| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Smee
Joined: 24 Dec 2004
Location: Jeollanam-do
|
 Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:20 pm Post subject: Article on "Thoughtless English" in the Herald. |
 |
|
Sorry for the self-plug, but I wrote an article on the overuse of English in Korea, and wanted to share it here.
http://www.koreaherald.co.kr/NEWKHSITE/data/html_dir/2009/11/11/200911110012.asp
A couple excerpt:
| Quote: |
| I've been treated to some articles in the papers lately dealing with English in Korea and asking if there's too much of it, specifically in restaurants, on billboards, and on product labels. I strongly believe there's too much English used in Korea, that this overuse has negative consequences for students of English and regular citizens alike, and that it'd be healthy to use more Korean in Korean. However, one point I always like to make is that the overuse of English in Korea is a domestic phenomenon, one created and continued by Koreans, and any campaign to replace it ought to be a fight for thoughtful language use, not a crusade against a foreign invader. |
. . .
| Quote: |
Some of the English here is what I call "Gibberlish," a portmanteau of gibberish and English that means words or combinations of letters used for decoration. Gibberlish is found when online translation tools are used, creating a meaningless arrangement of words such the sign in Suncheon that reads "Rain blood vessel & skin the government serviece." It is found in pop songs, where rappers and singers will randomly insert English words and phrases, and it exists to such a great extent in the fashion industry that it's tough to buy a t-shirt without ridiculous English on it.
Because much of the English in Korea doesn't make sense to native speakers, isn't created with the intention of being correct or comprehensible, and certainly isn't understood by Koreans, it's fair to ask, why use it at all? |
I've posted it on my site as well with a few more comments and links to othe articles:
http://briandeutsch.blogspot.com/2009/11/in-korea-herald-writing-about.html |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
PeteMoses
Joined: 08 Sep 2009
Location: Scotland
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:22 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| It is found in pop songs, where rappers and singers will randomly insert English words and phrases |
I'm pretty sure this happens in all pop music... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Grumpy Senator
Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Location: Up and down the 6 line
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:23 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Overall, I thought the article was well done until the last paragraph.
The part I am referring to:
"But what I'd really like to emphasize is the recent changes to "Our Language" were brought about by Koreans, and campaigns to prune it shouldn't be waged against English itself or its speakers...."
There is no need to bring up the "potential backlash" against English teachers by Koreans. It is irresponsible and only promotes more separation and bad feelings between the two groups. We should work together to improve the level of English, not feel threatened. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
prideofidaho
Joined: 19 Mar 2008
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| PeteMoses wrote: |
| Quote: |
| It is found in pop songs, where rappers and singers will randomly insert English words and phrases |
I'm pretty sure this happens in all pop music... |
Yes, but that's not to say it isn't incredibly annoying in the classroom. I mean, 'tell me' and 'sorry' were two things I banned myself from saying a year ago. It's such a waste of time to wait for a few class clowns to rattle off the hook for their favourite pop song just 'cause I said one dang word. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdninkorea
Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Location: Seoul
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I agree with the sentiment because all the ridiculous English in Korea bothers me too, but it's a losing battle: changes in languages are bottom-up, and aside from totalitarian countries like North Korea, can't be stopped. Many Koreans think of English and using English as sophisticated, chic, and cosmopolitan.
This campaign is as doomed to fail as the one in the 20th century to preserve the 'h' in words like "white" and "while" and "which." |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
orosee
Joined: 07 Mar 2008
Location: Hannam-dong, Seoul
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| PeteMoses wrote: |
| Quote: |
| It is found in pop songs, where rappers and singers will randomly insert English words and phrases |
I'm pretty sure this happens in all pop music... |
"Let's fighting love!!!" |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Old Gil
Joined: 26 Sep 2009
Location: Got out! olleh!
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
I never wanna hear you say: "I want it that way"/cuz I want it that way
WTF |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nautilus
Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
You are employed precisely because of the Korean obsession with english. I wouldn't knock it if I were you....
Personally I'm grateful for so much english use, especially on street and subway signs. Ever tried getting around japan without being able to read japanese? And also it helps when buying certain products at the supermarket because otherwise I wouldn't have a clue as to what they actually were.
