Korean Job Discussion Forums

[curiousaboutkorea]

Ok, so I haven't been in Korea terribly long (6 and a half months), but I was wondering if people take note of bars, restaurants etc. that discriminate (against foreigners). So yes, tonight was my first time that I was told explicitly I was being treated differently because I am a foreigner. I know it relatively minor; we weren't denied entry, but were told that since we are foreigners, we'd have to pay before we received our drink order. I know this stuff is common. I've dealt with this a bit of this baloney before; in those cases the discrimination was implicit.

So does anyone keep track of these establishments (in popular areas that is)? Are there blacklisted places? This experience tonight just kind of got me thinking... Not to mention, I caught a student rambling on in Korean about how she was afraid of me because she thought I had swine flu since I'm a waygookin.

And yes, I probably sound like a newbie talking; I am fully aware that this stuff is very commonplace and I am not taking it personally.

[coralreefer_1]

Personally I like your idea, and I would hope this would become a sticky, though I'm sure it wont.

As the foreign population will only increase in time, this seems like a small, but yet viable market to be considered. Of course the vast majority of foreigners in Korea are not ESL'ers or read this board, but I think these kinds of things find their way around over time.

Economic power is the only power we have. I say name the place in question so everyone knows where it is, and what to expect should they choose to go there, or hopefully, not go there. Maybe this thread will give the KH or the KT something to write about at some point in the future.

[Css]

So are you gonna tell us where this happened to you?

[sluggle]

These type of blacklists are vulnerable to corruption. A teacher could get vindictive against a bar that cut them off/kicked them out for being too drunk, and claim discrimination. Or business owners could post anonymously to smear competition.

It would need to be carefully organized so that emphasis is based on the amount of complaints against a business, and the type of people that complain (the older, recognized community members should have more weight)

[Forward Observer]

Can't tell you guys how many times over the past 14 years I've heard about/seen for myself teachers and G.I.s alike run out on paying their drink/bar bill or taxi fare. NO it's not the majority, small minority of people that do it, but still - it happens. Likely that this particular establishment had something happen recently. 3 Alley either asks you to pay when they bring you your drink, or give them a credit card to run a tab, as probably most other bars in Itaewon do, so it's not a big deal.

Roll with it

[benji1422]

Korean women are crazy about foreign guys (whether they show it or not, is a different story) ESPECIALLY in all-korean, non-foreigner friendly areas... so I take getting denied/treated differently by such businesses where I might be tempting a k-lass as tipping the karmic dude scale back to an even level. I see it happen to the brothas in suburban sports bars and I fully expect that s-- in asia.

[i]

I've been refused service a couple of times, but in way more instances, I've been given "service" like an appetizer or drink because I'm foreign, or given special attention. But most of the time, this happens outside of Seoul. Restaurants around my home are very kind and courteous to me, even if just walking by.
When I was refused service, there might have been a reason. 2 times I can think of, I was alone. Possible they wanted more than one person to fill the tables that remained to make more money. Who wants a single foreigner filling up a table when some businessmen might come along and buy up all the soju and order anju for 5 hours?

[I'm no Picasso]

[Zulethe]

I personally believe establishments should have the right to discriminate. What's wrong with wanting to have an establishment that exclusively caters to select clients? It's done all the time through out the world.

For example, in America I would have loved to have found an all male gym, no you homophobes (not the poster) not for that reason but because I hate the distractions of having females in the gym.

Of course there are all female gyms all over the place but no one screams discrimination. Then again, to be fair, there may not be a market for all male gyms.

I'd also like to be able to start any type of establishment with criteria for entry without being called a racist, bigot or whatever.

I think there's nothing wrong with Koreans wanting to go some place and relax without having to look at the waygook. I know I do.

[coralreefer_1]

[redaxe]

There's no need for such a list because very, very few restaurants/bars discriminate against foreigners. Don't worry, they want your money at least as much as you want that drink. I've only had a couple of places in Hongdae (such as HO BAR) ask me to pay upfront because I'm a foreigner, and those same places also tend to have "No G.I." signs. I can only assume that this is because they've had problems in the past.

The places that probably do discriminate against foreigners, though, are the booking clubs and the anma / double barber pole places (can't say from experience). Those are places where middle-aged Korean men go when they are looking for sex, and I doubt they'd be comfortable with seeing white foreigners hanging around. And I don't think you will find a "blacklist" for those.

[crossmr]

[eIn07912]

I'm all for this. I can't remember the exact places, but I have been discriminated against, unfairy I might add. I've also been give preferential treatment at others. So I pose a dual system...

The Black List - Businesses that have a proven record of unfairly discriminating against foreigners, simply for the reason they are foreigners. This does not count waegoods that were thrown out of bars for having too much to drink or ejected from businesses for being douches. To that end, a business should only make it on the black list when there have been at least 2 or 3 seperate reports of unfair treatment. One is simply not enough.

The Green List - Businesses that have proven to be fair practice examples or those that go above and beyond the expected service. I don't mean all should treat us differently, but those that do so, on their own accord, shold be recognized for it. It should only take 1 report of a business treating them well to make it on the list. (P.S. I was going to call this The Gold List but there was no gold font color)

I don't see why we shouldn't compile this information. The foreign population has the ability to build or destroy a business based on our buying power. We have more money than a large part of the population, and probably contribute more in single visits or settings than many locals.

If this picks up steam, it might be cool to see if The Groove Magazine would be willing to print it once and a while.

[steveinincheon]

Most bars in big cities in North America that I've been to require you to either pay when you get your drink, or to start a tab. In Korea the only places where I've had to do this are places in Seoul that have a lot of foreign customers. If you want to live in a part of Korea that has a lot of Western style establishments and a big expat scene, expect those establishments to follow Western style practices (such as bouncers, paying in advance and getting cut off). with their Western patrons.

Elsewhere in Korea you might get some stares if you enter a typical ajeossi soju Hof, but every time I've been to one Korean practices rather than Western ones apply. The only places in Korea where I think there is obvious bias against foreigners are in brothels and booking clubs - and the booking clubs generally arent are a problem if you go with a group of Koreans.

[mayorgc]