| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
|
 Posted: Thu May 20, 2010 8:49 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
All this commotion happens just like clockwork. Every couple of years NK does something like test a nuclear weapon, fire missiles towards the direction of Japan, shoot at a navy ship during the 2002 world cup, beach a submarine off the coast of Kangwon and this. For anyone who hasn't been here long enough to know better, it's all normal stuff.
Of course if any of this stuff happened to the US they'd probably be attacking already. But most countries are like 10 hours airplanes ride away from most Americans. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
hypnotoad777
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2010 8:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| jvalmer wrote: |
All this commotion happens just like clockwork. Every couple of years NK does something like test a nuclear weapon, fire missiles towards the direction of Japan, shoot at a navy ship during the 2002 world cup, beach a submarine off the coast of Kangwon and this. For anyone who hasn't been here long enough to know better, it's all normal stuff.
Of course if any of this stuff happened to the US they'd probably be attacking already. But most countries are like 10 hours airplanes ride away from most Americans. |
Make that 22 hours! Thanks. That's the most reassuring thing I've heard all day...as reassuring as that can be. Haha. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nautilus
Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 2:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
| hypnotoad777 wrote: |
| But this language seems to be far more dramatic. |
Koreans in general are pretty melodramatic.
I've learned to ignore it.... It means nothing.
Adversarial and combative is their default setting. Just listen to a Korean couple conversing for 30 minutes and you'll get the picture. They appear to be in a constant state of crisis about everything and nothing.
This is what the outside world probably doesn't understand about korean mentality. Its all exaggerated theatrics, nothing more. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sector7G
Joined: 24 May 2008
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 2:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
| nautilus wrote: |
This is what the outside world probably doesn't understand about korean mentality. Its all exaggerated theatrics, nothing more. |
Would you describe the sinking of a warship and 46 dead sailors as exaggerated theatrics? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nautilus
Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 4:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Sector7G wrote: |
Would you describe the sinking of a warship and 46 dead sailors as exaggerated theatrics? |
Its brinkmanship. Another cornerstone of Korean behaviour.
Never worked for a hogwon boss? They try it on constantly to see what they can get away with.
Unfortunately its come down to torpedoing a ship because South korea has been letting them get away with things for far too long.
that doesn't mean that NK actually wants war. its just another ploy they know they can pull off. they've basically called South korea's bluff.
And first thing ROk does is squeal like a pig to the international community. Spit upon foreigners in peacetime, beg their help in a crisis. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
conrad2
Joined: 05 Nov 2009
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 7:08 am Post subject: |
|
|
| nautilus wrote: |
| Sector7G wrote: |
Would you describe the sinking of a warship and 46 dead sailors as exaggerated theatrics? |
Its brinkmanship. Another cornerstone of Korean behaviour.
Never worked for a hogwon boss? They try it on constantly to see what they can get away with.
Unfortunately its come down to torpedoing a ship because South korea has been letting them get away with things for far too long.
that doesn't mean that NK actually wants war. its just another ploy they know they can pull off. they've basically called South korea's bluff.
And first thing ROk does is squeal like a pig to the international community. Spit upon foreigners in peacetime, beg their help in a crisis. |
Maybe its time to call the Norks bluff. Send some missiles into Pyongyang and see what they do. My guess is jack shite. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 7:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
| conrad2 wrote: |
Maybe its time to call the Norks bluff. Send some missiles into Pyongyang and see what they do. My guess is jack shite. |
You don't risk the fires of hell raining down on the 20 million or so people who live within DPRK artillery range on a hunch.
A military response is unthinkable. The DPRK will get away with it. The Chinese and Koreans need to work together on influencing the DPRK from the inside. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
HijackedTwilight
Joined: 15 Jan 2008
Location: Daegu
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 7:24 am Post subject: |
|
|
| jvalmer wrote: |
| All this commotion happens just like clockwork. Every couple of years NK does something like test a nuclear weapon, fire missiles towards the direction of Japan, shoot at a navy ship during the 2002 world cup, beach a submarine off the coast of Kangwon and this. For anyone who hasn't been here long enough to know better, it's all normal stuff. |
Of course it's not normal. Sinking a ship and killing 46 people is obviously worse than those things on your list. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hypnotoad777
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 8:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
| HijackedTwilight wrote: |
| jvalmer wrote: |
| All this commotion happens just like clockwork. Every couple of years NK does something like test a nuclear weapon, fire missiles towards the direction of Japan, shoot at a navy ship during the 2002 world cup, beach a submarine off the coast of Kangwon and this. For anyone who hasn't been here long enough to know better, it's all normal stuff. |
Of course it's not normal. Sinking a ship and killing 46 people is obviously worse than those things on your list. |
Not necessarily. A decent amount of death in many of these situations.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/northkorea/7745048/Timeline-of-clashes-between-South-and-North-Korea.html
Maybe it's just not "normal" to us. Of course it's an awful, miserable situation. But as to whether the situation is "escalating" or not seems difficult for me to determine. In one podcast I listened to recently, there's even the possibility that North Korea may have been trying to send a warning shot which would account for the explosion never contacting the Cheonan. No way to know for sure.
