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nautilus
Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Location: Je jump, Tu jump, oui jump!
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 Posted: Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:36 pm Post subject: |
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| AsiaESLbound wrote: |
| American passports now have the chip. |
My EC passport has the chip too. Are these chips trackable at any time from satellite? or only when they get scanned at airports. |
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visitorq
Joined: 11 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2010 3:44 am Post subject: |
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| nautilus wrote: |
| AsiaESLbound wrote: |
| American passports now have the chip. |
My EC passport has the chip too. Are these chips trackable at any time from satellite? or only when they get scanned at airports. |
Afaik, the ones currently being used do not emit signals themselves (as they would require an internal power source to do so), but can still be scanned from quite long distances (ie. from 50 meters away by hidden scanners on the road, or cop cars etc.). Basically the idea is to have a government (or corporate) grid set in place so your chip is scanned as you enter and exit any areas or buildings (which keeps a detailed record of your movement), and whenever you do something like make a purchase (the chip also stores your personal ID information).
But I wouldn't be surprised if special chips with active long range signal transmission and/or GPS technology already exist. It would be pretty hard (and expensive) to mass produce, however. The grid system works just as good for the government's purposes. |
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MattAwesome
Joined: 30 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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If you ever played Metal Gear. That is what they did. Put nanochips in all the soldiers and guns to macro and micro manage their behavior and strategy.
Very powerful to its controller.
If you arent doing anything bad, why do you care if someone is watching what you have in your fridge? It's only a problem if the govt suddenly makes new laws to prohibit behavior.
And to the obamacare comment. youre an idiot. |
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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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| MattAwesome wrote: |
If you ever played Metal Gear. That is what they did. Put nanochips in all the soldiers and guns to macro and micro manage their behavior and strategy.
Very powerful to its controller.
If you arent doing anything bad, why do you care if someone is watching what you have in your fridge? It's only a problem if the govt suddenly makes new laws to prohibit behavior. |
Yeah, right. As if no one has ever been falsely accused before, nor hacked into. 
| It's as if you wrote: |
| Let's make the evil, socialist government even more powerful! |
OK, Matt. So I want to watch you 24/7 just to make sure you are not doing anything bad. You're not, right? So you should have no problem with that. Cool? Don't worry. You'll get used to the cameras in your bedroom and bathroom pretty quickly.
| Quote: |
| And to the obamacare comment. youre an idiot. |
Way to follow the TOS. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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| MattAwesome wrote: |
| If you arent doing anything bad, why do you care if someone is watching what you have in your fridge? It's only a problem if the govt suddenly makes new laws to prohibit behavior. |
It also allows for the convenient and indisputable manufacture of false evidence. If the data from your tracking chip says you were somewhere you really weren't, how on Earth can you convince a jury otherwise? No alibi is going to triumph over a government-endorsed claim that the data shows you were at the crime scene.
Technology is fallible, and technology is vulnerable to tampering. Stories like the trouble with voting machines we've had in certain parts of the country makes me totally uncomfortable with letting this kind of impact this could have on our criminal justice system. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 8:58 pm Post subject: |
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| visitorq wrote: |
| nautilus wrote: |
| AsiaESLbound wrote: |
| American passports now have the chip. |
My EC passport has the chip too. Are these chips trackable at any time from satellite? or only when they get scanned at airports. |
Afaik, the ones currently being used do not emit signals themselves (as they would require an internal power source to do so), but can still be scanned from quite long distances (ie. from 50 meters away by hidden scanners on the road, or cop cars etc.). Basically the idea is to have a government (or corporate) grid set in place so your chip is scanned as you enter and exit any areas or buildings (which keeps a detailed record of your movement), and whenever you do something like make a purchase (the chip also stores your personal ID information).
But I wouldn't be surprised if special chips with active long range signal transmission and/or GPS technology already exist. It would be pretty hard (and expensive) to mass produce, however. The grid system works just as good for the government's purposes. |
Suppose you pay cash. How exactly would your chip track your purchase? |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 10:13 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| visitorq wrote: |
| nautilus wrote: |
| AsiaESLbound wrote: |
| American passports now have the chip. |
My EC passport has the chip too. Are these chips trackable at any time from satellite? or only when they get scanned at airports. |
Afaik, the ones currently being used do not emit signals themselves (as they would require an internal power source to do so), but can still be scanned from quite long distances (ie. from 50 meters away by hidden scanners on the road, or cop cars etc.). Basically the idea is to have a government (or corporate) grid set in place so your chip is scanned as you enter and exit any areas or buildings (which keeps a detailed record of your movement), and whenever you do something like make a purchase (the chip also stores your personal ID information).
