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Cleaning up the gulf coast oil spill
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matthews_world



Joined: 15 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Sat May 01, 2010 8:08 am    Post subject: Cleaning up the gulf coast oil spill Reply with quote

We've all been hearing the news reports.

The slick has already spread east to the shores of Pensacola.

Has FEMA done a good job in planning for clean up?

The National Guard and volunteers are being mobilized to help with the clean up.

I've even read online that the government will be contracting headhunting companies to find workers who can earn a decent days wage $10-18 per hour to go down and participate in reclamation of the wetlands there.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2010-04-30-oil-cleanup-jobs_N.htm?csp=34&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+UsatodaycomNation-TopStories+(News+-+Nation+-+Top+Stories)

http://neworleans.craigslist.org/lab/


I'm between contracts here stateside and this opportunity is sounding interesting. I personally wasn't able to take part in the Taean oil spill clean up a few years ago and think this would be admirable to take part in.

Anyone else heard anything or considering do this?
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nautilus



Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!

PostPosted: Sat May 01, 2010 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is massive news but strangely enough nobody's interested on dave's.

maybe its because very few know or care about the environment at all.

Humans. The trash on the planet.
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Globutron



Joined: 13 Feb 2010
Location: England/Anyang

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 3:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been spending my time reading about it, and I'm not even American.
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nautilus



Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 4:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Globutron wrote:
I've been spending my time reading about it, and I'm not even American.


Note that BP aren't even moving their as s es to stop it pumping out crude.
they're clueless...
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Dev



Joined: 18 Apr 2006

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The main problem is that whatever environmental laws there are, they're not strictly enforced.

The only way we will stop seeing disasters like this is through public outrage.

Unfortunately, people are more interested in the baseball game.
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Globutron



Joined: 13 Feb 2010
Location: England/Anyang

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dev wrote:
The main problem is that whatever environmental laws there are, they're not strictly enforced.

The only way we will stop seeing disasters like this is through public outrage.

Unfortunately, people are more interested in the baseball game.


Hah, powerfully true.
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Senior



Joined: 31 Jan 2010

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 5:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nautilus wrote:
Globutron wrote:
I've been spending my time reading about it, and I'm not even American.


Note that BP aren't even moving their as s es to stop it pumping out crude.
they're clueless...


How would you know? Are you there right now?

Do you think they do this stuff on purpose? They will fix it, or they will get their ass sued.
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Senior



Joined: 31 Jan 2010

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 6:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nautilus wrote:


Humans. The trash on the planet.


It takes a special kind of self loathing to make a statement like this, with a straight face.
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AsiaESLbound



Joined: 07 Jan 2010
Location: Truck Stop Missouri

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 6:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the good to be found in this is oil companies will have to spend mucho dinero cleaning it up which trickles down to many capable able bodied people willing to work, but find themselves underemployed in such a lackluster time. Finding the manpower to clean up isn't going to be problem, but acting in a timely manner to do effective work may prove fatal to the protection of our marine environment in the gulf. The companies and wealthy need to be pouring more into the domestic economy and only anything causing them serious problems to operate is going to sway some trickle down effect that seems to be severely lacking in today's job market and economy. I hope they get more than enough people to work in cleaning it up and are successful in getting the job done.
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Senior



Joined: 31 Jan 2010

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AsiaESLbound wrote:
I think the good to be found in this is oil companies will have to spend mucho dinero cleaning it up which trickles down to many capable able bodied people willing to work, but find themselves underemployed in such a lackluster time. Finding the manpower to clean up isn't going to be problem, but acting in a timely manner to do effective work may prove fatal to the protection of our marine environment in the gulf. The companies and wealthy need to be pouring more into the domestic economy and only anything causing them serious problems to operate is going to sway some trickle down effect that seems to be severely lacking in today's job market and economy. I hope they get more than enough people to work in cleaning it up and are successful in getting the job done.


Complete fallacy. (The broken window variety. Google it if you don't believe me.)

Here. I'll do it for you.
http://www.google.co.nz/#hl=en&source=hp&q=broken+window+fallacy&meta=&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=broken+windo&gs_rfai=&fp=6132aaaf1926218d

If you read the first five results, you will get a pretty thorough run down of some of the biggest fallacies in life. And you might learn to think twice before making brain dead remarks, like the one above.

