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Gerraldinho
Joined: 12 Jan 2010
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 Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 1:17 am Post subject: Unexpected unpaid "mandatory vacation": How to dea |
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My Hagwon is insisting that they do not have to pay me for some "mandatory vacation" during late July. I am a salaried employee and not paid by the day so how they expect to compute this is unknown to me, but my contract is clear on the amount I am paid each month. Their justification for this is that since I had previously used my contract's stipulated number of vacation days I am going over. Of course nobody mentioned this school temporary closing to me earlier and I am not keen to have my pay docked for something I never agreed to and that breaks contract.
Any advice on how to proceed with this? Do I have a chance? I suggested that I might accept half pay if they did not pester me with this any more, but I haven't received a comment on that and I don't know how "half" would be calculated anyway. Do I go to the labor board? Now or after the paycheck arrives. Do I need a profession to do that for me or can I just get a Korean friend? Sheesh, what a pain. Not the first time they've squeezed me for cash either, but I don't want to let it go this time.
Thanks! |
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tsteele
Joined: 30 Oct 2008
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 2:54 am Post subject: |
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| If you decide that this is a battle worth fighting, try to avoid a situation in which they later insist that *you* asked for the time off above your paid vacation. One way might be to get your school to put in writing that this is mandatory unpaid vacation time. Since they'll probably never go for that, you might want to voice-record your next conversation about it. |
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Gerraldinho
Joined: 12 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 3:53 am Post subject: |
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update: Vice-boss took the 50% offer. Said she would check with the money people to see what that actually means.
further question: What is the legal minimum of vacation days? I read in the stickies that korean labor law gaurantees 15 vacation days, but I never have seen confirmation of this from an official source. I know plenty of people like myself who only have 10 in their contract. Perhaps 15 includes national holidays or something? I didn't see it mentioned in the labor standards act.
edit: CNBC actually says "South Korea has 19 minimum vacation days, but enjoys 15 days in public holidays". Cable news websites aren't to be relied upon however |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:31 am Post subject: |
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| Gerraldinho wrote: |
update: Vice-boss took the 50% offer. Said she would check with the money people to see what that actually means.
further question: What is the legal minimum of vacation days? I read in the stickies that korean labor law gaurantees 15 vacation days, but I never have seen confirmation of this from an official source. I know plenty of people like myself who only have 10 in their contract. Perhaps 15 includes national holidays or something? I didn't see it mentioned in the labor standards act.
edit: CNBC actually says "South Korea has 19 minimum vacation days, but enjoys 15 days in public holidays". Cable news websites aren't to be relied upon however |
From the labor standards act (including amendments up to May 2009:
Article 60 (Annual Paid Leave)
(1) An employer shall grant 15 days' paid leave to a
worker who has registered not less than 80 percent of
attendance during one year.
(2) An employer shall grant one day's paid leave per
month to a worker whose consecutive service period is
shorter than one year, if the worker has offered work without
an absence throughout a month.
LABOR STANDARDS ACT
Act No. 5309, Mar. 13, 1997
Amended by Act No. 5473, Dec. 24, 1997
Act No. 5510, Feb. 20, 1998
Act No. 5885, Feb. 8, 1999
Act No. 6507, Aug. 14, 2001
Act No. 6974, Sep. 15, 2003
Act No. 7379, Jan. 27, 2005
Act No. 7465, Mar. 31, 2005
Act No. 7566 May.31, 2005
Act No. 8074, Dec. 21, 2006
Act No. 8072, Dec. 21, 2006
Act No. 8293, Jan. 26, 2007
Wholly Amended by Act No. 8372, Apr. 11, 2007
Act No. 8435, May. 17, 2007
Act No. 8561, Jul. 27, 2007
Act No. 8781, Dec. 21, 2007
Act No. 8960, Mar. 21, 2008
Act No. 9038. Mar. 28, 2008
Act No. 9699, May 21, 2009 |
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Gerraldinho
Joined: 12 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:00 am Post subject: |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
From the labor standards act (including amendments up to May 2009:
Article 60 (Annual Paid Leave)
(1) An employer shall grant 15 days' paid leave to a
worker who has registered not less than 80 percent of
attendance during one year.
