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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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 Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 2:20 am Post subject: Re: So, How's the Hope and Change Going for you So far? |
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| Fox wrote: |
| I agree Obama hasn't done enough to reverse this trend, but it's a trend that's been going on for a long time now, and is realistically probably beyond his powers as President to stop. The real culprits here are the American public, for not holding their elected representatives responsible for this behavior in any real sense of the word. |
The populace can only decide as well as the information given to them is good. With the main media outlets being run as handmaidens to the corporatocracy, it will essentially be impossible for this bourgeois democracy to flourish as it should. |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 2:30 am Post subject: Re: So, How's the Hope and Change Going for you So far? |
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| bacasper wrote: |
The populace can only decide as well as the information given to them is good. |
I've determined that most people prefer the Matrix. When I say 'most' I'm talking about maybe 97-98%, at least.
Even if you were right, what will all this get you? Alot of blank stares, I'd think.
Godspeed, Bacasper. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 2:35 am Post subject: |
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What has Obama achieved domestically besides bailing out the State governments?
Jacksh*t.
And there's still torture at Bagram. |
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nautilus
Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 3:02 am Post subject: |
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Not really impressed by this in particular....
Beijing, Nov 17 (IANS) US President Barack Obama Tuesday said the US government recognises Tibet as a part of China.
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| http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/world-news/us-recognises-tibet-as-part-of-china-obama_100275787.html |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 3:24 am Post subject: Re: So, How's the Hope and Change Going for you So far? |
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| bacasper wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| I agree Obama hasn't done enough to reverse this trend, but it's a trend that's been going on for a long time now, and is realistically probably beyond his powers as President to stop. The real culprits here are the American public, for not holding their elected representatives responsible for this behavior in any real sense of the word. |
The populace can only decide as well as the information given to them is good. With the main media outlets being run as handmaidens to the corporatocracy, it will essentially be impossible for this bourgeois democracy to flourish as it should. |
While I agree with the general principle (that the populace requires accurate information to act correctly), I think regarding fiscal irresponsibility by our government, more than enough information is availible to start voting out representatives in decisive fashion. |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 3:28 am Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
What has Obama achieved domestically besides bailing out the State governments?
Jacksh*t.
And there's still torture at Bagram. |
The man has been a major disappointment, IMO, along with the majority of his party. I wasn't looking to become jaded, but yet here I am.
Washington is apparently broken just up to the point that it still gives the illusion of being a functioning entity. It's currently a complete travesty.
I don't know what it will take to get enough people to be as disgusted as I am with the state of affairs. While I would hope that necessary changes are peacefully realized, I feel that America's electorate has become dangerously politically complacent. Unfortunately, all we're getting right now are largely undereducated and disenfranchised Whites raising their voices.
While I feel sorry for them in a way (as I hear them incoherently try to voice their feelings), I also wonder if they mightalso represent a sort of "canary in the coal mine". |
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beck's
Joined: 02 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 4:27 am Post subject: |
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On the Tibet isssue it is interesting that the liberal Hollywood illuminati and other limosine liberals didn't say boo when Obama refused to recognize Tibet's concerns. If Bush had done the same thing they would have been howling to the skies. Their hypocracy knows no bounds.
I will be very interested to follow the trials of the 911 conspirators in NYC. Given that they were probably never Mirandized it should be a hoot to see what evidence is disallowed.
KSM et al will be given more civil rights than American soldiers who are tried in military court. Now that's shocking. And US soldiers are over there risking their lives for a "gradual withdrawal."
With the jihadist warrior in the middle of Fort Hood, nothing surprises me anymore. When I see Obama with his telepromter oratory and his little professorial pointy finger it turns my stomach. |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 4:50 am Post subject: |
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| beck's wrote: |
KSM et al will be given more civil rights than American soldiers who are tried in military court. Now that's shocking. And US soldiers are over there risking their lives for a "gradual withdrawal."
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His conviction (and that's 100% what it's gonna be) will be speedier than in a military tribunal. Letting these guys sit behind bars while they are held without trial is making the U.S. look thuggish.
We should avoid looking like we don't trust our own justice system. We should also avoid being taken in by the same old tired scaremongering crap that is constantly being used for political gain. |
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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:11 am Post subject: Re: So, How's the Hope and Change Going for you So far? |
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| Fox wrote: |
| While I agree with the general principle (that the populace requires accurate information to act correctly), I think regarding fiscal irresponsibility by our government, more than enough information is availible to start voting out representatives in decisive fashion. |
What happened in the 2008 election? People were irate at the first (Bush) bailout. I thought for sure a good number of incumbents would lose their seats, but nothing of the sort happened.
