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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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 Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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| conrad2 wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Captain Corea wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Wishmaster wrote: |
| If a westerner were involved in such a thing in Korea, it would be front page news and you(yes, you Urban Myth) would probably be looked at like a sex predator and, oh, I'm sure they would think up a new test in order to get a teaching visa. Probably something like every male teacher being forced to wear an electronic bracelet that beeps when they come within 10 feet of a Korean female. That is the future here. |
Captain Corea
Here is the link:
http://populargusts.blogspot.com/2009/09/closer-look-at-crime-statistics-for.html |
Thanks for the link, TUM. But... I don't see any conviction IN Korea.
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A teacher in Busan in April 2006 who was found have molested children in Canada.
A case at Seongnam English Village in May 2006 where the media reported that a native-speaking teacher of Korean descent had been accused of molesting female grade 6 students. Statements by the school later claimed that other teachers present saw no sexual harassment, and made it clear that the teacher, while Korean American, had been hired as a Korean-speaking teacher and not as a native speaking teacher (not that that stopped the Gyeonggi-do branch of the Korean Teachers and Educational Workers Union from releasing a statement saying that such incidents could "potentially occur at any time" because of unchecked native speakers' "relatively free attitudes about sex" and their "lack of a sense of responsibility").
The Australian who sent an email to his ex-girlfriend 'threatening her with AIDS' was accused of having molested students at a former job when he was arrested in July, 2007 (for teaching on a tourist visa) and was used as an example of 'molesting teachers' after Christopher Paul Neil was arrested (such as in this video). As revealed in the Sports Chosun article that broke his story, however, "KITA, an association for recruiters of English teaches, put A on the blacklist on its homepage, warning, �he often puts his hand on the students� bodies. It does not rise to the level of sexual harassment but it is absolutely inappropriate." KITA makes clear he did not 'molest' students.
Christopher Paul Neil, who taught in Korea, was arrested for molesting children in Southeast Asia in October 2007, but was not found to have committed crimes in Korea.
In January 2009, a university professor in Daejeon was found to have molested students in the U.S., though the crime was wiped from his criminal record. The Korean media have not reported any crimes committed by him in Korea. |
There's this small mention... but it's barely a blip
| Quote: |
| An American English teacher convicted of attempting to rape one of his students is also on the list[.] |
So many mentions of potential charges... but such a massive lack on convictions. I'm really at a loss as to why.
As far as I can figure... the only cnviction ever mentioned was the one barely mentioned.
Odd. |
Which is of course my entire point (your comments I took the liberty of bolding). People have been going on and on about how if a Westerner were convicted of a sex crime, how the media would play it up and there would be protests in the streets and that newer and tougher laws would be bought in. And yet when it actually does occur...it gets maybe one sentence to itself out of an entire article. |
Or maybe the Korean media just missed this one and didnt report it. If the Korean populace knows about it then they will take to the streets and riot -potentially. Do you think those two girls in 2002 were the first that a US soldier driving has run over in 50 plus years in Korea? Doubtful. But they sure as hell protested when the media reported it. |
Only it WAS reported in the Korean media...that was a Korean newspaper that printed that. This included the other incidents as well...(some guy said 10) the links in the blogs are ALL to Korean newspapers.
And yet...no riots about the attempted rape or molestation incidents.
And it just wasn't one newpaper.
In one case of molestation by a foreign teacher the Maeil Gyeongje, the Kookmin Ilbo, YTN, Nocut News Newis, and 2 internet news services reported on it.
In another case Nocut News, Jegye Ilbo, Yonhap and 2 internet news services reported on that.
And in a third case it was Yonhap, the Financial News, and the Maeil Gyeongje.
Plenty of newspapers and online news picked these up yet...still no riots.
Generally it's when a special interest group with money and influence picks up on a certain issue, that riots happen. See the Beef protests for example.
But most people don't riot over teachers behaving badly. Were they irrational to that degree...we'd all be banned from teaching here.
Even the CPN case which led to tougher regulations, didn't spark riots. Are you trying to tell us that Koreans didn't hear about that? So ten in all (as the other guy said) and not a single riot. Sorry but facts just don't back you up on your claim. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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And one more thing. If Koreans were as gullible or as easily manipulated as some people on here believe...how come there's no riot every time we are portrayed in the media as dope-addled sex predators?
