Korean Job Discussion Forums

[World Traveler]

[Zilong]

[English Matt]

Madoka doesn't work as an English Teacher WT.

Look I'm going to spell things out for you. The average liberal arts student does not graduate with hard skills that companies look for in their new hires. Sure there are a lot of soft skills, such as being able to put together a coherent, cogent argument, synthesise large amounts of information into concise, well constructed essays and reports, work independently and be proactive about one's own workload and so on.....however these are worth little if they are not complemented by specialised skills, such as knowledge of foreign and / or programming languages, training in qualitative and quantitative research methods, the ability to use software packages such as the MS Office Suite, Dreamweaver, Flash, Flex, Java Script, etc. If your degree did not provide you with these skills (and someone studying History or English, for instance, will in most cases not learn any of the aforementioned during their studies) then you will not be able to get a decent entry-level graduate job in the US or elsewhere.

In the UK, most people (whom I know) that graduate with only a Bachelors, take up work in offices which pay between �16000 - �20000 a year. They don't work in McDonalds....I don't think anybody set up that dichotomy in this thread.

They get stuck in such jobs until such time as they get admitted to a graduate scheme in another company, are able to use their years of experience in their first job to land something with progression, are able to prove themselves and get promoted within the company, or retrain (i.e. go back to University and obtain their Masters, PhD, teaching qualification, medical degree, LLB (JD) or some other form of professional qualification that allows them to pursue a career in a particular field).

The median graduate salary in the UK is �25000


http://www.prospects.ac.uk/cms/ShowPage/Home_page/How_much_could_I_earn_/Salary_and_vacancy_FAQs__2_/What_is_the_average_graduate_starting_salary_/p!eaLXbeX

The average salaries of more than 50% of graduates is in the �22000 - �27000 range. I can tell you from experience that the vast majority of these jobs will be in London and the south-east of England. Even �27000 a year will not allow you to save as much money in a year as you can in Korea once you have factored in rent, tax and living expenses. And that is if you can find a job; as of November 2009 graduate unemployment had increased by 44% year on year and was (and is) expected to only get worse.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/nov/02/graduate-job-losses-increase

This doesn't factor in an increase in underemployment amongst graduates taking jobs in places like call centres for salaries (and often wages instead) that are far lower than one would expect a grad to be earning. Or the number of graduates emigrating or moving abroad to teach English in places like Korea, have working holidays in Canada, New Zealand and Australia, or returning to study to try to beat the recession (depression).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/education/8619922.stm

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/oct/03/teaching-english-foreign-language

http://www.eyefortravel.com/news/europe/recession-fuelling-gap-year-travel-sector


Quite frankly I think (and good lord I'm about to repeat the words of another poster addressed to me in a prior thread...oh, the irony) you are a little optimistic about the situation back home and naive as to the reality of getting a decent job with a good salary and career progression.

Straight out of University, many a graduate nowadays ends up under-employed and / or unemployed. When comparing the savings potential of a 2.1 mil a month job teaching English in Korea (with no rent, tax between 5 - 10%, lots of vacation, free flights back home each time you renew a contract or switch to a new job, severance bonuses, OT pay, and pension contribution refunds for you N. Americans) to the situations and savings potential back home for these people, how can you not see that it might be better for them here (for the time being, not the rest of their lives...nobody is saying that) than back home right now?

If you want a decent 'graduate job' then a BA or even a BSc is often not enough to make the cut nowadays. Sorry to break it to you, but times are tough and we are (each of us) going to have to work 10 times harder than prior generations to get these jobs.....studying for Masters degrees, attaining professional qualifications, learning foreign languages, doing internships to gain experience (and more) are all part and parcel of the work that lies ahead of many of us before we can realise our potential and obtain gainful employment that we will find both satisfying and engaging (as well as intellectually and financially rewarding). And it's going to cost a lot of money......something you can actually save in Korea, whilst travelling the world during your holidays, buying yourself nice clothes and toys, hanging out with friends and using your downtime to work on things like learning foreign languages. Being unemployed or underemployed back home and saving little coin is not going to get any of us to where we want to be.......living in Korea and saving �6000 - �10000 a year will.

I wouldn't want to stay here forever....I've been here almost two years and will be leaving soon.....but my time here has enabled me to clear my debts and save enough money to pursue my future goals - something I would be years away from had I stayed in the UK. That being said, what makes you think everybody wants to return home.....many people who work in Korea are in love with the idea of an international career and life; often this is just a few year stopover before moving on to something else (with a fresh clutch of experiences and bulging bank accounts).

And as regards your snide remark about being here to make money.....news just in the Pope has admitted to Catholic tendencies and a bear was reported disappearing into a wood with a roll of loopaper. What the hell were those youtube links about.....I take it your here to end the deadlock between the two Koreas and reunite the peninsula are you?

[World Traveler]

[World Traveler]

[fustiancorduroy]

[Zilong]

[English Matt]

[fustiancorduroy]

[World Traveler]

[English Matt]

[TheUrbanMyth]

[ThingsComeAround]

Seeing as how this thread has been derailed for far too long, here's an attempt to bring it back on track

Pay is crap in Korea because
1) There is no retention, or training of the teachers they do have.
BEFORE APOLOGISTS JUMP ON THIS, MANY COMPANIES/GOVT AGENCIES IN KOREA TRAIN THEIR OWN EMPLOYEES TO HELP THEM PERFORM BETTER. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN IN ESL
2) Korea is not seen as a "long-term" ESL career choice.
If there was someplace to be destined as "long-term", it wouldn't be here. "Long term" in the eyes of Korea is usually 5 years- that is if you don't apply for the F visa.
3) Not enough people take Korea/Koreans seriously.
Not meant to be cruel, but most people come here and thing they are the Bees Knees. Feeling that Korea is the "lower rung" as far as culture in Asia goes compared to Japan or China, they are underachievers doing what they do best.

[Banana_Man]

[TheUrbanMyth]

Bottom line:

If you improve yourself, you can improve your job.

It all comes down to you in the end.