But I wouldn't be surprised if special chips with active long range signal transmission and/or GPS technology already exist. It would be pretty hard (and expensive) to mass produce, however. The grid system works just as good for the government's purposes. |
Suppose you pay cash. How exactly would your chip track your purchase? |
It wouldn't be impossible to mandate devices being installed in cash registers which, on every purchased, recorded the purchaser by scanning the location the customer was forced to stand in for an identity chip. It wouldn't be perfect (buying something at a garage sale for instance still wouldn't be detected), but it would still be pretty substantial. |
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visitorq
Joined: 11 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:07 am Post subject: |
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| MattAwesome wrote: |
If you ever played Metal Gear. That is what they did. Put nanochips in all the soldiers and guns to macro and micro manage their behavior and strategy.
Very powerful to its controller.
If you arent doing anything bad, why do you care if someone is watching what you have in your fridge? It's only a problem if the govt suddenly makes new laws to prohibit behavior. |
What are you, 9 years old? As long as you stay on your best behavior and never tell a lie, mommy and daddy won't spank you? How about, we're free adults who don't need or want the god damned government monitoring what we do? Grow up.
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| And to the obamacare comment. youre an idiot. |
Way to be awesome (like your name says). If you want to debate on it, I'll be happy to tear you a new one. Go ahead, try to make a point. |
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visitorq
Joined: 11 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:11 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| visitorq wrote: |
| nautilus wrote: |
| AsiaESLbound wrote: |
| American passports now have the chip. |
My EC passport has the chip too. Are these chips trackable at any time from satellite? or only when they get scanned at airports. |
Afaik, the ones currently being used do not emit signals themselves (as they would require an internal power source to do so), but can still be scanned from quite long distances (ie. from 50 meters away by hidden scanners on the road, or cop cars etc.). Basically the idea is to have a government (or corporate) grid set in place so your chip is scanned as you enter and exit any areas or buildings (which keeps a detailed record of your movement), and whenever you do something like make a purchase (the chip also stores your personal ID information).
But I wouldn't be surprised if special chips with active long range signal transmission and/or GPS technology already exist. It would be pretty hard (and expensive) to mass produce, however. The grid system works just as good for the government's purposes. |
Suppose you pay cash. How exactly would your chip track your purchase? |
Eventually they just phase out cash altogether. Most money is digital anyway. Lots of people already use debit cards to pay for pretty well everything. You don't need to have cash to have a functioning (police state) society. A free society on the other hand...
The obvious implication being that if you get out of line, they simply disable or freeze transactions on your chip (while tracking your every move on their police grid; nowhere to run or hide). Then it's game over. |
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Koveras
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| MattAwesome wrote: |
| If you arent doing anything bad, why do you care if someone is watching what you have in your fridge? It's only a problem if the govt suddenly makes new laws to prohibit behavior. |
It also allows for the convenient and indisputable manufacture of false evidence. If the data from your tracking chip says you were somewhere you really weren't, how on Earth can you convince a jury otherwise? No alibi is going to triumph over a government-endorsed claim that the data shows you were at the crime scene.
Technology is fallible, and technology is vulnerable to tampering. Stories like the trouble with voting machines we've had in certain parts of the country makes me totally uncomfortable with letting this kind of impact this could have on our criminal justice system. |
Also could be used for blackmail, 'soft' social control, and intrusive marketing, and probably a host of other things I'm too stupid to see. Anyway, the guy summed it up himself when he used the word 'micro-managing'. |
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ThingsComeAround
Joined: 07 Nov 2008
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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micromanaging on an epic scale
If people think Nazis were bad.. .imagine if some unknown person(s) could monitor where all the Jews, Blacks, and Brown-eyed people went then had the ability to prevent them from basic needs like food, heat, and water |
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