Site Search:
 
Speak Korean Now!
Teach English Abroad and Get Paid to see the World!
Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

How long should you wait to get your final pay?
Goto page Previous  1, 2
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Job-related Discussion Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Carla



Joined: 21 Nov 2008

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OculisOrbis wrote:
no, sorry. an employer may choose to be generous, but they are required to calculate severance for completed years only.


That's not what the ministry of labor says.

From their website... ※ Amount of retirement pay = Amount of average wage x 30 days x [( ) years+( ) days
/ 365 ]

You can see in their calculation they have a spot for days, not only years.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
iggyb



Joined: 29 Oct 2003

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The pension money you get when you finish your contract is your severance, it is just not called pension, unless you mean you went to the pension office and said you were leaving Korea and filed for your government pension.

I seem to remember that back in the 90s, when I finished a contract with a school, I got the one month severance pay and a "refund" of the money I'd paid thus far into the pension fund. And I wasn't leaving Korea at the time but going to a different hakwon.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Carla



Joined: 21 Nov 2008

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iggyb wrote:
Quote:
The pension money you get when you finish your contract is your severance, it is just not called pension, unless you mean you went to the pension office and said you were leaving Korea and filed for your government pension.

I seem to remember that back in the 90s, when I finished a contract with a school, I got the one month severance pay and a "refund" of the money I'd paid thus far into the pension fund. And I wasn't leaving Korea at the time but going to a different hakwon.


So in the 90's, they automatically refunded your national pension at the end of the contract?

Cool. Wonder why they changed it? Maybe because of the amount of foreigners who stay in Korea?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Carla



Joined: 21 Nov 2008

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This was posted on the Ministry of Labor website on JUNE 4, 2009, so it is the most up to date thing I could find.

1. Pursuant to the Employee Retirement Benefit Security Act, an employer shall pay workers
who retire 30 days or more of average wages for each year of their consecutive service as
retirement pay within 14 days from the date on which there occurs a cause for the payment.

○ Calculation of retirement pay
- Statutory retirement pay = daily average wage � 30 (days) �
(total days of service/ 365)

So, for 2mil won, average daily wage is ...66,667.

So, let's say you worked 18 months. That's... 548 days.
(rounding out to whole numbers)

(66,667) x 30 x (548/365)
(66,667) x 30 x (1.5)
====== w 3,000,015

Reading this post makes me wonder how many people have been cheated because they didn't know better, or who took the severance at the 1st year because they didn't know it would continue building.


Last edited by Carla on Tue Sep 01, 2009 4:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Carla



Joined: 21 Nov 2008

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, even better, here is the example the Ministry of Labor provided.

Quote:
※ How to calculate legal retirement pay(as an example)
� Legal retirement pay = daily average wages � 30 days �
( total number of days in service/365)
� (e.g.) A period in service : Aug.20,2000 ~ Jul.16,2003(1,060 days),
daily average wages = 50,000 won.
Retirement pay= 50,000won �30days�1,060days/365days=4,356,160 won.


If you notice, it is not 3 full years, and the calculation is not based on years, but days.

New people, do not get confused as to what I am saying. If you only work a partial first year, you get nothing. The labor law specifically states you are only entitled to severance after 1 COMPLETE year. We are talking about if you work longer than 1 year anywhere. This applies to foreigners and koreans alike. This is the law, and the law overrules illegal clauses in contracts.

edited to add quote box
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Carla



Joined: 21 Nov 2008

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, and the 3 month thing is how they calculate your "average daily wage" not your severance, but then your "average daily wage" is used for your severance.

So in effect, if you work 1 year exactly, then the average of your last 3 months is the same thing, but anything over a year, and you are being cheated out of money if all you got was 1 months salary.

Quote:
♠ Average wages are the amount calculated by dividing the total amount of wages paid to the relevant worker during three calendar months prior to the date of calculation by the total number of calendar days during those three calendar months.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
lifeinkorea



Joined: 24 Jan 2009
Location: somewhere in China

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
you are being cheated out of money if all you got was 1 months salary.


Do you mean cheated if you only got 1 months salary without overtime assumed or do you mean cheated if you got 1 months salary, overtime, and some figure added (the mystery amount) to these 2 (which probably reflects the number of months after the full year)?

Example

1) 2.1 / 2.1 severance (no overtime)
2) 2.1 / 2.1 severance (without overtime which you did)
3) 2.1 / 2.1 severance (without overtime, which you did, and without 3 months more which you did)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Carla



Joined: 21 Nov 2008

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lifeinkorea wrote:
Quote:
you are being cheated out of money if all you got was 1 months salary.


Do you mean cheated if you only got 1 months salary without overtime assumed or do you mean cheated if you got 1 months salary, overtime, and some figure added (the mystery amount) to these 2 (which probably reflects the number of months after the full year)?