How come there aren't numerous petitions asking the government to ban us from coming here?
How come we aren't wearing some form of electronic bracelet?
I could keep on asking questions, but I think it's fairly clear to anyone with a functioning brain that media reports of English teachers engaging in predatory sexual behavior don't drive the population into a lynching frenzy.
In fact can anyone show me a link to ONE incident involving an English teacher and said behaviour that did directly lead to a riot? (link to media report please, no hearsay)
Like I said, it's a Dave's myth. Let it die...it's past time. It's the foreign teachers version of "fan death". |
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SoCalRich
Joined: 17 Jan 2010
Location: Los Angeles and San Diego, CA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2010 4:46 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
And one more thing. If Koreans were as gullible or as easily manipulated as some people on here believe...how come there's no riot every time we are portrayed in the media as dope-addled sex predators?
How come there aren't numerous petitions asking the government to ban us from coming here?
How come we aren't wearing some form of electronic bracelet?
I could keep on asking questions, but I think it's fairly clear to anyone with a functioning brain that media reports of English teachers engaging in predatory sexual behavior don't drive the population into a lynching frenzy.
In fact can anyone show me a link to ONE incident involving an English teacher and said behaviour that did directly lead to a riot? (link to media report please, no hearsay)
Like I said, it's a Dave's myth. Let it die...it's past time. It's the foreign teachers version of "fan death". |
Well put and I agree with you but I think you are wasting your time trying to talk sense into these people. Some foreigners in Korea just want to feel like an oppressed minority and come on Dave's to reinforce those beliefs. Any naysayers will get an immediate rebuttal even if it doesn't make sense. Their favorite terminology for anyone trying to talk sense to them is Apologist (ie: "So what do all of you apologists have to say about that!") I've seen it a million times, not only on Dave's but on the internet in general. Rarely does an internet forum regular ever admit that they are wrong. Rarely are they open minded. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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| SoCalRich wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
And one more thing. If Koreans were as gullible or as easily manipulated as some people on here believe...how come there's no riot every time we are portrayed in the media as dope-addled sex predators?
How come there aren't numerous petitions asking the government to ban us from coming here?
How come we aren't wearing some form of electronic bracelet?
I could keep on asking questions, but I think it's fairly clear to anyone with a functioning brain that media reports of English teachers engaging in predatory sexual behavior don't drive the population into a lynching frenzy.
In fact can anyone show me a link to ONE incident involving an English teacher and said behaviour that did directly lead to a riot? (link to media report please, no hearsay)
Like I said, it's a Dave's myth. Let it die...it's past time. It's the foreign teachers version of "fan death". |
Well put and I agree with you but I think you are wasting your time trying to talk sense into these people. Some foreigners in Korea just want to feel like an oppressed minority and come on Dave's to reinforce those beliefs. Any naysayers will get an immediate rebuttal even if it doesn't make sense. Their favorite terminology for anyone trying to talk sense to them is Apologist (ie: "So what do all of you apologists have to say about that!") I've seen it a million times, not only on Dave's but on the internet in general. Rarely does an internet forum regular ever admit that they are wrong. Rarely are they open minded. |
That's fine. I'll take their silence as assent then. |
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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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| SoCalRich wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
And one more thing. If Koreans were as gullible or as easily manipulated as some people on here believe...how come there's no riot every time we are portrayed in the media as dope-addled sex predators?
How come there aren't numerous petitions asking the government to ban us from coming here?
How come we aren't wearing some form of electronic bracelet?
I could keep on asking questions, but I think it's fairly clear to anyone with a functioning brain that media reports of English teachers engaging in predatory sexual behavior don't drive the population into a lynching frenzy.