(2) An employer shall grant one day's paid leave per
month to a worker whose consecutive service period is
shorter than one year, if the worker has offered work without
an absence throughout a month.
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So 1 only applies to those who have worked one year already. I was told by a long term married-in Korea-er that contracts supersede the law however. This sounds bizarre to me, so maybe that isn't quite right. |
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WadRUG'naDoo
Joined: 15 Jun 2010
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:10 am Post subject: |
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Your school was closed for 10 working days? Wow.
Some contracts state that your vacation is to be scheduled by the institute. Usually split between summer and winter vacations.
It is, however, really stupid to count days that your business is closed as vacation days. Totally unethical. |
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Juregen
Joined: 30 May 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:16 am Post subject: |
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Well,
I close 4 weeks per year, non-consecutively, and my teachers know one year ahead of time that that is their holiday.
This is a problem of being misinformed. |
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tsteele
Joined: 30 Oct 2008
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:50 am Post subject: |
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| Gerraldinho wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
From the labor standards act (including amendments up to May 2009:
Article 60 (Annual Paid Leave)
(1) An employer shall grant 15 days' paid leave to a
worker who has registered not less than 80 percent of
attendance during one year.
(2) An employer shall grant one day's paid leave per
month to a worker whose consecutive service period is
shorter than one year, if the worker has offered work without
an absence throughout a month.
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So 1 only applies to those who have worked one year already. I was told by a long term married-in Korea-er that contracts supersede the law however. This sounds bizarre to me, so maybe that isn't quite right. |
The law is the minimum level, and your contract may supersede it. For example, legally, your contract might give you 30 vacation days, whereas the law requires at least 15. On the other hand, if your contract gives you less than 15 days, then it is in violation of labor code, and that part of the contract is invalid. |
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ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 7:27 am Post subject: Re: Unexpected unpaid "mandatory vacation": How to |
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| Gerraldinho wrote: |
My Hagwon is insisting that they do not have to pay me for some "mandatory vacation" during late July. I am a salaried employee and not paid by the day so how they expect to compute this is unknown to me, but my contract is clear on the amount I am paid each month. Their justification for this is that since I had previously used my contract's stipulated number of vacation days I am going over. Of course nobody mentioned this school temporary closing to me earlier and I am not keen to have my pay docked for something I never agreed to and that breaks contract.
Any advice on how to proceed with this? Do I have a chance? I suggested that I might accept half pay if they did not pester me with this any more, but I haven't received a comment on that and I don't know how "half" would be calculated anyway. Do I go to the labor board? Now or after the paycheck arrives. Do I need a profession to do that for me or can I just get a Korean friend? Sheesh, what a pain. Not the first time they've squeezed me for cash either, but I don't want to let it go this time.
Thanks! |
For anyone to know what you should be getting, we would have to see what your contract says about vacation and we would have to know how many days you have taken already and how long you've been working at the school for starters. Other needed info would depend on just what your contract says. |
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wesharris
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 8:08 am Post subject: |
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Wait a minute, so my one week of vacation violates labor law?
Interesting. |
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ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 8:18 am Post subject: |
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| wesharris wrote: |
Wait a minute, so my one week of vacation violates labor law?
Interesting. |
Remember most Koreans work Saturdays (or some other 6 day week), so if you have Saturdays off and you are paid a salary, then you already have 52 paid holidays that may satisfy article 60. |
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SpiralStaircase
Joined: 14 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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| ontheway wrote: |
| wesharris wrote: |
Wait a minute, so my one week of vacation violates labor law?
