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grant gerstners
Joined: 13 Jan 2010
Location: USA
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 Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 11:39 am Post subject: non-teaching overtime; 6000/hr? |
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The sample contract over at www.epik.go.kr/
includes the following about non-teaching overtime:
The Employer may require the Employee to work non-instructional overtime hours in addition to④normal Work Hours. In this case, the Employee shall be entitled to supplementary overtime pay of6,000 won per hour.
I know it's just a sample, but I assume it is meant to be representative of real contracts. Does that mean every hour of non-intructional overtime is paid 6000 won, or do I mis-undertand? |
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marlow
Joined: 06 Feb 2005
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| Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 11:52 am Post subject: Re: non-teaching overtime; 6000/hr? |
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| grant gerstners wrote: |
| Does that mean every hour of non-intructional overtime is paid 6000 won, or do I mis-undertand? |
That's what it means. So if the district office orders you to come and judge a speech contest, or to edit listening tests, and you work overtime from about 4 p.m. to 9 p.m., then you can expect to get about 30,000 won. And if it's your school that is getting you to stay extra time for whatever reason, like for a staff meeting or something mandatory on a Saturday, then there is a good possibility they won't even expect to pay you--and you'll be seen as greedy for asking.
Salary is considered as compensation for ALL your time. Out of kindness usually the school only demands 40 hours per week.  |
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oldfatfarang
Joined: 19 May 2005
Location: On the road to somewhere.
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| Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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One of my schools recently asked me to teach special classes between 7.50 am and 8.30am (for 25,000 won an hour). When I asked why the money was so low, they said: "That's what the Korean teachers get paid".
I told them: "I wouldn't get out of bed for that amount of money".
Thanks for the quote, Helena Christensen. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 4:23 pm Post subject: Re: non-teaching overtime; 6000/hr? |
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| marlow wrote: |
| grant gerstners wrote: |
| Does that mean every hour of non-intructional overtime is paid 6000 won, or do I mis-undertand? |
That's what it means. So if the district office orders you to come and judge a speech contest, or to edit listening tests, and you work overtime from about 4 p.m. to 9 p.m., then you can expect to get about 30,000 won. And if it's your school that is getting you to stay extra time for whatever reason, like for a staff meeting or something mandatory on a Saturday, then there is a good possibility they won't even expect to pay you--and you'll be seen as greedy for asking.
Salary is considered as compensation for ALL your time. Out of kindness usually the school only demands 40 hours per week. |
Just say no thanks. Saturdays are non working days. Out of the two public schools I have worked at, I have been asked a total of four times.
I've politely told them that I am unavailable on these days.
And no salary is not considered as compensation for ALL your time. That is why we get paid extra for OT and it's in the contract. It's not that they won't expect to pay you...it's either that they haven't read the contract OR hope that you won't ask and then they can pocket the extra for parties.
My last public school tried to tell me that they don't pay OT...it's put into a special fund instead for those after school dinners. I pointed out that I hardly attend these dinners anyway so I'd rather have the money thank you very much. They didn't look especially thrilled...too bad so sad, sucks to be them. |
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Captain Von Sillypants
Joined: 17 May 2010
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| Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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I occasionally do those weekend camp days, but I get paid about 100k for 3 hours, and know months in advance.
Otherwise, remember these words: Sorry I'm soooo busy. |
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jonpurdy
Joined: 08 Jan 2009
Location: Ulsan
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| Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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| I've never seen anyone paid at that rate. Overtime outside of 9-5 is always at around 30,000 or so. If you were actually offered that rate you could easily refuse since it's outside of working hours. Nobody can make you come in on a Saturday. |
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Senior
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 7:34 pm Post subject: Re: non-teaching overtime; 6000/hr? |
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| marlow wrote: |
| grant gerstners wrote: |
| Does that mean every hour of non-intructional overtime is paid 6000 won, or do I mis-undertand? |
That's what it means. So if the district office orders you to come and judge a speech contest, or to edit listening tests, and you work overtime from about 4 p.m. to 9 p.m., then you can expect to get about 30,000 won. And if it's your school that is getting you to stay extra time for whatever reason, like for a staff meeting or something mandatory on a Saturday, then there is a good possibility they won't even expect to pay you--and you'll be seen as greedy for asking.
Salary is considered as compensation for ALL your time. Out of kindness usually the school only demands 40 hours per week. |
This is utter bull.
I have never heard of anyone EVER being paid this rate of over time. The local office will never ORDER you to judge a speech contest. They will ask you, and you can say "Thanks, but no thanks." There are plenty of people who are willing to do it just to get out of normal classes, anyway. And it is unlikely that extra things like that will run over time. Koreans don't like working over time either.
You don't have to attend staff meetings. Unless it is a dinner, then it is a good idea to go get your free feed and booze, bow to the Principal and leave. That is what the Koreans do.
You will never have to come in on a Saturday. They might ask you, but you can say "No, thanks." Sometimes it might be a good idea just to bite the bullet and do it. It will probably be something fun anyway. School festival, sports day. You will get free food, and you will score a lot of brownie points. Still, if you don't want to, you don't have to.