In fact can anyone show me a link to ONE incident involving an English teacher and said behaviour that did directly lead to a riot? (link to media report please, no hearsay)
Like I said, it's a Dave's myth. Let it die...it's past time. It's the foreign teachers version of "fan death". |
Well put and I agree with you but I think you are wasting your time trying to talk sense into these people. Some foreigners in Korea just want to feel like an oppressed minority and come on Dave's to reinforce those beliefs. Any naysayers will get an immediate rebuttal even if it doesn't make sense. Their favorite terminology for anyone trying to talk sense to them is Apologist (ie: "So what do all of you apologists have to say about that!") I've seen it a million times, not only on Dave's but on the internet in general. Rarely does an internet forum regular ever admit that they are wrong. Rarely are they open minded. |
+1 OH YEAH!
I would like to add "How about THEM apples?" |
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Bramble
Joined: 26 Jan 2007
Location: National treasures need homes
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| Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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| SoCalRich wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
And one more thing. If Koreans were as gullible or as easily manipulated as some people on here believe...how come there's no riot every time we are portrayed in the media as dope-addled sex predators?
How come there aren't numerous petitions asking the government to ban us from coming here?
How come we aren't wearing some form of electronic bracelet?
I could keep on asking questions, but I think it's fairly clear to anyone with a functioning brain that media reports of English teachers engaging in predatory sexual behavior don't drive the population into a lynching frenzy.
In fact can anyone show me a link to ONE incident involving an English teacher and said behaviour that did directly lead to a riot? (link to media report please, no hearsay)
Like I said, it's a Dave's myth. Let it die...it's past time. It's the foreign teachers version of "fan death". |
Well put and I agree with you but I think you are wasting your time trying to talk sense into these people. Some foreigners in Korea just want to feel like an oppressed minority and come on Dave's to reinforce those beliefs. Any naysayers will get an immediate rebuttal even if it doesn't make sense. Their favorite terminology for anyone trying to talk sense to them is Apologist (ie: "So what do all of you apologists have to say about that!") I've seen it a million times, not only on Dave's but on the internet in general. Rarely does an internet forum regular ever admit that they are wrong. Rarely are they open minded. |
We're not an oppressed minority and I don't believe in the anti-English Spectrum conspiracy, but you can't deny there's a difference in the way the Canadian media treat incidents like this compared with the Korean media. A Canadian newspaper would probably withhold the identities of the accused people and leave out the fact that they belonged to a Korean church, in order to protect the privacy of the victims. In other cases they won't mention the accused person's nationality or ethnic background because it's not relevant to the story. It's too bad Dave's doesn't have moderators directing the conversation so that people discuss the real issues. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| It's too bad Dave's doesn't have moderators directing the conversation so that people discuss the real issues. |
We'll discuss what we please. If you're looking for a managed conversation make a run for the border. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Bramble wrote: |
| SoCalRich wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
And one more thing. If Koreans were as gullible or as easily manipulated as some people on here believe...how come there's no riot every time we are portrayed in the media as dope-addled sex predators?
How come there aren't numerous petitions asking the government to ban us from coming here?
How come we aren't wearing some form of electronic bracelet?
I could keep on asking questions, but I think it's fairly clear to anyone with a functioning brain that media reports of English teachers engaging in predatory sexual behavior don't drive the population into a lynching frenzy.
In fact can anyone show me a link to ONE incident involving an English teacher and said behaviour that did directly lead to a riot? (link to media report please, no hearsay)
Like I said, it's a Dave's myth. Let it die...it's past time. It's the foreign teachers version of "fan death". |
Well put and I agree with you but I think you are wasting your time trying to talk sense into these people. Some foreigners in Korea just want to feel like an oppressed minority and come on Dave's to reinforce those beliefs. Any naysayers will get an immediate rebuttal even if it doesn't make sense. Their favorite terminology for anyone trying to talk sense to them is Apologist (ie: "So what do all of you apologists have to say about that!") I've seen it a million times, not only on Dave's but on the internet in general. Rarely does an internet forum regular ever admit that they are wrong. Rarely are they open minded. |
We're not an oppressed minority and I don't believe in the anti-English Spectrum conspiracy, but you can't deny there's a difference in the way the Canadian media treat incidents like this compared with the Korean media. A Canadian newspaper would probably withhold the identities of the accused people and leave out the fact that they belonged to a Korean church, in order to protect the privacy of the victims.. |
In the cases discussed above, I didn't see the identities of the foreign teachers revealed either (with the exception of CPN). And you realize that it was the Toronto police that released the names of the Koreans in the OP? Anyway are you trying to say that the Canadian media has NEVER released the names of accused people? Because that's clearly wrong.