Regardless, the very fact that this behavior has continued for so long does seems to support the "brinksmanship" idea. When you are poor and your only bargaining chip is your military power, you may turn to that more than not...especially as China has more of an interest in peace in the Penninsula and is involved in the world economy. Again in this podcast, experts say officials in North Korea feel that disallowing any amount of peace and open communication is the only way they can control their fate, as pervasive as their capitalist enemy is throughout the area.
If anyone's interested, those podcasts are through the Korea Society, accessible on Itunes and the one of note was In The Wake : Weighing Korean Options After the Cheonan Sinking. Very informative. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
HijackedTwilight
Joined: 15 Jan 2008
Location: Daegu
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 8:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Yeah, I agree with you that have to take this in the context of history.
I also think, though, that it's kind of sloppy analysis when some people say it's just another incident of North Korean BS, same old same old. That's too easy. Things are never quite the same. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Happy Warrior
Joined: 10 Feb 2010
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 9:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| mises wrote: |
| conrad2 wrote: |
Maybe its time to call the Norks bluff. Send some missiles into Pyongyang and see what they do. My guess is jack shite. |
You don't risk the fires of hell raining down on the 20 million or so people who live within DPRK artillery range on a hunch.
A military response is unthinkable. The DPRK will get away with it. The Chinese and Koreans need to work together on influencing the DPRK from the inside. |
The Chinese need to stop enabling this behavior. The rationale behind Chinese support for North Korea is stability. 'If China cuts off supply, the situation will get worse.' Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's what North Korea counts on when it makes these provocations.
I also agree with Hijacked. This is an extremely serious provocation, and this comes at a time when the Nork regime faces an extremely serious internal crisis. This is not the same ol', same ol'. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hypnotoad777
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 9:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| HijackedTwilight wrote: |
Yeah, I agree with you that have to take this in the context of history.
I also think, though, that it's kind of sloppy analysis when some people say it's just another incident of North Korean BS, same old same old. That's too easy. Things are never quite the same. |
Of course. And that's probably why sanctions will have to go through now regardless of whatever crazy threats are being made. And if they do indeed attack as they are threatening, we can't say we didn't try. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hypnotoad777
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 9:59 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| hypnotoad777 wrote: |
| HijackedTwilight wrote: |
Yeah, I agree with you that have to take this in the context of history.
I also think, though, that it's kind of sloppy analysis when some people say it's just another incident of North Korean BS, same old same old. That's too easy. Things are never quite the same. |
Of course. And that's probably why sanctions will have to go through now regardless of whatever crazy threats are being made. And if they do indeed attack as they are threatening, we can't say we didn't try. |
I'm not saying "same ol same ol" - Just saying it's impossible to gauge how close to war S. Korea is and thus shouldn't be reactionary at this juncture. This isn't to say that that they shouldn't be completely ready...and from what I'm reading, S. Korea and the U.S. are fairly dedicated to the continued strengthening, training, etc. of their military and upgrading of defenses.
And now we play the waiting game... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
|
| Posted: Fri May 21, 2010 10:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Well if people start stockpiling on rice, then you know Koreans are worried. Last time it happened was around 94 when Clinton wanted to take out their nuclear facilities. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nautilus
Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!
|
| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 2:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| HijackedTwilight wrote: |
| Sinking a ship and killing 46 people is obviously worse than those things on your list. |
Is it worse than killing half the cabinet at a conference with a bomb, sending commandos ashore at Gangwon-do killing 15 people before being stopped, bringing down a south Korean airliner killing the hundreds on board?
DPRK has done far worse than this before and as always, nothing has happened except the rhetoric gets temporarily ratchetted up. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
