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Dongducheon Foreign Language High School
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outkast_3000



Joined: 20 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:01 am    Post subject: Dongducheon Foreign Language High School Reply with quote

Total long shot...but if you happen to be a teacher there, or have taught there before, I'd love to hear a bit about the school.

- How many extra classes did you teach per week?

- How're the students' levels of English?

- How were the extra AP Classes? (did the students even pay attention/care? did you enjoy teaching them?)

- How are/were your Korean colleagues? How is/was the principal?
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yakey



Joined: 21 Apr 2003
Location: Korea

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:13 pm    Post subject: There was an old post on this Reply with quote

Maybe two years ago one of the foreign teachers posted that they were unhappy there. There was something about at gift time the Korean faculty all got very nice gifts and the foreign teachers didn't get anything.

I remember something also about that the foreign faculty classes were just like add-ons and not considered as important as what the Korean faculty was teaching.

I seem to also recall that the teachers lived in the school dormitory.

That school has been open about four years now. It is walking distance from Jihaeng Station.

Bosan Station just two stops away has some good shops and restaurants next to Camp Casey.

For teaching, I would prefer a college or university gig.

PM me. Maybe I can help you more.
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Toju



Joined: 06 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Number 26 in the country. FLHS's account for about 25 of the top 30 high schools in the country, with Daewon at #1, Minseok #2 and Yongin #3.

New principal about a year ago I think - teachers, as of May last year, weren't overly amused with the shift.

Same as many other flhs's - government ones seem to be being run into the ground in line with the government initiative to fade out flhs's.

However, you will be working with students who are all higher than your average high school and the teaching will be more fun.

If it is anything like my current job, extra classes are optional for the students and if you want to teach something useful, you'll get lots of students and if you don't, then you won't.

Be careful - talk to someone who is currently working there before you sign any contract. I would heavily recommend not working where I am now due to a change of principal and politics but the sad thing is these schools could be absolutely amazing in every way if they were run by the right people with the right government support.
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Toju



Joined: 06 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Plus it is freakin miles from anyway - takes forever on the subway.
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yakey



Joined: 21 Apr 2003
Location: Korea

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 9:02 pm    Post subject: No it won't Reply with quote

The poster is from Dobong.

That's only 30 minutes on the subway from Jihaeng.
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outkast_3000



Joined: 20 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the info.

I've agreed to walk in and sign a contract sometime next week, but I'm suddenly nervous about it - I've heard some bad things about FLHS. But the opportunity to teach the extra AP classes in the areas I'm qualified to teach (HS English and Social Studies) seemed interesting and would be a welcome break to the typical EFL teaching. At the end of the day, even if the extra classes weren't substantial, it'd be something to toss on the resume as experience in my teaching areas (which i have zero, currently). But...you know, situations have had a tendency of never materializing the way I'd hope them to in my time here, so I'm bracing for the worst. Money's actually an issue for me, so I'd be willing to teach every single extra class they throw at me - but I have a feeling I won't get any.

Yes, I've seen the dormitory I'd be staying in and it's...cramped to say the least. The lack of privacy is a concern - as in, even now, I rarely sleep at home since I'm usually at my gf's place, and I wonder if the security might casually mention "by the way, so and so is NEVER here at night." And on top of that, I suspect I wouldn't be allowed to have guests up in there either.

Toju, is your FLHS public or private? I was told private ones can get really shady - they compensate you ridiculously well if you're willing to put up with the inhumane treatment, but most can't endure it. Also, what extra classes do you teach and at what rate are you compensated at? The ad they posted said 35K per extra class, but for some reason, I think they'll end up paying like 20K since...well, in my experience the posted ads don't hold weight when it comes to salary and pay.

Thanks.

Also, Yakey, PM sent.
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Toju



Joined: 06 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

outkast_3000 wrote:



Toju, is your FLHS public or private? I was told private ones can get really shady - they compensate you ridiculously well if you're willing to put up with the inhumane treatment, but most can't endure it. Also, what extra classes do you teach and at what rate are you compensated at? The ad they posted said 35K per extra class, but for some reason, I think they'll end up paying like 20K since...well, in my experience the posted ads don't hold weight when it comes to salary and pay.


I am in a public FLHS and one that has links with Dongducheon for various reasons. I was teaching TOEFL reading and listening and also IELTS. We were paid 40k an hour which is money that comes from the students via the school, usually 2 hours a day for 20 hour blocks. However, due to the endless events that seemed to happen, that was never 20 straight days of afterschool classes. Two of my colleagues taught evening classes once a week which paid well, but meant they didn't finish until about 9.30.