It never ceases to amaze me the lengths that waygukin go to shoot themselves in the foot in this country.Next you'll be writing a letter recommending Korea starts using Chinese more? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
reactionary
Joined: 22 Oct 2006
Location: korreia
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:27 am Post subject: |
|
|
| nautilus wrote: |
You are employed precisely because of the Korean obsession with english. I wouldn't knock it if I were you....
Personally I'm grateful for so much english use, especially on street and subway signs. Ever tried getting around japan without being able to read japanese? And also it helps when buying certain products at the supermarket because otherwise I wouldn't have a clue as to what they actually were.
It never ceases to amaze me the lengths that waygukin go to shoot themselves in the foot in this country.Next you'll be writing a letter recommending Korea starts using Chinese more? |
Japan was pretty similar to Korea in my experience. English on the trains/subways, Korean/Japanese on the bus maps. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
fermentation
Joined: 22 Jun 2009
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:37 am Post subject: |
|
|
| cdninkorea wrote: |
This campaign is as doomed to fail as the one in the 20th century to preserve the 'h' in words like "white" and "while" and "which." |
cool whip. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Joe666
Joined: 19 Nov 2008
Location: Jesus it's hot down here!
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
There's was an interseting little part about certain products having directions/ingredients ets. in English or English converted to hanguel. He writes about the confusion of Koreans who do not study English and try to comprehend the translated wording of said products but doesn't elaborate on why this is a problem or the phenomena itself.
I'm sure the Korean people love these products that originated and were manufactured in the west. When your language does not have a true term for said products, one has to deal with that issue. From what I can see, Hanguel lacks a lot contemporary technological terms. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| The Grumpy Senator wrote: |
Overall, I thought the article was well done until the last paragraph.
The part I am referring to:
"But what I'd really like to emphasize is the recent changes to "Our Language" were brought about by Koreans, and campaigns to prune it shouldn't be waged against English itself or its speakers...."
There is no need to bring up the "potential backlash" against English teachers by Koreans. It is irresponsible and only promotes more separation and bad feelings between the two groups. We should work together to improve the level of English, not feel threatened. |
I agree, much of the article was good.
But the connection between the use of English Gibberish and the backlash against the English Teaching community is tenuous at best. Not every article has to be about that which happens in Korea and how it ends up making English Teachers look like villains. Some people may eat that up, but to me it almost comes across as race victimization- Al Sharptonism if you will (Though the Good Reverend does make his fair share of good points). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Gipkik
Joined: 30 Mar 2009
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Well, I say better bad English than no English. Sorry, grammar police, but this basterdized English is at least becoming common currency and giving students some kind of incentive to actually listen to English songs, read stuff in English on the Internet, and so on. I liken this English to the passage of pidgin to creole to a grammatically correct and functional language. It may sound ugly, but it is the beginning of a necessary process. Throwing perfect grammar at them is in fact the greater problem when it comes to actually getting them to speak and use the stuff. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
definitely maybe
Joined: 16 Feb 2008
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| prideofidaho wrote: |
| PeteMoses wrote: |
| Quote: |
| It is found in pop songs, where rappers and singers will randomly insert English words and phrases |
I'm pretty sure this happens in all pop music... |
Yes, but that's not to say it isn't incredibly annoying in the classroom. I mean, 'tell me' and 'sorry' were two things I banned myself from saying a year ago. It's such a waste of time to wait for a few class clowns to rattle off the hook for their favourite pop song just 'cause I said one dang word. |
Saying "one more time" became impossible for awhile too. It wasn't an easy task getting my old elementary kids to understand "please, repeat," but even their Korean teacher would belt out "baby, one more time" if I said it in class!
I'm not a huge pop fan back home, but the regurgitation of stock phrases and useless inclusion of English in pop here has made our jobs a bit more difficult. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Korean LaoWei
Joined: 01 Apr 2009
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| This is not just a problem that is just in Korea. I have seen similar issues in China and Japan. I was particularly annoyed with this phenomenon when i went to China to visit the in laws. I looked everywhere for a t-shirt with some hangeul to give as a gift to my 6 year old nephew and all i saw was non-sensical English phrases on all the t-shirts. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