An oil spill doesn't create jobs. It just means that the oil company won't spend that money elsewhere.
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AsiaESLbound



Joined: 07 Jan 2010
Location: Truck Stop Missouri

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, it won't mean a net economy improvement, but it will mean temporary jobs for unemployed able bodied people willing to work. You are right, if the spill had never happened, then that money and time would had been spent in other productive ways. Possibly not if just held in the coffers. My theory is that the wealthy are holding the purse strings very tight in this economy and incidents or problems interfering with their operations forces them to invest something domestically which trickles back down to people who need it. In a perfect economy humming right along, broken window theory holds 100% true, but the purse strings at the top are held tight in this economy.The theory holds 100% true if that oil company was going to spend all this clean up money and lost time on domestic oil exploration that now won't happen.
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Kikomom



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: them thar hills--Penna, USA--Zippy is my kid, the teacher in ROK. You can call me Kiko

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The National Audubon Society is looking for volunteers.
http://www.audubonaction.org/site/Survey?ACTION_REQUIRED=URI_ACTION_USER_REQUESTS&SURVEY_ID=3400

So is BP, which is bs. Who would work for them for free?
http://www.facebook.com/DeepwaterHorizonResponse?ref=mf
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retorsion



Joined: 20 Apr 2010

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Senior wrote:
AsiaESLbound wrote:
I think the good to be found in this is oil companies will have to spend mucho dinero cleaning it up which trickles down to many capable able bodied people willing to work, but find themselves underemployed in such a lackluster time. Finding the manpower to clean up isn't going to be problem, but acting in a timely manner to do effective work may prove fatal to the protection of our marine environment in the gulf. The companies and wealthy need to be pouring more into the domestic economy and only anything causing them serious problems to operate is going to sway some trickle down effect that seems to be severely lacking in today's job market and economy. I hope they get more than enough people to work in cleaning it up and are successful in getting the job done.


Complete fallacy. (The broken window variety. Google it if you don't believe me.)

Here. I'll do it for you.
http://www.google.co.nz/#hl=en&source=hp&q=broken+window+fallacy&meta=&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=broken+windo&gs_rfai=&fp=6132aaaf1926218d

If you read the first five results, you will get a pretty thorough run down of some of the biggest fallacies in life. And you might learn to think twice before making brain dead remarks, like the one above.

An oil spill doesn't create jobs. It just means that the oil company won't spend that money elsewhere.


Actually you're both partially right.

What will happen is that BP will have much higher expenses this year than they anticipated. They will finance this increase in expenses by increasing their debt. So, yes, BP will (in the short term) be spending more money than they anticipated. Considering that right now the world is recovering from a severe recession, the fact that BP may reduce their expenses over the long term (to pay for recently incurred debt) is of little consequence.

Anyway, try not to be so bloody pretentious in the future. As a good friend of mine said once "Always keep your words soft and sweet, just in case you have to eat them." You owe AsiaESLbound an apology, IMO. What he said wasn't 'brain dead' at all.
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Senior



Joined: 31 Jan 2010

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

retorsion wrote:
Senior wrote:
AsiaESLbound wrote:
I think the good to be found in this is oil companies will have to spend mucho dinero cleaning it up which trickles down to many capable able bodied people willing to work, but find themselves underemployed in such a lackluster time. Finding the manpower to clean up isn't going to be problem, but acting in a timely manner to do effective work may prove fatal to the protection of our marine environment in the gulf. The companies and wealthy need to be pouring more into the domestic economy and only anything causing them serious problems to operate is going to sway some trickle down effect that seems to be severely lacking in today's job market and economy. I hope they get more than enough people to work in cleaning it up and are successful in getting the job done.


Complete fallacy. (The broken window variety. Google it if you don't believe me.)

Here. I'll do it for you.
http://www.google.co.nz/#hl=en&source=hp&q=broken+window+fallacy&meta=&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=broken+windo&gs_rfai=&fp=6132aaaf1926218d

If you read the first five results, you will get a pretty thorough run down of some of the biggest fallacies in life. And you might learn to think twice before making brain dead remarks, like the one above.

An oil spill doesn't create jobs. It just means that the oil company won't spend that money elsewhere.


Actually you're both partially right.

What will happen is that BP will have much higher expenses this year than they anticipated. They will finance this increase in expenses by increasing their debt. So, yes, BP will (in the short term) be spending more money than they anticipated. Considering that right now the world is recovering from a severe recession, the fact that BP may reduce their expenses over the long term (to pay for recently incurred debt) is of little consequence.

Anyway, try not to be so bloody pretentious in the future. As a good friend of mine said once "Always keep your words soft and sweet, just in case you have to eat them." You owe AsiaESLbound an apology, IMO. What he said wasn't 'brain dead' at all.


There isn't any new wealth in the economy. There isn't a net benefit as a result of oil spills or any type of "broken window". Even if one group benefits from this, everyone in total will still be made worse off.

Debt is still a form of resources. If BP has to use more of it, there will be less of it to spend in productive areas.
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Dev



Joined: 18 Apr 2006

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing you almost never hear regarding a country's dependence on oil is the fact that the consumer shares a lot of the blame.

Greenpeace or whoever should tell people to cut down on their driving to protest the Iraq war and the oil spill. People should try to walk more for shorter trips. Get on a bicycle. Cars are part of the reason people in Western countries are so fat.
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