Kinda blows your theory, no? |
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beck's
Joined: 02 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 1:02 pm Post subject: |
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Well Caniff, the thing is America has two justice systems. KSM was captured on the battle field. He is an enemy combatant and as such should be given a military trial.
Instead Barak Hussein Obama will give him a NYC trial. NYC, the very epicentre of the media world. It will be a media circus with KSM's lawyers and KSM himself promoting his jihadist ideas to the world.
To say nothing of the opportunity for the jihadists to attack NYC. What a perfect opportunity.
One of the problems is that many commentators/intellegencia are western hating westerners. They hate western civilization and see it as a negative force in the world.
I think that B.H. Obama is just such an American hating president. That's why I call him the first Post-American president. How could he have had sat in a pew for 20 years with Rev. Wright spouting his anti-American bile without being influenced. He was influenced by "G-d Damn America" and "America's chickens have come home to roost." He dedicated his book to this man. Now I won't even bring up Ayres from whose living room he launched his political career. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 4:21 pm Post subject: Re: So, How's the Hope and Change Going for you So far? |
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| bacasper wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| While I agree with the general principle (that the populace requires accurate information to act correctly), I think regarding fiscal irresponsibility by our government, more than enough information is availible to start voting out representatives in decisive fashion. |
What happened in the 2008 election? People were irate at the first (Bush) bailout. I thought for sure a good number of incumbents would lose their seats, but nothing of the sort happened.
Kinda blows your theory, no? |
I don't think so. I assert that information is availible, and it is: easily availible. You seem to recognize the problems, and I seem to recognize them, and many people I've spoken with seem to recognize them. The information is there. The problem is, most people just don't care about it, preferring to vote based either on a few key issues, or simply along party lines, rather than with any real reference to a candidate's specific actions or policies. Most people really don't seem to care that much about governmental fiscal responsibility, and the ones that do often seem to be more against governmental spending than governmental responsibility in spending. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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| caniff wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
What has Obama achieved domestically besides bailing out the State governments?
Jacksh*t.
And there's still torture at Bagram. |
The man has been a major disappointment, IMO, along with the majority of his party. I wasn't looking to become jaded, but yet here I am.
Washington is apparently broken just up to the point that it still gives the illusion of being a functioning entity. It's currently a complete travesty.
I don't know what it will take to get enough people to be as disgusted as I am with the state of affairs. While I would hope that necessary changes are peacefully realized, I feel that America's electorate has become dangerously politically complacent. |
I agree up until the last sentence. I think the majority of Americans are really, really, really fundamentally dissatisfied. One of the problems is that the anger exists in (at least) two rival camps.
Hope 'n Change hits 49% |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
| caniff wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
What has Obama achieved domestically besides bailing out the State governments?
Jacksh*t.
And there's still torture at Bagram. |
The man has been a major disappointment, IMO, along with the majority of his party. I wasn't looking to become jaded, but yet here I am.
Washington is apparently broken just up to the point that it still gives the illusion of being a functioning entity. It's currently a complete travesty.
I don't know what it will take to get enough people to be as disgusted as I am with the state of affairs. While I would hope that necessary changes are peacefully realized, I feel that America's electorate has become dangerously politically complacent. |
I agree up until the last sentence. I think the majority of Americans are really, really, really fundamentally dissatisfied. One of the problems is that the anger exists in (at least) two rival camps. |
I meant the politically complacency that has allowed us to get to this clusterf%ck point in our nation's history. It's like many people are just now waking up (with a massive hangover after the bash came to screeching halt), can see (or at least sense) that things are FUBAR, and want heads to roll.
Apparently the first reaction of many has to become more partisan, but an increasing number of people (such as myself) have basically come to the conclusion that our government, left or right, largely no longer represents average Americans' interests. It's been pretty clear for some time, of course, but extreme discomfort is required before people really start looking for answers as to why this is happening. |
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Old Gil
Joined: 26 Sep 2009
Location: Got out! olleh!
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| Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| beck's wrote: |
On the Tibet isssue it is interesting that the liberal Hollywood illuminati and other limosine liberals didn't say boo when Obama refused to recognize Tibet's concerns. If Bush had done the same thing they would have been howling to the skies. Their hypocracy knows no bounds.
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You don't have a shred of evidence for this crappy supposition, and furthermore if you did your research you'd realize that the Dalai Lama himself does not even advocate Tibetan independence. |
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beck's
Joined: 02 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 4:24 am Post subject: |
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Hi Old Gil:
Did I say independence? Thought I said the Tibet issue/concerns. Read back and see.
My post is IMO. It's based on the love affair that the Hollywood elite have with President Obama and the hateathon they had going for W. |
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