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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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 Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Street Magic wrote: |
| mises wrote: |
In fact, if you find a gun and turn it into police, you'll go to jail for gun possession:
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A former soldier who handed a discarded shotgun in to police faces at least five years imprisonment for "doing his duty".
Paul Clarke, 27, was found guilty of possessing a firearm at Guildford Crown Court on Tuesday � after finding the gun and handing it personally to police officers on March 20 this year.
The jury took 20 minutes to make its conviction, and Mr Clarke now faces a minimum of five year's imprisonment for handing in the weapon. |
http://www.thisissurreytoday.co.uk/news/Ex-soldier-faces-jail-handing-gun/article-1509082-detail/article.html
What a country! |
For future reference, here's the proper way to handle that situation:
http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=1109
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| Gray posted bail and went home. Two months later, the father of six with no prior criminal record sent a letter to authorities: If your deputies come onto my property, bring body bags. |
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| Armed family members, including Gray's wife, Alicia, took turns patrolling the property. That worried authorities � so much so that even when Gray began skipping court appearances, they didn't go arrest him. |
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These cops are total pussies. When it comes to issues like property taxes? Okay, let the guy hide without storming in. When the charge is assaulting an officer and speeding? Fine, ignore him if that's really your preference. But when they kidnapped two children from their father, it was time for the cops to get over their fear of bad publicity and do their duty. |
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Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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| I just love how so-called liberals (lefties) holler "prison is not the answer, prison is not the answer" and then all the sudden turn around and wanna throw this guy in prison. |
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Street Magic
Joined: 23 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| Street Magic wrote: |
| mises wrote: |
In fact, if you find a gun and turn it into police, you'll go to jail for gun possession:
| Quote: |
A former soldier who handed a discarded shotgun in to police faces at least five years imprisonment for "doing his duty".
Paul Clarke, 27, was found guilty of possessing a firearm at Guildford Crown Court on Tuesday � after finding the gun and handing it personally to police officers on March 20 this year.
The jury took 20 minutes to make its conviction, and Mr Clarke now faces a minimum of five year's imprisonment for handing in the weapon. |
http://www.thisissurreytoday.co.uk/news/Ex-soldier-faces-jail-handing-gun/article-1509082-detail/article.html
What a country! |
For future reference, here's the proper way to handle that situation:
http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=1109
| Quote: |
| Gray posted bail and went home. Two months later, the father of six with no prior criminal record sent a letter to authorities: If your deputies come onto my property, bring body bags. |
| Quote: |
| Armed family members, including Gray's wife, Alicia, took turns patrolling the property. That worried authorities � so much so that even when Gray began skipping court appearances, they didn't go arrest him. |
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These cops are total pussies. When it comes to issues like property taxes? Okay, let the guy hide without storming in. When the charge is assaulting an officer and speeding? Fine, ignore him if that's really your preference. But when they kidnapped two children from their father, it was time for the cops to get over their fear of bad publicity and do their duty. |
Funny you should say that:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia
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| DC's highest court ruled that the police do not have a legal responsibility to provide personal protection to individuals, and absolved the police and the city of any liability. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Leslie Cheswyck wrote: |
| I just love how so-called liberals (lefties) holler "prison is not the answer, prison is not the answer" and then all the sudden turn around and wanna throw this guy in prison. |
Most people on the left do not call for the abolition of prisons in general. Usually if someone is speaking against prisons, it's more along the lines of limiting the types of criminals we send to prison (e.g. many on the left think drug-related activity should not lead to prison time). I don't think I've heard of too many individuals calling for abandoning prisons entirely. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Street Magic wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| Street Magic wrote: |
| mises wrote: |
In fact, if you find a gun and turn it into police, you'll go to jail for gun possession:
| Quote: |
A former soldier who handed a discarded shotgun in to police faces at least five years imprisonment for "doing his duty".
Paul Clarke, 27, was found guilty of possessing a firearm at Guildford Crown Court on Tuesday � after finding the gun and handing it personally to police officers on March 20 this year.