Teaching in an FLHS is awesome. I love it. The problem comes at the level above the classroom. There are a lot of people in management who are better suited to some hicksville middle school where inbreeding is normal and who shouldn't be in a state-of-the-art top end high level high school.

If you have a contract with them, sign. You won't do much better at the beginning. The good thing is though that there aren't actually that many long-noses in the FLHS system so later, when the better schools adcertise, your CV will be at the top of the pile. I just got turned down by #3 in the country and out of 80 applicants there were only two short-listed. The other one is a good friend of mine and also a regular poster on this board. We went to the interview together. He got the job. I am happy for him, and I assuming that we were both there because we both have a few years FLHS experience.

You'll have a good year provided you bite your lip when the billshit starts. You may be lucky and find that it doesn't, but I have as yet to find ANY job in Korea where the incomprehendable Korean logic affects you in some way or other.

I have met all the teachers at Dongducheon who were there last year - I am not sure how many will still be there when you sign. They seemed like a nice crowd.

Good luck. Sign the contract. You'll have a good year of top level students and you'll teach at a speed you might be accustomed to if you have taught NES students.

My job went *beep* up due to unimaginable management decisions, but that has kick-started me to move on in my life which isn't a bad thing for me or my family.
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Toju



Joined: 06 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Private schools go both ways. They can fleece you or take care of you. Just depends which one you are in.
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outkast_3000



Joined: 20 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the info Toju, it's definitely giving me a better idea of the landscape I'm walking into.

In reference to an earlier post where you mentioned public FLHS being run into the ground which is in line with the government initiative to fade them out, what exactly do you mean by that? I mean, I'm aware of the controversy surrounding the idea of FLHS, but if the public FLHS cease to operate as FLHS - what will they turn into? Just regular public schools? I know the private ones would consider becoming International Schools, but I doubt the public ones could convert into them.

I'm sorry to hear your current situation has gone sour. If you don't mind me asking, what's the next move? I guess I'm just curious what kind of gig a FLHS can springboard you into.

Cheers
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arice05



Joined: 29 Aug 2009
Location: Dongducheon

PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 8:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hey outkast_3000, i live kitty corner to the school ur talking about. i've heard rumors that are bad, but i also know a few of the teachers that teach there (granted, they are korean), and they're really sweet and really enjoy their jobs. are you moving to dongducheon soon?
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winterfall



Joined: 21 May 2009

PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

outkast_3000 wrote:
Thanks for all the info Toju, it's definitely giving me a better idea of the landscape I'm walking into.

In reference to an earlier post where you mentioned public FLHS being run into the ground which is in line with the government initiative to fade them out, what exactly do you mean by that? I mean, I'm aware of the controversy surrounding the idea of FLHS, but if the public FLHS cease to operate as FLHS - what will they turn into? Just regular public schools? I know the private ones would consider becoming International Schools, but I doubt the public ones could convert into them.

I'm sorry to hear your current situation has gone sour. If you don't mind me asking, what's the next move? I guess I'm just curious what kind of gig a FLHS can springboard you into.

Cheers


In a sense yes, they're opening the admissions. So its not restricted completely to elite students. But, by my guesstimate it'll be years if not decades before the majority of the students there aren't elite. The school will find some way to make sure that only a minority of the students aren't the cream of the crop. So to speak.
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Toju



Joined: 06 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

outkast_3000 wrote:
Thanks for all the info Toju, it's definitely giving me a better idea of the landscape I'm walking into.

In reference to an earlier post where you mentioned public FLHS being run into the ground which is in line with the government initiative to fade them out, what exactly do you mean by that? I mean, I'm aware of the controversy surrounding the idea of FLHS, but if the public FLHS cease to operate as FLHS - what will they turn into? Just regular public schools? I know the private ones would consider becoming International Schools, but I doubt the public ones could convert into them.

I'm sorry to hear your current situation has gone sour. If you don't mind me asking, what's the next move? I guess I'm just curious what kind of gig a FLHS can springboard you into.

Cheers

The FLHS's started to appear in about 1990 I think and it was Hanyong appear that I believe was the first. Since then, they have grown in popularity and up until this year, the only students who could apply were students with excellent language skills or who were at the top of their middle schools - as in the top. FLHS's then started doing really, really well and now they occupy about 90% of the top 30 places on the league table list, as of 2009.