Example

1) 2.1 / 2.1 severance (no overtime)
2) 2.1 / 2.1 severance (without overtime which you did)
3) 2.1 / 2.1 severance (without overtime, which you did, and without 3 months more which you did)


The overtime counts if you got it in your last three months because they would use that to do your "average wage." In your examples, 1 and 2 are working just a year, right? 1 is correct. 2 is not if the overtime occurred during the last 3 months (but probably not worth the hassle for you to pursue unless you were doing some serious overtime.)

3 is totally wrong if you worked a total of 15 months. Let's take out the overtime since it varies and you didn't give a specific number.

Statutory retirement pay = daw (70,000) � 30 (days) � (456/ 365)
= 70,000 x 30 x 1.25
= 2,625,000

So, in case number 3, you were owed 525,000 not including overtime.

edit: This only applies if you DID NOT take your severance at the 1 year mark. If you take your severance, you restart the clock and would have to work another complete year to be eligible for another severance. Probably a reason some schools are eager to give your severance when you complete your contract and renew. If you get your severance and quit later, they owe you nothing. If you don't get your severance and quit later, they owe you up to the date you quit.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also just to be clear. You can only include OT in the severance payment if you worked OT in the last three months. So what some schools could do is load a lot of OT on in the first nine months and none for the last three, and pay you a regular month's pay for severance...and that would be totally legal.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Carla



Joined: 21 Nov 2008

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheUrbanMyth wrote:
Also just to be clear. You can only include OT in the severance payment if you worked OT in the last three months. So what some schools could do is load a lot of OT on in the first nine months and none for the last three, and pay you a regular month's pay for severance...and that would be totally legal.


Bingo
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
lifeinkorea



Joined: 24 Jan 2009
Location: somewhere in China

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carla,

I am still unclear, can you give a SIMPLE SIMPLE example? Retirement pay is not the same as severance.

How much can we expect?

2.1 salary, NO overtime. Let's say everything comes out to 2.1 in theory, and I work 18 months and quit (giving proper notice and all).

So, that would be:

2.1 X A = severance

or

2.1 + A = severance

Severance equals which, and which method are you using to get severance?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Carla



Joined: 21 Nov 2008

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lifeinkorea wrote:
Carla,

I am still unclear, can you give a SIMPLE SIMPLE example? Retirement pay is not the same as severance.

How much can we expect?

2.1 salary, NO overtime. Let's say everything comes out to 2.1 in theory, and I work 18 months and quit (giving proper notice and all).

So, that would be:

2.1 X A = severance

or

2.1 + A = severance

Severance equals which, and which method are you using to get severance?


Ok, retirement pay is severance, it's the same thing. Then you have the government "pension." But that's not what we're talking about here, just the retirement/severance. (To clear that up, severance is the retirement pay that the Korean government forces businesses to provide themselves. It's like when you work at a company that has it's own retirement plan in the US, so you get that, plus you get social security when you hit the "magic" age. Severance is the company one, and pension is their version of social security.)

OK, I forgot to quote the formula before, so this is the Ministry of Labor formula.

Quote:
○ Calculation of retirement pay
- Statutory retirement pay = daily average wage � 30 (days) �
(total days of service/ 365)


So, your monthly average was 2.1mil, so you daily average would be 70k.
18 months would be 548 days.

So your formula would be = 70,000 � 30 (days) � (548/ 365)
= 70,000 x 30 x (1.5)
= 3,150,000

Which is 1,050,000 more than just 1 month severance.

Just for kicks, I calculated 2 more weeks (14 days) and it went up by w72,000. Just so you know every 2 weeks how much your adding to your severance. Nice thought... Smile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
br_owen



Joined: 10 Jun 2008

PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok, color me retarded but i'm still slightly confused.

Here's my situation. Forget about overtime and all that stuff - i'll be happy just sticking to my normal contacted hours.

I completed my first year, and received my severance payment, in full, the first month i came back to start my second contract at the same school. No problems, everything was done correctly. It was basically an extra months salary in full.

In my second year, I am leaving after 6 months. Am i entitled to what would be the equivalent of half a months salary? Or have I shot myself in the foot by already collecting my severance pay for the first year, and not letting it build?

Thank you for any help.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
OculisOrbis



Joined: 17 Jul 2006

PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 11:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

no. if you took a payment after the first year, your clock resets to zero and you would have to complete another full year to eligible for another payment. if you didnt take a payment after one year, then yes, you would get approx 1.5 months worth as a severance payment.

if youre at a hagwon, dont look at it as shooting yourself in the foot. its better described as playing it safe.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Job-related Discussion Forum All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International