The jury took 20 minutes to make its conviction, and Mr Clarke now faces a minimum of five year's imprisonment for handing in the weapon. |
http://www.thisissurreytoday.co.uk/news/Ex-soldier-faces-jail-handing-gun/article-1509082-detail/article.html
What a country! |
For future reference, here's the proper way to handle that situation:
http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=1109
| Quote: |
| Gray posted bail and went home. Two months later, the father of six with no prior criminal record sent a letter to authorities: If your deputies come onto my property, bring body bags. |
| Quote: |
| Armed family members, including Gray's wife, Alicia, took turns patrolling the property. That worried authorities � so much so that even when Gray began skipping court appearances, they didn't go arrest him. |
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These cops are total pussies. When it comes to issues like property taxes? Okay, let the guy hide without storming in. When the charge is assaulting an officer and speeding? Fine, ignore him if that's really your preference. But when they kidnapped two children from their father, it was time for the cops to get over their fear of bad publicity and do their duty. |
Funny you should say that:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia
| Quote: |
| DC's highest court ruled that the police do not have a legal responsibility to provide personal protection to individuals, and absolved the police and the city of any liability. |
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Yes, but this is just an example of corrupt avoidance of accountability. When I was speaking of their duty, I meant their duty to society, rather than their duty as the courts might define it. Indeed, as far as I know, the courts would not rule that the police have any duty to do anything, only the duty to avoid certain things (like pointless brutality).
Are there any examples of a court asserting police have a positive duty to act in any situation? |
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Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Yes, and the types of "criminals" so-called liberals have in their sights are men like this gentleman who thought he was doing the right thing by turning in a firearm, and some guy who supposedly wrote a word that rhymed with another. Only a lefty could think that was OK. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Leslie Cheswyck wrote: |
| Yes, and the types of "criminals" so-called liberals have in their sights are men like this gentleman who thought he was doing the right thing by turning in a firearm, and some guy who supposedly wrote a word that rhymed with another. Only a lefty could think that was OK. |
Saying every -- or even most -- "lefties" are like that is like saying every "rightie" is like the weirdos who hang out on remote land with guns threatening to kill anyone who trespasses, breaking laws at their pleasure. Both are just ultra-extreme variants of mainstream ideologies. It's just unfortunately the case that extreme leftists have gained a lot of power in certain European countries.
Most left-leaning individuals would say that the examples you gave are examples of injustice. As such, no, liberals in general don't have such men "in their sights." This is especially true given the immense ideological diversity within the political left. |
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Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 9:50 pm Post subject: |
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... who, no doubt, are working overtime to undo such injustices. That'll be the day.
Who passes these laws? |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Leslie Cheswyck wrote: |
| ... who, no doubt, are working overtime to undo such injustices. That'll be the day. |
Like someone here once said, passing a law is easier than revoking it.
| Leslie Cheswyck wrote: |
| Who passes these laws? |
Presumably, members of the British Parliament who don't fully consider their end results. I seriously doubt the individual responsible for the original proposal to illegalize the possession of firearms took a case like this into account, and even if they did, they probably counted on the police using a bit of discretion and reasonability. No one has this ex-soldier in their sights. I've little doubt that even the police officer who made the decision to arrest him genuinely felt constrained by a strict interpretation of the law. Most people are good at heart.
There's no malice here. These people are casualties of poorly written laws. That does not excuse the individuals who wrote the laws, mind you. We need to hold our politicians accountable. But we also need to distinguish between political ideologies and implementations of political ideologies. To use an America-relevent example, there's a difference between the conservative ideology, and the way Republicans have tried to implement it. To use a Britian-relevent example, there's a difference between the liberal ideology, and the way Labour Party members have tried to implement it. I think we can all understand this.
So, by all means, condemn the British Labour Party and their policies. But, if you go beyond that and condemn the political left in general because of said party's actions, then bear in mind that the political right is just as vulnerable based on the American Republican Party's policies. Are endless warfare, disenfranchisement of minorities, and tax cuts that exclusively benefit the wealthy emblematic of the political right? Many conservatives on this board would say no. Likewise, this sort of nonsense is not emblematic of the political left. |
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Street Magic
Joined: 23 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
Yes, but this is just an example of corrupt avoidance of accountability. When I was speaking of their duty, I meant their duty to society, rather than their duty as the courts might define it. Indeed, as far as I know, the courts would not rule that the police have any duty to do anything, only the duty to avoid certain things (like pointless brutality).
Are there any examples of a court asserting police have a positive duty to act in any situation? |
Yeah, you can probably Google "police negligence" and find some counterexamples. It wasn't a Supreme Court case, but I like bringing it up because of the absurd conclusion they came to.
Regarding Leslie's assertion that liberals wouldn't stick up for someone who might have violated some PC protocol, have you ever heard of the ACLU? Or that time the ACLU defended the KKK's right to public demonstration?
There's a difference between recognizing or even shaming people for racism and thinking those same people should be arrested. That's why this story is so ridiculous.
Last edited by Street Magic on Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:49 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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Even if this man had said 'i hate pikeys' (pikeys being a reference to Irish gypsies, who are a completely invented 'ethnic group') he should not have been arrested. It seems that the British police, who were once envied the world over for their professionalism, honesty and common sense have now become the paramilitary wing of the Guardian.