Besides which that is not the topic we are discussing. If you need a reminder look at the OP. |
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Bramble
Joined: 26 Jan 2007
Location: National treasures need homes
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| Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Bramble wrote: |
| SoCalRich wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
And one more thing. If Koreans were as gullible or as easily manipulated as some people on here believe...how come there's no riot every time we are portrayed in the media as dope-addled sex predators?
How come there aren't numerous petitions asking the government to ban us from coming here?
How come we aren't wearing some form of electronic bracelet?
I could keep on asking questions, but I think it's fairly clear to anyone with a functioning brain that media reports of English teachers engaging in predatory sexual behavior don't drive the population into a lynching frenzy.
In fact can anyone show me a link to ONE incident involving an English teacher and said behaviour that did directly lead to a riot? (link to media report please, no hearsay)
Like I said, it's a Dave's myth. Let it die...it's past time. It's the foreign teachers version of "fan death". |
Well put and I agree with you but I think you are wasting your time trying to talk sense into these people. Some foreigners in Korea just want to feel like an oppressed minority and come on Dave's to reinforce those beliefs. Any naysayers will get an immediate rebuttal even if it doesn't make sense. Their favorite terminology for anyone trying to talk sense to them is Apologist (ie: "So what do all of you apologists have to say about that!") I've seen it a million times, not only on Dave's but on the internet in general. Rarely does an internet forum regular ever admit that they are wrong. Rarely are they open minded. |
We're not an oppressed minority and I don't believe in the anti-English Spectrum conspiracy, but you can't deny there's a difference in the way the Canadian media treat incidents like this compared with the Korean media. A Canadian newspaper would probably withhold the identities of the accused people and leave out the fact that they belonged to a Korean church, in order to protect the privacy of the victims.. |
In the cases discussed above, I didn't see the identities of the foreign teachers revealed either (with the exception of CPN). |
But the papers here will say, "an Uzbekistani man killed another Uzbekistani man at a factory in [wherever]" instead of just saying a man is accused of killing a co-worker at a factory. I don't think it's done maliciously, but it suggests their nationality is relevant when we wouldn't consider it relevant in Canada. The Times published that story about the sex offence allegations in Canada complete with all the names and cities, and even mentioned the Korean church where the [alleged] rapists [allegedly] found their victims. That could lead to the victims being identified.
Edit: I know what we're discussing. Do you? I never said accused people were NEVER identified in the media, just that the Canadian media tend to be more careful when releasing certain information that could lead to victims being identified or groups being stereotyped. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Bramble wrote: |
[q
Edit: I know what we're discussing. Do you? . |
Yes we are discussing the claims that Koreans would riot in the street if it had been the other way around.
I merely showed that this has not been true of a SINGLE incident where a foreign teacher has been involved in a sexual crime. |
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Bramble
Joined: 26 Jan 2007
Location: National treasures need homes
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| Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Bramble wrote: |
[q
Edit: I know what we're discussing. Do you? . |
Yes we are discussing the claims that Koreans would riot in the street if it had been the other way around.
I merely showed that this has not been true of a SINGLE incident where a foreign teacher has been involved in a sexual crime. |
Sure, we could discuss a ridiculous, farfetched hypothetical claim if you want. Or we could react to the story itself and ask whether the Times is reporting on it responsibly and how the media (in any country) should handle these kinds of situations (involving any group). |
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dirving
Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Location: South Korea
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| Posted: Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:55 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| SoCalRich wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
And one more thing. If Koreans were as gullible or as easily manipulated as some people on here believe...how come there's no riot every time we are portrayed in the media as dope-addled sex predators?
How come there aren't numerous petitions asking the government to ban us from coming here?
How come we aren't wearing some form of electronic bracelet?
I could keep on asking questions, but I think it's fairly clear to anyone with a functioning brain that media reports of English teachers engaging in predatory sexual behavior don't drive the population into a lynching frenzy.
