disengagement from Gaza, with an equal rise in undecided voters.
The poll was conducted among 800 registered voters on June 2 and 3 by Greenberg Quinlan Rosner Research. It has not been officially released by The Israel Project, but was leaked to the media by someone who received the numbers the day after the poll was completed on Thursday.
According to the poll, some 44 percent of voters believe the United States should support Israel, down from 69 percent a year ago. Some 5 percent of voters believe the United States should support the Palestinians, with 32 percent undecided.
Some 23 percent of voters believed that Israel should return all lands captured in 1967, with 57 percent saying some should be retained for security.
Some 66 percent of those polled do not believe that Israeli support of a two-state solution -- including establishing an independent Palestinian state and stopping the expansion of settlements -- will bring lasting peace to the region, with 22 percent saying it will. In addition, 48 percent believe the Israeli support would not end Palestinian terrorism; 39 percent said it would.
Some 85 percent of respondents believe that Iran is a serious threat to Israel, with only 7 percent saying it is not -- figures that have remained virtually unchanged over the past year. |
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Sergio Stefanuto
Joined: 14 May 2009
Location: UK
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:22 am Post subject: |
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Well, I certainly support Israel.
Israel is where I do battle with the three most debilitating phenomena known to man: Christianity, Islam and socialism.
| Bacasper wrote: |
| The poll was conducted among 800 registered voters on June 2 and 3 by Greenberg Quinlan Rosner Research |
Highly unreliable |
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RufusW
Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Location: Busan
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 7:24 am Post subject: |
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| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
| Israel is where I do battle with the three most debilitating phenomena known to man: Christianity, Islam and socialism. |
Wat? |
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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 8:14 am Post subject: |
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| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
Well, I certainly support Israel.
Israel is where I do battle with the three most debilitating phenomena known to man: Christianity, Islam and socialism.
| Bacasper wrote: |
| The poll was conducted among 800 registered voters on June 2 and 3 by Greenberg Quinlan Rosner Research |
Highly unreliable |
You do realize that JTA is a Jewish source, right? |
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Sergio Stefanuto
Joined: 14 May 2009
Location: UK
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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A poll of 800 people is insufficient for the conclusion you appear to have drawn (in your thread title)
hasty generalization fallacy |
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RJjr
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Location: Turning on a Lamp
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
Well, I certainly support Israel.
Israel is where I do battle with the three most debilitating phenomena known to man: Christianity, Islam and socialism. |
Israel owes its very existance to the soldiers who fought for the U.S.Socialist.R. in the 1940s. Those men and women liberated Majdanek, Sobibor, Treblinka, Auschwitz, Stutthof, Sachsenhausen, and other concentration camps.
And for all of the Hell Christians have put Jews through over the centuries, Israel owes its existance to Christians in the USA, the UK, and elsewhere. Not just these guys http://mazh.com/pics/FR-Normandy-Colleville%20Cem.jpg but also Christians who have supported Israel over the decades. |
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E_athlete
Joined: 09 Jun 2009
Location: Korea sparkling
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
A poll of 800 people is insufficient for the conclusion you appear to have drawn (in your thread title)
hasty generalization fallacy |
you do realize scientific surveys use statistical sampling methods ? You can't sample millions of people that would be too expensive.
Your Bachelors wasn't in science was it? |
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Sergio Stefanuto
Joined: 14 May 2009
Location: UK
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:52 pm Post subject: |
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| E_athlete wrote: |
| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
A poll of 800 people is insufficient for the conclusion you appear to have drawn (in your thread title)
hasty generalization fallacy |
you do realize scientific surveys use statistical sampling methods ? |
Doesn't matter a jot
| E_Athlete wrote: |
| Your Bachelors wasn't in science was it? |
And yours was? What the heck are you doing working at Toss English?
| RJjr wrote: |
| Israel owes its very existance to the soldiers who fought for the U.S.Socialist.R. in the 1940s |
Stalinist Russia then?
| RJjr wrote: |
| And for all of the Hell Christians have put Jews through over the centuries, Israel owes its existance to Christians in the USA, the UK, and elsewhere. Not just these guys http://mazh.com/pics/FR-Normandy-Colleville%20Cem.jpg but also Christians who have supported Israel over the decades. |
That's precisely what they should be doing. |
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E_athlete
Joined: 09 Jun 2009
Location: Korea sparkling
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
| E_athlete wrote: |
| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
A poll of 800 people is insufficient for the conclusion you appear to have drawn (in your thread title)
hasty generalization fallacy |
you do realize scientific surveys use statistical sampling methods ? |
Doesn't matter a jot
| E_Athlete wrote: |
| Your Bachelors wasn't in science was it? |
And yours was? What the heck are you doing working at Toss English?
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yes, it matters if you are concerned with reality. Researchers have a method they use to get a sample size that is representative of the general population. They dont just ask 800 people working at a car plant or something.
med school in 2010, im teaching in Korea before my class starts. What does that matter? There are people with all sorts of degrees teaching for different reasons. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:01 pm Post subject: |
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| E_athlete wrote: |
| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
| E_athlete wrote: |
| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
A poll of 800 people is insufficient for the conclusion you appear to have drawn (in your thread title)
hasty generalization fallacy |
you do realize scientific surveys use statistical sampling methods ? |
Doesn't matter a jot
| E_Athlete wrote: |
| Your Bachelors wasn't in science was it? |
And yours was? What the heck are you doing working at Toss English?