Why bother cracking down on real criminals when you can simply arrest decent law abiding people for various race/religious/gender/ad naseum 'hate' offences? Its certainly easier than raiding a crack den or arresting illegal Nigerian minicab drivers. The UK has now become a country where many of the laws go completely against the sensibilities of the vast majority of ordinary people.
Many ordinary police are actually decent people, but it is now a organisation run by political bureaucrats who have got to where they are by parroting the latest politically correct garbage. The cost of this has been the criminalization of non-crimes, and a dangerous erosion of people's respect in the police force and the justice system.
If someone breaks into your house in the middle of the night, don't count on the police turning up within 30 minutes of that phonecall, and think twice before defending yourself, because you might well be charged with assault. However, if you would like to make a complaint about someone saying something 'offensive' about an 'oppressed' minority group, they'll be around there to arrest the scumbag and drag him off to detention quicker than you can say Anne Frank. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 12:46 am Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
To use a Britian-relevent example, there's a difference between the liberal ideology, and the way Labour Party members have tried to implement it. I think we can all understand this.
So, by all means, condemn the British Labour Party and their policies. But, if you go beyond that and condemn the political left in general because of said party's actions, then bear in mind that the political right is just as vulnerable based on the American Republican Party's policies. Are endless warfare, disenfranchisement of minorities, and tax cuts that exclusively benefit the wealthy emblematic of the political right? Many conservatives on this board would say no. Likewise, this sort of nonsense is not emblematic of the political left. |
I'm loving watching you defend 'the Left,' Fox. It is generally very amusing.  |
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Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
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| Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 2:37 am Post subject: |
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| Street Magic wrote: |
| apparently they could arrest you for having written or received an email critical of a religious belief. |
Its quite ok to criticise christianity all you want apparently...just not Islam.
UK has been a rotting piece of cabbage for some years now..I have zero intention of setting foot there ever again. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 8:31 am Post subject: |
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When it comes to hiring staff, there are plenty of legal pitfalls employers need to watch out for these days.
So recruitment agency boss Nicole Mamo was especially careful to ensure her advert for hospital workers did not offend on grounds of race, age or sexual orientation.
However, she hadn't reckoned on discriminating against a wholly different section of the community - the completely useless.
When she ran the ad past a job centre, she was told she couldn't ask for 'reliable' and 'hard-working' applicants because it could be offensive to unreliable people. |
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1246201/Employer-told-advertise-reliable-workers--discriminates-unreliable-applicants.html
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Family shut out of their 'dream home' by Romanian squatters who moved in over Christmas
With the building works nearly over, Julian and Samantha Mosedale and their three children were looking forward to moving back into the home of their dreams.
But their hopes have turned into a nightmare because a group of Romanians occupied the property over Christmas.
Julian and Samantha Mosedale with their children Finn, Jake and Toby (left to right) had hoped to move back into their 'dream home' in March
The unwanted guests have changed the locks at the three-bedroom terrace house and moved in their own furniture.
But, after spending Christmas visiting relatives in Essex, they returned to the house on January 3 to find the squatters installed.
They now fear they could soon be homeless because they can only afford to foot the cost of rent and mortgage payments until March.
Mrs Mosedale, whose three sons are ten, eight, and five, said: 'We called the police as soon as we found out they were in there. An officer suggested I was racist when I asked if they were Romanians, and did they have a legal right to be in this country.
'We are hard-working citizens yet get treated like criminals when our home is stolen. This whole thing is making me feel constantly sick. All we want to do is get on with our lives.
'We feel let down by the law, by government, and by the police, in fact all the authorities that one would expect to protect society.
'The house had builders in it while the renovations were being done. It was only in the last couple of months that it was left completely empty.
'Our lawyers don't know how long it will take us to get them out and the stress is really getting to the whole family.
'The kids are upset at the idea that other children are playing with their toys in the garden.
'Our son Jake is old enough to understand what is going on and he is finding it difficult to sleep.
'All the children are incredibly unsettled.'
The Mosedale's house in Tottenham where squatters have moved in |
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1242682/Family-shut-dream-home-gang-gipsies-moved-Christmas.html
How does a country recover from so much psychological abuse? The UK is a gong-show. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 10:52 am Post subject: |
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| The rule sounds pretty goofy, but for all practical purposes this is pretty much a non-issue. Within the context of a job notice, the words "reliable and hardworking" carry about as much substance as does the word "fine" when someone asks you how your day is going. |
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