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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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kabrams
Joined: 15 Mar 2008
Location: your Dad's house
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 Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2009 11:27 pm Post subject: OK, fess up: Who wrote this wikipedia article? |
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hagwon
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Native-speaker instructors
Many native English-speakers are hired to teach at English-language institutes in Korea, referred to as 'yeong-eoh hagwon' which translates as English private school. The minimum requirements for such teaching positions are citizenship of USA, Canada, United Kingdom, Ireland, Australia, New Zealand or South Africa, and a full university degree obtained in the country of citizenship. In return for signing a one-year contract, the institute provides an instructor with a monthly salary, round-trip airfare from his or her country of origin, a rent-free apartment or housing stipend for the duration of the instructor's contract, and an additional one month "severance pay" at the completion of the contract.
Many recruiting companies exist to hire native English speakers for Korean private schools. Some are based in the US and Canada, while others are Korean-owned. While some of these recruiting companies provide decent services, many of them have earned a reputation of being shady and willing to lie and even fabricate diplomas to get teachers to work in Korea.
English private schools frequently experience staff problems and conflicts between Korean staff and foreign teachers. Many Korean managers are surprised or unhappy that foreign teachers are unwilling to perform duties not explicitly outlined in their contracts or remain on school premises when not teaching scheduled classes. Special events, summer camps and field trips can also lead to teachers being asked - in some cases, effectively forced - to work extra hours, sometimes for little or no recompense. Similarly, there are foreigners who are unable to adapt to the new work and cultural environment, or are simply inexperienced teachers, which can lead to problems with not only management but also students and their families. Given that foreign instructors are generally economic migrants who would not otherwise have moved to South Korea, the ability and willingness of schools to pay salaries and bonuses in a timely manner, maintain mutually acceptable expectations of attendance and performance, and adhere to tax, healthcare and general employment regulations tends to be proportionate to the morale and goodwill of their foreign instructors.
There are also teaching opportunities in neighboring countries such as China, Japan and Taiwan. The average salary and / or ability to save money in these countries, however, tends to be lower than that of South Korea. Salaries are typically higher in larger cities, but so too is the cost of living. |
This is why Wikipedia can never be a truly great resource. People don't understand that it's supposed to be a dictionary, not an advice column or blog entry.
What is this, even? |
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eIn07912
Joined: 06 Dec 2008
Location: seoul
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 12:45 am Post subject: |
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Ummm... that was like 98% true. Had I read something like that before coming over, it would have better prepared me for, what can be at times, a difficult road.
What is your beef with it? |
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Chet Wautlands
Joined: 11 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 12:51 am Post subject: |
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| I'm sure the beef with it would be the tone of the article. Also, it is mostly discusses the experience of foreign teachers working at Korean hagwons. It's comparable to an article about NamDaeMun that only talks about where foreigners can get stuff that they miss from back home. |
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CA-NA-DA-ABC
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 12:52 am Post subject: |
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| eIn07912 wrote: |
Ummm... that was like 98% true. Had I read something like that before coming over, it would have better prepared me for, what can be at times, a difficult road.
What is your beef with it? |
You've obviously never read an encyclopedia article before. |
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eIn07912
Joined: 06 Dec 2008
Location: seoul
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 1:00 am Post subject: |
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| CA-NA-DA-ABC wrote: |
| eIn07912 wrote: |
Ummm... that was like 98% true. Had I read something like that before coming over, it would have better prepared me for, what can be at times, a difficult road.
What is your beef with it? |
You've obviously never read an encyclopedia article before. |
Oh. Ouch. That stings. Please stop. 
Perhaps it was a little lop-sided on the negative side, but that's why wikipedia is a WIKI, friggin write a more balanced version if you don't like it.