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yes, it matters if you are concerned with reality. Researchers have a method they use to get a sample size that is representative of the general population. They dont just ask 800 people working at a car plant or something.
med school in 2010, im teaching in Korea before my class starts. What does that matter? There are people with all sorts of degrees teaching for different reasons. |
yes, it is obvious mr. sergio didn't take even stats 101. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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| RJjr wrote: |
| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
Well, I certainly support Israel.
Israel is where I do battle with the three most debilitating phenomena known to man: Christianity, Islam and socialism. |
Israel owes its very existance to the soldiers who fought for the U.S.Socialist.R. in the 1940s. Those men and women liberated Majdanek, Sobibor, Treblinka, Auschwitz, Stutthof, Sachsenhausen, and other concentration camps.
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And don't forget the fact that the USSR was the second country to recognize Israel.
Or that Israel's economic policy was socialist up until the 90s. |
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Sergio Stefanuto
Joined: 14 May 2009
Location: UK
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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| E_athlete wrote: |
| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
| E_athlete wrote: |
| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
A poll of 800 people is insufficient for the conclusion you appear to have drawn (in your thread title)
hasty generalization fallacy |
you do realize scientific surveys use statistical sampling methods ? |
Doesn't matter a jot
| E_Athlete wrote: |
| Your Bachelors wasn't in science was it? |
And yours was? What the heck are you doing working at Toss English?
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yes, it matters if you are concerned with reality. Researchers have a method they use to get a sample size that is representative of the general population. They dont just ask 800 people working at a car plant or something. |
The conclusion is a flagrant hasty generalization fallacy. A poll of 800 people is too small for the conclusion. If you were, as you put it, "conerned with reality", you'd realize that nothing other than sheer chance is the basis of this evidence. Polls are notoriously unreliable.
| E_Athlete wrote: |
| med school in 2010, im teaching in Korea before my class starts. What does that matter? There are people with all sorts of degrees teaching for different reasons. |
It matters because you facetiously asked "Your Bachelors wasn't in science was it?" (implying that yours was), when it's really not a good idea to boast about having a science degree if your current employment is working at Toss English for $1,581 per month teaching English to 6 year old kids.
| Bucheon Bum wrote: |
| yes, it is obvious mr. sergio didn't take even stats 101 |
And it's equally obvious that Bucheon Bum didn't even take Argument and Logic 101 if he is happy to accept a blatant nonsequitur
| Bucheon Bum wrote: |
| And don't forget the fact that the USSR was the second country to recognize Israel. |
Well, bully for Stalin.
Russia also started the Six Day War (with a lie) and supported Yasser Arafat's terrorist war against Israel. Arafat and Mahmood Abbas and thousands of terrorists were trained by the KGB in guerilla warfare, espionage and demolition. Arafat was a Soviet puppet.
What do you think about your heroes, the Soviet Union, now?
Ever read Death by Government? Communism killed 200 million of its own citizens
And here you guys are singing the praises of Big Joe Stalin? Disgraceful
| bucheon bum wrote: |
| Or that Israel's economic policy was socialist up until the 90s. |
So why do modern-day socialists love the Palestinians so much? Oh yeah, I forgot. The first thing you do when you're a peace-loving hippy is support mass-murdering Islamic fascists. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
| Polls are notoriously unreliable. |
This is a definite truth that could do with being repeated. Particularly when it comes to the vagueries of politics, statistical surveys very often go wrong. |
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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
| E_athlete wrote: |
| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
A poll of 800 people is insufficient for the conclusion you appear to have drawn (in your thread title)
hasty generalization fallacy |
you do realize scientific surveys use statistical sampling methods ? |
Doesn't matter a jot. |
| Fox wrote: |
| This is a definite truth that could do with being repeated. Particularly when it comes to the vagueries of politics, statistical surveys very often go wrong. |
It doesn't matter if it was a scientific sample representative of the general population of US voters???
But the survey you, Sergio, did of one (yourself) IS representative of the general population?
Are polls just a plot then to fool the readers? You are definitely neither a scientist, mathematician, nor statistician. Are you a conspiracy theorist? |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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| bacasper wrote: |
| It doesn't matter if it was a scientific sample representative of the general population of US voters??? |
It matters, but it doesn't assure that the results are correct. I'm also in no way certain this particular poll was a properly representative scientific sample (though I'm not saying it's not either, I didn't see that data detailed in the article you posted).
| bacasper wrote: |
| But the survey you, Sergio, did of one (yourself) IS representative of the general population? |
Show me where in this thread I said anything about my own opinion on what the American population's overall support for Palestine or Israel is. Alternatively, stop straw manning me; making up a claim for me then arguing against that claim is ridiculous.
| bacasper wrote: |
| Are polls just a plot then to fool the readers? |
You are reacting remarkably strongly to the assertion that not all polls mesh with reality. Perhaps you should calm down and reevaluate exactly what I said, namely that an individual poll -- particularly an individual political opinion poll -- is not necessarily accurate. |
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