Let me reiterate. In my experience, I have never heard of anyone being forced to work over time, then paid that rate. Feel free to chime in, I'm sure it has happened. But, it is exceedingly uncommon. |
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mmstyle
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: wherever
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| Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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| oldfatfarang wrote: |
One of my schools recently asked me to teach special classes between 7.50 am and 8.30am (for 25,000 won an hour). When I asked why the money was so low, they said: "That's what the Korean teachers get paid".
I told them: "I wouldn't get out of bed for that amount of money".
Thanks for the quote, Helena Christensen. |
You referring to L. Evangelista and the "I won't wake up for less than $10,000 a day?" |
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marlow
Joined: 06 Feb 2005
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| Posted: Thu May 27, 2010 6:04 am Post subject: Re: non-teaching overtime; 6000/hr? |
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| Senior wrote: |
| marlow wrote: |
| grant gerstners wrote: |
| Does that mean every hour of non-intructional overtime is paid 6000 won, or do I mis-undertand? |
That's what it means. So if the district office orders you to come and judge a speech contest, or to edit listening tests, and you work overtime from about 4 p.m. to 9 p.m., then you can expect to get about 30,000 won. And if it's your school that is getting you to stay extra time for whatever reason, like for a staff meeting or something mandatory on a Saturday, then there is a good possibility they won't even expect to pay you--and you'll be seen as greedy for asking.
Salary is considered as compensation for ALL your time. Out of kindness usually the school only demands 40 hours per week. |
This is utter bull.
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If the OP is coming for a year and then leaving, then it is utter bull, because saying no will build no negative repercussions. If you are in for a few years the quality of your later years depends highly on how much your school likes you. And if they don't like you, and insert any sort of competition, and you are transferred around to crap schools.
Having been in a single city for six years, and having seen contract clauses come and go, and teachers come and go, I can assure you that very bad clauses in contracts always affect things negatively. |
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Senior
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Thu May 27, 2010 6:24 am Post subject: Re: non-teaching overtime; 6000/hr? |
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| marlow wrote: |
| Senior wrote: |
| marlow wrote: |
| grant gerstners wrote: |
| Does that mean every hour of non-intructional overtime is paid 6000 won, or do I mis-undertand? |
That's what it means. So if the district office orders you to come and judge a speech contest, or to edit listening tests, and you work overtime from about 4 p.m. to 9 p.m., then you can expect to get about 30,000 won. And if it's your school that is getting you to stay extra time for whatever reason, like for a staff meeting or something mandatory on a Saturday, then there is a good possibility they won't even expect to pay you--and you'll be seen as greedy for asking.
Salary is considered as compensation for ALL your time. Out of kindness usually the school only demands 40 hours per week. |
This is utter bull.
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If the OP is coming for a year and then leaving, then it is utter bull, because saying no will build no negative repercussions. If you are in for a few years the quality of your later years depends highly on how much your school likes you. And if they don't like you, and insert any sort of competition, and you are transferred around to crap schools.
Having been in a single city for six years, and having seen contract clauses come and go, and teachers come and go, I can assure you that very bad clauses in contracts always affect things negatively. |
In my third year at the same school, and certainly not my experience.
If anything, if you give an inch they push you around more. Being a push over will make them like you less. |
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BoholDiver
Joined: 03 Oct 2009
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Thu May 27, 2010 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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| I agree. I won't leave the house for less than 45,000 won. |
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Ramen
Joined: 15 Apr 2008
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| Posted: Thu May 27, 2010 5:20 pm Post subject: Re: non-teaching overtime; 6000/hr? |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
Just say no thanks. |
+100 |
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marlow
Joined: 06 Feb 2005
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| Posted: Fri May 28, 2010 5:47 am Post subject: |
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| BoholDiver wrote: |
| I agree. I won't leave the house for less than 45,000 won. |
Good luck getting that in Busan at a public school these days. I used to enjoy the overtime and the high pay I could get in Busan, but when they started cutting overtime pay I was pissed. |
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sigmundsmith
Joined: 22 Nov 2007
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| Posted: Sat May 29, 2010 2:44 am Post subject: |
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The 6000 won extra has always been a sticky issue. When I was with SMOE I never heard personally anyone getting paid this.
I was a district rep when I was with SMOE. Always had teachers contact me saying that they are going to a school dinner, or an excursion with the school, or training session and should they get the 6000 won an hour overtime?
Always made me laugh.
This type of thing, I viewed, that if it is a repetitive thing - the school wanting you to sit and talk with students in the English Zone or be available on a regular basis then there is some justification. But if it is just a one off then I would never really contest the issue.
Then people would say that if they tried it once they will try it again. Well, be a man/women and stand up for yourself. If you feel that they are trying to use you without appropriate compensation on a regular basis, standup for yourself. |
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nstick13
Joined: 02 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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Wanted to bump this because some friends of mine are at an English Center with EPIK, and have mandatory evening OT every week at 7,000 won an hour, which is about half of their normal salary. They're there until 9 PM at least one night a week, I believe. After looking at their contract, I think they're SOL, unfortunately.
I'm currently fighting the give-an-inch-take-a-mile battle. I certainly don't mind going above and beyond for students, but do not like it being assumed that I will. It's easier to set boundaries and stand up for yourself early than deal with a year while being miserable and hating how busy you are. Be creative, and don't expect rational thought to be understood the first time, or even the fourth time. |
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