|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
No_hite_pls
Joined: 05 Mar 2007
Location: Don't hate me because I'm right
|
 Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 5:09 am Post subject: Another fat lazy American wanting specail treatment |
 |
|
I am sick of fat lazy Americans wanting health insurance. They need to start going to the gym and working out, maybe they could get a personal trainer but I for one don't want my tax dollars going to these fat lazy people.
Go to gym people!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wM8kDZd4Q-c |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
chris_J2
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: From Brisbane, Au.
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 5:24 am Post subject: Health care |
|
|
Most of your tax dollars are in fact, going to health insurance companies, & drug companies, in collusion, who continue to raise prices & gouge the consumer. Maybe the legal system in the US needs an overhaul too? There are several other threads that have discussed Obama's proposed healthcare changes, in a rational, non accusatory manner.
You might want to correct the typo, too (special). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 6:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
On the video above you can see a stupid man boasting of his complete ignorance, making an ass of himself, and not having the wit to realize that he is a fool.
Just what is insurance? God almighty. Will someone please take a class in something before making videos about nonsense? Socialists have made themselves stupid intentionally!
Insurance.
Insurance is a pool made of individuals who share common characteristics and measurable risks that have a small chance of occurance and a predictable pattern of incidence, so as to allow the computation of actuarily determined future costs that allow the members of the pool the opportunity to "insure" against the major financial loss that may befall those who suffer the statistically unlikely misfortune of the actual occurance, by contributing small amounts to a pool by a large number of individuals that allows payment to those few who suffer a covered loss.
The likelyhood of the event must be small.
The members of the pool must be nearly the same.
The risk must be understood and predictable.
Events outside those covered, and individuals who are not homogeneous to the pool, must be excluded.
So, if a fat baby does not match the characteristics of the insured pool of individuals, he or she must be excluded. This is a good thing. If the government would just get out of the way, some other people could make an insurance pool for the obese, and the fat baby could be covered, at the appropriate cost.
In a free market, insurance could be offered by private, profit making enterprises, charitable organizations, neighborhood associations, mutual assurance societies, cooperatives and any other voluntary group. The fascist-socialist government of the US has all but precluded the opportunity to create alternative, competitive insurance institutions. Socialism has failed again. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
chris_J2
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: From Brisbane, Au.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jaykimf
Joined: 24 Apr 2004
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ontheway wrote: |
On the video above you can see a stupid man boasting of his complete ignorance, making an ass of himself, and not having the wit to realize that he is a fool.
Just what is insurance? God almighty. Will someone please take a class in something before making videos about nonsense? Socialists have made themselves stupid intentionally!
Insurance.
Insurance is a pool made of individuals who share common characteristics and measurable risks that have a small chance of occurance and a predictable pattern of incidence, so as to allow the computation of actuarily determined future costs that allow the members of the pool the opportunity to "insure" against the major financial loss that may befall those who suffer the statistically unlikely misfortune of the actual occurance, by contributing small amounts to a pool by a large number of individuals that allows payment to those few who suffer a covered loss.
The likelyhood of the event must be small.
The members of the pool must be nearly the same.
The risk must be understood and predictable.
Events outside those covered, and individuals who are not homogeneous to the pool, must be excluded.
So, if a fat baby does not match the characteristics of the insured pool of individuals, he or she must be excluded. This is a good thing. If the government would just get out of the way, some other people could make an insurance pool for the obese, and the fat baby could be covered, at the appropriate cost.
In a free market, insurance could be offered by private, profit making enterprises, charitable organizations, neighborhood associations, mutual assurance societies, cooperatives and any other voluntary group. The fascist-socialist government of the US has all but precluded the opportunity to create alternative, competitive insurance institutions. Socialism has failed again. |
you can see a stupid man boasting of his complete ignorance, making an ass of himself, and not having the wit to realize that he is a fool. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
RufusW
Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Location: Busan
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 8:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ontheway wrote: |
| ...the fat baby could be covered, at the appropriate cost. |
You fail to understand why socialized medicine exists - to cover those who can't afford it. You may think they shouldn't get it if they're poor - if you do you're heartless. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
visitorq
Joined: 11 Jan 2008
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 11:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| RufusW wrote: |
| ontheway wrote: |
| ...the fat baby could be covered, at the appropriate cost. |
You fail to understand why socialized medicine exists - to cover those who can't afford it. You may think they shouldn't get it if they're poor - if you do you're heartless. |
You're missing the point. Which is that socialism impoverishes people, makes them dependent on the state, and then you feel lucky to take what you can get. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Street Magic
Joined: 23 Sep 2009
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ontheway wrote: |
Just what is insurance? God almighty. Will someone please take a class in something before making videos about nonsense? Socialists have made themselves stupid intentionally!
...
In a free market, insurance could be offered by private, profit making enterprises, charitable organizations, neighborhood associations, mutual assurance societies, cooperatives and any other voluntary group. The fascist-socialist government of the US has all but precluded the opportunity to create alternative, competitive insurance institutions. Socialism has failed again. |
I'm no fan of that youtube series, but the guy didn't say anything inaccurate about insurance. Actuarial work is an art as much as it's a science. You don't just plug in all the statistics and get one magical answer to how everything should be run for maximum profits. Most would agree that the added risk of cost posed by extending coverage to otherwise healthy heavy babies is outweighed by the social benefits of doing so. I personally don't care about babies or really anyone other than myself, but I still acknowledge that other people are going to need access to certain services and that the upset majority will eventually force whomever they can to make that access available one way or another because of that need.
If we're talking about luxuries, then of course people should pay more for more expensive things. This is about a basic civilized need though and in the overwhelming majority of the cases relevant to this discussion, no one is actively choosing to consume anything. We don't have police insurance to cover different people in different homogeneous groups of estimated cost risk. We don't deny legal services to families of murder victims because the average person doesn't have a murdered family member and that puts them in a different statistical risk pool.
No group is going to form to fix this problem in a free market system. It's not as though government pressures are preventing insurance companies from creating high risk coverage for groups like fat babies and others with similar estimated costs, and even if we could do something to promote more private coverage for groups like that, they'd still be paying way more than everyone else. This is where the personal responsibility argument breaks down. A heavy baby's family did nothing to shoulder the burden of greatly increased health care coverage costs. There is no reason why this cost should fall on the family rather than be divided and imposed on every contributor to the system. Either way, there's an extra expected cost that needs to be covered and someone who has nothing to do with that expected cost is going to be paying for it. Might as well have that cost fall evenly to everyone in a way that's affordable for everyone rather than de facto deny care to those who can't afford it or outright deny care to those who can't find anyone willing to extend them coverage for any rate at all.
I personally have nothing to gain by promoting this point of view. I'm a young adult male American with a securely average height and weight, I have a job and insurance, I have no chronic illnesses, and every realistic outcome for this health care debate will mean equally little in terms of how much it affects my well being. I hold this view only because it makes sense to me and I'm open to any reasonable alternatives. The idea that "socialism causes all of our problems" however is one of the farthest views from reasonable I can think of. It's completely insane that you think any problem of a scope such as this one has is that simple.
A more reasonable variant of that argument might be that continuing to limit government interference will allow more people to receive quality health care so long as charity organizations can be promoted, supported, and otherwise encouraged without the force of legal mandate to cooperate with hospitals to more aggressively fill in the gaps, but it's ridiculous for you to call one of the most hands off private health care systems in the modern developed world an example of socialism failure. I could see where a libertarian health care model might actu | | |
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