Interesting. |
Remember most Koreans work Saturdays (or some other 6 day week), so if you have Saturdays off and you are paid a salary, then you already have 52 paid holidays that may satisfy article 60. |
A) Foreign teachers are not most Koreans
B) Korean teachers work the first, thrid, fifth Saturday of each month. These are half days. 52 paid holidays require a what... 216 week year. Nice.
Just saying is all. |
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ThingsComeAround
Joined: 07 Nov 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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I know where you are coming from. My hagwon pulled this slime tactic which was totally illegal, but everyone ate it and we had to deal.
First off:
Are you the only one this is happening to? There is strength in numbers. If you all go to the boss collectively and fight it as one voice, they (managers) will bend to you.
Second:
It is illegal. They didn't tell you about your vacation time. They just docked you and didn't give you the option of "going to work" or anything else. Tell them you have a "friend" that had the same thing happen to him, and he got a lawyer, they went to the hagwon and now the owner is cleaning toilets or something to that effect  Don't take the crap they shovel at you |
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notafbiagent
Joined: 31 Mar 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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| SpiralStaircase wrote: |
| ontheway wrote: |
| wesharris wrote: |
Wait a minute, so my one week of vacation violates labor law?
Interesting. |
Remember most Koreans work Saturdays (or some other 6 day week), so if you have Saturdays off and you are paid a salary, then you already have 52 paid holidays that may satisfy article 60. |
A) Foreign teachers are not most Koreans
B) Korean teachers work the first, thrid, fifth Saturday of each month. These are half days. 52 paid holidays require a what... 216 week year. Nice.
Just saying is all. |
A) The law doesn't differentiate between the nationalities of employees when stipulating minimum days in the labor law.
B) He isn't calculating 52 paid holidays based on your arbitrary application of what you saw your korean teachers do.
Just saying is all.
Well, maybe (B) needs clarification. Saturdays do not count as paid holidays even if you are a salaried employee. "Most" Koreans do not work saturdays, I do not know what makes you think that. It's a weekend, just like any other country and you only work if you choose to or if your employer asks you to and you agree. Saturdays will NOT satisfy the minimum days off requirements.
That being said, although the law requires X amount of holidays most people will work without claiming them simply because they prefer job security and looking good in front of their superiors as opposed to adhering to every aspect of the law. It's unfortunate but its how the system's works. To Koreans this is "good work ethics." |
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SpiralStaircase
Joined: 14 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 7:57 pm Post subject: |
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| notafbiagent wrote: |
| SpiralStaircase wrote: |
| ontheway wrote: |
| wesharris wrote: |
Wait a minute, so my one week of vacation violates labor law?
Interesting. |
Remember most Koreans work Saturdays (or some other 6 day week), so if you have Saturdays off and you are paid a salary, then you already have 52 paid holidays that may satisfy article 60. |
A) Foreign teachers are not most Koreans
B) Korean teachers work the first, thrid, fifth Saturday of each month. These are half days. 52 paid holidays require a what... 216 week year. Nice.
Just saying is all. |
A) The law doesn't differentiate between the nationalities of employees when stipulating minimum days in the labor law.
B) He isn't calculating 52 paid holidays based on your arbitrary application of what you saw your korean teachers do.
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A) No, but the Koreans interpreting the laws do.
B) No. He's calculating based on the arbitrary fact that the Earth completes its orbit around the Sun every 365 days.
As you missed the point, allow me to arbitrarily spell it out for you.
1. Korean Teachers teach the 1st, 3rd, and 5th Saturdays of the month.
2. They work half days.
3. Most foreign teachers, as stipulated in contract, are not paid to work Saturdays.
4. Thus, Saturdays are not to be considered holiday or vacation time.
5. If one was required to take a vacation day every Saturday, you would max at 12-14.
6. In order for a teacher to use 52 vacation days, in one year, on Saturdays alone, the Earth would have to orbit the Sun at the pace of an IV drip.
Savvy? |
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