In fact can anyone show me a link to ONE incident involving an English teacher and said behaviour that did directly lead to a riot? (link to media report please, no hearsay)
Like I said, it's a Dave's myth. Let it die...it's past time. It's the foreign teachers version of "fan death". |
Well put and I agree with you but I think you are wasting your time trying to talk sense into these people. Some foreigners in Korea just want to feel like an oppressed minority and come on Dave's to reinforce those beliefs. Any naysayers will get an immediate rebuttal even if it doesn't make sense. Their favorite terminology for anyone trying to talk sense to them is Apologist (ie: "So what do all of you apologists have to say about that!") I've seen it a million times, not only on Dave's but on the internet in general. Rarely does an internet forum regular ever admit that they are wrong. Rarely are they open minded. |
That's fine. I'll take their silence as assent then. |
I negate your views about this topic and demand a cold Sam Adams beer as compensation! |
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Los Angeloser
Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 10:40 pm Post subject: Re: Koreans charge with rape in Canada |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Tud Ferguson wrote: |
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2010/03/117_62758.html
If the situation were the other way around, we would never here the end of it, the name calling, calls for all teachers to be deported and all forms of stupid comments would be endless. Politicians would have a field day. But I bet you would be hard pressed to find a single Canadian who would say that all Koreans are horrible people who come to their country to commit crimes and steal their women. Why do westerners understand that you can't demonize an entire group based on the actions of a few, but here in Gorea the generalizing is over the top. |
Actually there has been at least one American teacher not only charged but convicted of rape. A GI (Westerner) was also charged with rape. Several other Westerners (teachers) have been charged with molesting children in their charge. I provided the link to this in the OTHER THREAD which talks about this.
Yet where are these names, and calls for all teachers to be deported?
Point is it HAS happened, and your apocalyptic scenario has not come about. |
Wrong again! A little ko jit mal and/or exaggeration, don't you do what you blame others for? And really, the Korean media does more than exaggerate or blow out of proportion so how do you expect English teachers to react to such absurdity? But, I wouldn't put any $ against demonstrations if I were you.
An American teacher was not convicted of rape(2002 joongang daily "Commission may release photos of people convicted of sex crimes with minors"). Why don't you check on that so-called conviction and get back with us. Maybe Koreans haven't taken to the streets against English teachers because the others(nice try bringing a GI into the conversation) were only charges, not conviction? Actually, Koreans have taken to the streets, it's done when AES passes out hate speech gotten/downloaded off of Naver cafe blogs via AES against us. Would you like a picture, I'm sure you've seen one before? Or how about threats or signs saying "Watch out for illegal English teacher."
Anyway, I consider 350 negative media stories/lies/racist comments in 2009 the equivalent to taking to the streets(that's one per day). No demonstration could do better than that aye?
Something I noticed in that article, it mentions "people," "sex offenders," "women," and an "American English teacher," don't you think it's missing anyone? We certainly wouldn't want names and photos of men to be released now would we, for thine is the reason men aren't mentioned. |
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Stout
Joined: 28 May 2011
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| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 5:36 am Post subject: |
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| You can bet that if a Korean raped a white girl in North America the sheet would hit the fan. Guaranteed. And English teachers generally don't need to rape, 'cos they are exotic and desirable to young Korean females (unless you're in the sticks, perhaps). |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:20 pm Post subject: Re: Koreans charge with rape in Canada |
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| Los Angeloser wrote: |
[q
An American teacher was not convicted of rape(2002 joongang daily "Commission may release photos of people convicted of sex crimes with minors"). Why don't you check on that so-called conviction and get back with us. |
I did that. The article clearly states " An American English teacher CONVICTED of attempting to rape one of his students.."
It's the second paragraph from the bottom.
(capitals are mine)
If you want to be really technical he was convicted of attempted rape...but he would have raped her had he been able...so the distinction is rather pointless here.
Point is that foreign teachers in the past have faced accusations of sex crimes yet there is not a single incident of Koreans rioting in the streets over such claims even when published by Korean news outlets.'
Game. Set. Match.
Last edited by TheUrbanMyth on Tue Jun 21, 2011 1:38 am; edited 1 time in total |
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