Besides, can anyone argue that all that said is Not true? You can't. Because well know good and darn well that it is. Maybe it didn't happen to you, but we've all known or heard about it happening to others. |
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Konglishman
Joined: 14 Sep 2007
Location: Nanjing
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 1:18 am Post subject: |
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| There is nothing wrong with what is written in the wikipedia article. The real problem is what is not written. There is should be separate sections in the wikipedia article discussing other types of hagwons. |
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thurst
Joined: 08 Apr 2009
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 2:38 am Post subject: |
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| none of it is cited and most of it is irrelevant to the topic. if that was in the "hagwon" section of a wiki on the esl field then it'd be passable as it stands though, all i know is that english teachers may or may not be getting the shaft at hagwons.great, who cares? at least that's what i would say if i was actually wanted to know a little about hagwons before reading that. |
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jsk
Joined: 31 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 3:20 am Post subject: |
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I admit I chuckled when I read the entry (now changed) for Wonju a few days ago:
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Many people have described Wonju, as a fun pact place with many things to do. However, these people have generally not visited Wonju. The city's name also, is very misleading, as there are in fact 2. Dave and Geoff, who can be found most days at Wonju's tiny synagogue. Wonju is located 2 hours away from Seoul, with excellent bus terminals making escape both easy and affordable.
......
An active foreign population of 100+ teachers and soldiers exists, but most of them would prefer to exist somewhere else.
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Bondrock
Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Location: ^_^
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 3:27 am Post subject: |
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| jsk wrote: |
I admit I chuckled when I read the entry (now changed) for Wonju a few days ago:
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Many people have described Wonju, as a fun pact place with many things to do. However, these people have generally not visited Wonju. The city's name also, is very misleading, as there are in fact 2. Dave and Geoff, who can be found most days at Wonju's tiny synagogue. Wonju is located 2 hours away from Seoul, with excellent bus terminals making escape both easy and affordable.
......
An active foreign population of 100+ teachers and soldiers exists, but most of them would prefer to exist somewhere else.
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a synagogue for two....
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Carla
Joined: 21 Nov 2008
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 5:16 am Post subject: Re: OK, fess up: Who wrote this wikipedia article? |
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| kabrams wrote: |
This is why Wikipedia can never be a truly great resource. People don't understand that it's supposed to be a dictionary, not an advice column or blog entry.
What is this, even? |
Ummm..... Non-profit? |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 5:56 am Post subject: |
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| I believe the term for this is 'wikiality' if I'm not mistaken |
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Moldy Rutabaga
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Location: Ansan, Korea
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 6:06 am Post subject: |
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Several times I have added information to Wikipedia's Busan entry with information that I feel is useful but unflattering. It is always removed. Thus I'm just surprised that the entry stands, and doesn't portray the foreign teacher as the villain!
While the entry isn't very objective, I'm also not seeing anything that I wouldn't mostly consider true. Some of us on this board have information web sites about ESL teaching here, and perhaps we could edit the entry to make it more neutral and also add our links at the bottom of the entry as further information. Just an idea.
Ken:> |
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crossmr
Joined: 22 Nov 2008
Location: Hwayangdong, Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 6:43 am Post subject: |
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If you really want to work on articles on wikipedia, I recommend giving these a read:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Verifiability
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:No_original_research
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Neutral_point_of_view
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:What_Wikipedia_is_not
In a nutshell basically anything that you add that is likely to be questioned needs to come from a source that is considered "reliable", that means any source which has a reputation for fact checking, editorial oversight, etc. this disqualifies things like blogs, forums, hobby sites, etc
A lot of the Korea articles are in desperate need of attention. Many Koreans who want to edit, aren't quite there in English which can lead to issues, or just there to fight with Japanese editors over articles like "comfort women" or dokdo
And while we can't read a lot of Korean news articles, or korean academic books, we can still write non-controversial descriptions of places, add appropriate photos (you can take some and upload those on Commons), and perhaps use some of the english newspapers, tourist sites, signs at locations, etc to add info. |
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kabrams
Joined: 15 Mar 2008
Location: your Dad's house
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 4:57 pm Post subject: Re: OK, fess up: Who wrote this wikipedia article? |
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| Carla wrote: |
| kabrams wrote: |
This is why Wikipedia can never be a truly great resource. People don't understand that it's supposed to be a dictionary, not an advice column or blog entry.
What is this, even? |
Ummm..... Non-profit? |
Come on, Carla! Non-profit doesn't mean bad quality. What's up with the lowered expectations for Wikipedia?
It could be a truly amazing resource if people would put a little more effort into actually researching and citing what they write in the article, and not giving advice, commentary or opinions. That's what WikiTravel is for.
Also, further up I meant "encyclopedia" not "dictionary". Someone edit me! Oh wait... |
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mc_jc
Joined: 13 Aug 2009
Location: C4B- Cp Red Cloud, Area-I
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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| So does this mean that I shouldn't take the information someone posts from Wikipedia on this forum from now on? |
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