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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:49 am Post subject: |
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| And that is probably why C has been rather stagnant the past few months. No one really thinks it looks good in the long-term. Jumped up because people figured they could make a quick buck. They did, then sold off enough to insure they made money off of their investment. |
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jaykimf
Joined: 24 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 12:25 pm Post subject: |
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| mises wrote: |
I suspect that virtually every single holder of C is using the equity markets as a casino, like you. The HAL-bots are pumping it up and the brokers and making their calls dumping on their Fast Money watching clients. C is an insolvent firm and at some point one person walks away from the table with all the chips. Just like in a casino, the casino wins.
So yes. I know what a calculated risk is. I also know what a gamed market is. |
I believe the economy and market will recover nicely over time and have invested in a broad range of securities (including citibank) that I believe will pay off handsomely in the long run. You seem to think we are near the beginning of a 10-15 year depression and are looking for a safe riskless investment that will give you a nice return. Good luck with that. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 12:31 pm Post subject: |
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| And to you. |
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jaykimf
Joined: 24 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 12:44 pm Post subject: |
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| bucheon bum wrote: |
| And that is probably why C has been rather stagnant the past few months. No one really thinks it looks good in the long-term. Jumped up because people figured they could make a quick buck. They did, then sold off enough to insure they made money off of their investment. |
No one? " The Kuwait Investment Authority (KIA) has no intention to sell its investments in Merrill Lynch or Citigroup in the short term, as the authority relies in its investment policies on a long-term look,"
http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKL622584520090906?feedType=RSS&feedName=rbssFinancialServicesAndRealEstateNews |
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Pluto
Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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| jaykimf wrote: |
| bucheon bum wrote: |
jay, it takes no genius to have figured that Citigroup would have gone up from $1/share, especially when the gov't decided to step in. If I weren't a broke grad student, I would have certainly bought the stock (and sold it by now).
Question is: do you still own it? If so, why? |
Yes I still own it because I believe it will go up even more. It may take several years to work through its current problems, but ultimately I believe it will survive. If it succeeds in turning itself around, in 5 years it could well be a $50 stock. If it doesn't survive and I lose the whole amount, the relatively small amount of my portfolio that I lost on C should be more than offset by the gains by the other stocks I bought about the same time--Bank of america up about 80%, Barclays almost tripled, Chase up 35% and USB and GE flat so far. Do you think all of those are going to broke too? Even if they do, the whole lot is just a small % of my portfolio. The market as a whole is up about 50%. Do you think the entire market is going to go bankrupt too? Citibank and the other banks are a calculated risk. At the prices they were selling at, the potential returns far outweigh the chump change prices they were selling at. The market was dominated by fear and panic and the possibility of the imminent collapse of the entire system. I believe the economy and market will recover. I don't believe the end of the world is at hand.What we had was a buying opportunity like we very rarely ever get. Considering the recent runup, the short term prospects don't look particularly promising. In the long term , the prospects are excellent if you believe the economy will recover (as I do). I am not a short term trader. I'm a buy and hold investor. I've bought and now I'm holding.The sun also rises. |
Are you throwing all of your money into financials? If you�re a bit of a risk taker and want to take the long bet on C, sure, I can understand that. But, then you want to throw even more assets into BoA, JPM Chase, Barclays et al. on top of that? I hope not. I, as a CFP, would not in a million years � never!--, advise my clients to make such a foolish bet. �The market� consists of more than financials. If you like the riskier bets, you might want to start moving into Kraft. Or perhaps mitigate such uncertain risk by moving some of your assets into a money market account. |
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jaykimf
Joined: 24 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Pluto wrote: |
| jaykimf wrote: |
| bucheon bum wrote: |
jay, it takes no genius to have figured that Citigroup would have gone up from $1/share, especially when the gov't decided to step in. If I weren't a broke grad student, I would have certainly bought the stock (and sold it by now).
Question is: do you still own it? If so, why? |
Yes I still own it because I believe it will go up even more. It may take several years to work through its current problems, but ultimately I believe it will survive. If it succeeds in turning itself around, in 5 years it could well be a $50 stock. If it doesn't survive and I lose the whole amount, the relatively small amount of my portfolio that I lost on C should be more than offset by the gains by the other stocks I bought about the same time--Bank of america up about 80%, Barclays almost tripled, Chase up 35% and USB and GE flat so far. Do you think all of those are going to broke too? Even if they do, the whole lot is just a small % of my portfolio. The market as a whole is up about 50%. Do you think the entire market is going to go bankrupt too? Citibank and the other banks are a calculated risk. At the prices they were selling at, the potential returns far outweigh the chump change prices they were selling at. The market was dominated by fear and panic and the possibility of the imminent collapse of the entire system. I believe the economy and market will recover. I don't believe the end of the world is at hand.What we had was a buying opportunity like we very rarely ever get. Considering the recent runup, the short term prospects don't look particularly promising. In the long term , the prospects are excellent if you believe the economy will recover (as I do). I am not a short term trader. I'm a buy and hold investor. I've bought and now I'm holding.The sun also rises. |
Are you throwing all of your money into financials? If you�re a bit of a risk taker and want to take the long bet on C, sure, I can understand that. But, then you want to throw even more assets into BoA, JPM Chase, Barclays et al. on top of that? I hope not. I, as a CFP, would not in a million years � never!--, advise my clients to make such a foolish bet. �The market� consists of more than financials. If you like the riskier bets, you might want to start moving into Kraft. Or perhaps mitigate such uncertain risk by moving some of your assets into a money market account. |
I'm glad that you can understand. I piled into financials because at the time it looked like the most hated, beaten down oversold sector there was. I selected a group of stocks because I didn't want to risk betting my investment on any single stock such as citigroup that might end up worthless. I figured that even if 2 of that group went bankrupt , the rest of the group would gradually recover and I would more than break even considering the fire sale prices I paid. Anyway, my total investment in the group was and is less than 5% of my portfolio. Thanks for your concern. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| jaykimf wrote: |
| bucheon bum wrote: |
| And that is probably why C has been rather stagnant the past few months. No one really thinks it looks good in the long-term. Jumped up because people figured they could make a quick buck. They did, then sold off enough to insure they made money off of their investment. |
No one? " The Kuwait Investment Authority (KIA) has no intention to sell its investments in Merrill Lynch or Citigroup in the short term, as the authority relies in its investment policies on a long-term look,"
http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKL622584520090906?feedType=RSS&feedName=rbssFinancialServicesAndRealEstateNews |
Well good luck to the KIA as well. |
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