Parents then started complaing saying that it was offering an elitist education and that because they only took top students there was more pressure on middle school students which wasn't fair. 2MB kind of agreed with this and now there is a plan to slowly phase out FLHS's across the country over the next three or four years I think and turn them into normal schools or maybe schools focusing on things other than language.

The hype that surrounded them only a matter of years ago has now gone but if you work in one it is good on your CV and will help you in the future with your job search. Make the most of it and enjoy it. It could all go *beep* up anyways when the next government gains power - never trust any long term plan that any Korean government has - you should know that.

As far as I am concerned it has made me realise that my time in Korea has come to an end, or should come to an end and I am therefore trying to go to Hong Kong and work there. 9 years is enough I think and this particular incident in my school has made me realise that the system is not going to change here and that certain aspects of Korea are just insanely stupid. Don't get me wrong, I love it here and have a great life, but it is just incredubly frustrating in certain situations.

Time to move on.

Good luck and enjoy it.
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winterfall



Joined: 21 May 2009

PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Toju wrote:
outkast_3000 wrote:
Thanks for all the info Toju, it's definitely giving me a better idea of the landscape I'm walking into.

In reference to an earlier post where you mentioned public FLHS being run into the ground which is in line with the government initiative to fade them out, what exactly do you mean by that? I mean, I'm aware of the controversy surrounding the idea of FLHS, but if the public FLHS cease to operate as FLHS - what will they turn into? Just regular public schools? I know the private ones would consider becoming International Schools, but I doubt the public ones could convert into them.

I'm sorry to hear your current situation has gone sour. If you don't mind me asking, what's the next move? I guess I'm just curious what kind of gig a FLHS can springboard you into.

Cheers

The FLHS's started to appear in about 1990 I think and it was Hanyong appear that I believe was the first. Since then, they have grown in popularity and up until this year, the only students who could apply were students with excellent language skills or who were at the top of their middle schools - as in the top. FLHS's then started doing really, really well and now they occupy about 90% of the top 30 places on the league table list, as of 2009.

Parents then started complaing saying that it was offering an elitist education and that because they only took top students there was more pressure on middle school students which wasn't fair. 2MB kind of agreed with this and now there is a plan to slowly phase out FLHS's across the country over the next three or four years I think and turn them into normal schools or maybe schools focusing on things other than language.

The hype that surrounded them only a matter of years ago has now gone but if you work in one it is good on your CV and will help you in the future with your job search. Make the most of it and enjoy it. It could all go *beep* up anyways when the next government gains power - never trust any long term plan that any Korean government has - you should know that.

As far as I am concerned it has made me realise that my time in Korea has come to an end, or should come to an end and I am therefore trying to go to Hong Kong and work there. 9 years is enough I think and this particular incident in my school has made me realise that the system is not going to change here and that certain aspects of Korea are just insanely stupid. Don't get me wrong, I love it here and have a great life, but it is just incredubly frustrating in certain situations.

Time to move on.

Good luck and enjoy it.


FLS are some of the only schools that do speaking tests to screen applicants. And that pretty much wipes out 95% of the pool. And only leaves the ones that could afford to have lived abroad or went to hagwon from the age of 1. So the criticism is actually valid.

And Toju, I second your stance. Education here is a myriad mess and every reform is just cosmetic. I'm trying to pull together a program to at my school to help deal with these issues. But I dunno, after I leave this school, I doubt the KETs will keep it going. They'rejust going through the motions. And they've stopped caring. At least that's the case at my school.
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calicoe



Joined: 23 Dec 2008
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a very helpful thread. What is the word on Daewon? Is it a good place to work?
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Toju



Joined: 06 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

winterfall wrote:


FLS are some of the only schools that do speaking tests to screen applicants. And that pretty much wipes out 95% of the pool.

Not any more - that's just it. A certain percentage get a language test. Everyone is interviewed, but in Korean. those students who may not have very good middle school grades but can speak languages well can still get in to the school through an interview in that language and also an essay in that language.

All other students now just have to be 'good' rather than in the upper echelon, which means that a lot more students now have the opportunity to attend such schools, theoretically lowering the standard of the school.

In November we had 800 applicants for 250 places. We have 58 interviews, in English, for the 'gifted' or returnees. Last year we had close to 900 - not really sure why we dropped, but nonetheless 800 is till high.

Quote:
What is the word on Daewon? Is it a good place to work?
If you have a job offer, then it is worth knowing. If you haven't, I wouldn't worry about it.

There are, on average, 4 or 5 long noses in any FLHS, so we are a fairly specialized group and are therefore employable in the circle. I recommend trying to get into that circle if you can, especially if you are a long-termer.
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