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kangnamdragon

Joined: 17 Jan 2003 Location: Kangnam, Seoul, Korea
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Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2004 5:47 pm Post subject: Uri Party |
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What do you think of the Uri Party? Some Korean businessmen have expressed to me that they are akin to socialists. If they take power next month, the economy will get worse. One reason the economy is not improving now is that the wealthy Koreans are not spending money, not know the political future of the country. Many Koreans want wealth restribution, not realizing that this will create higher unemployment. |
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sadsac
Joined: 22 Dec 2003 Location: Gwangwang
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:45 am Post subject: |
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They are not popular with the business sector and I think they are going to get a shock come April 15th. Their antics on the floor of the National Assembly made a joke of the Korean parliment. That is going to come back and bite them on their backsides.  |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003 Location: I walk along the avenue
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 8:08 am Post subject: |
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Their antics on the floor of the National Assembly made a joke of the Korean parliment. That is going to come back and bite them on their backsides |
I think it depends on how the court rules. If they overturn the impeachment, Uri can turn around and say that it was the MDP and the GNP who made a joke of parliament, and dragged Korea's rep through the mud, by pushing through a dubious, politically-motivated ouster. |
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Saxiif

Joined: 15 May 2003 Location: Seongnam
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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Polls show Uri stomping the other two major parties badly, which is a good thing as they're the best of a bad lot. The Korean political scene needs some shaking up badly, its still got a lot of hold-overs from the dictatorship. |
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desultude

Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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Okay, everybody behaved badly in parliament those two days, but if you look at the rest of the world, most coup d'etats turn very bloody and people die, here they threw shoes- put it into perspective. |
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Mosley
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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True, desultude...in the immediate present. But as someone else suggested, democracy and the rule of law are very recent developments in S. Korea. Those developments, therefore, are very fragile. Coups, martial law, assassinations...are in VERY recent memory. That's why a lot of the concern about ROK's political state is valid, regardless of what side of the ideological fence one may sit. |
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Seoultrader

Joined: 18 Jun 2003 Location: Ali's Insurgent Inn, Fallujah
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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Do party members learn how to bend spoons as if they are made of butter?
(if you don't understand this rather lame joke, you're too damn young) |
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Mosley
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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Hell, I sure ain't "too damn young" & I don't get it.... |
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desultude

Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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Mosley
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True, desultude...in the immediate present. But as someone else suggested, democracy and the rule of law are very recent developments in S. Korea. Those developments, therefore, are very fragile. Coups, martial law, assassinations...are in VERY recent memory. That's why a lot of the concern about ROK's political state is valid, regardless of what side of the ideological fence one may sit. |
I absolutely agree. Its just that people here-in have been comparing the legislators to monkeys and such, but what would we have done in the face of the opposition overthrowing our government? Under the circumstances, their behavior was understandable. It wasn't a debate over some obscure policy, what was happening was huge, and the response was proportional. |
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peppermint

Joined: 13 May 2003 Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 11:50 pm Post subject: |
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Seoultrader wrote: |
Do party members learn how to bend spoons as if they are made of butter?
(if you don't understand this rather lame joke, you're too damn young) |
Aww, feeling old lately? That little pun doesn't improve with age either. ( Uri- Yuri. . Geller) I don't know why I know stuff like this, cause it was well before my time. |
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The Lemon

Joined: 11 Jan 2003
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Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 11:50 pm Post subject: |
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what would we have done in the face of the opposition overthrowing our government? |
Opposition-engineered no-confidence votes that bring down the government happen somewhat often in parliamentary democracies. There's a guy in Canada named Joe Clark who can fill you in on the details. In that case, as in most mature parlimentary systems (though the Korean system is neither mature nor parliamentary) there was very little shoe-throwing, lighting oneself on fire, or crying cross-legged on the floor in response. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003 Location: I walk along the avenue
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Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2004 5:54 am Post subject: |
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Quote: |
Quote:
what would we have done in the face of the opposition overthrowing our government?
Opposition-engineered no-confidence votes that bring down the government happen somewhat often in parliamentary democracies. There's a guy in Canada named Joe Clark who can fill you in on the details. |
Non-confidence votes have a legitimacy that impeachments, at least in their initial tages, lack. If the majority of members vote against the government in a non-confidence vote, the government falls, end of story. You can't really talk about a non-confidence vote being wrong, because losing the support of the majority in and of itself denies the government the right to rule.
In the case of impeachment, at least as apparently practiced in Korea, the court still has to rule that congress was right to impeach. If the court overturns the impeachment, then the President's supporters can legitimately say that the impeachment was wrong. |
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Juggertha

Joined: 27 May 2003 Location: Anyang, Korea
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Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2004 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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I'm sooo tempted to say the Uri is full of $#@!
Months ago they were members of one of hte main parties. For years these same politicians have taken money, abused the sytem and thier powers and said nothing.
NOW all of a sudden they are "covered in dirt but the others are covered in SH-IT?" Give me a break.
Opposition parties ALWAYS talk crap about what they would do if they got into office. Look at what Noh has done...
-Sacked most of the ministers.. then had to sack the ones he put in cuz of incopentancy and lack of xp.
-commited uncountable gaffa's internationally.
-failed to move forward on N Korean human rights issues.
-Broke the "presidential impartiality" law.
-plans to move the capital out of Seoul at a huge expense instead of focusing on making the Gov. more effective.
-publicly outted a prominant businessman and labeled him "a bad man" (imagine your president doing that to you on national TV).
-failed to rectify economic woes. (not his fault BUT his responsibility).
Basically IMO he's done jack as president. His party may sweep into power because of all this but I really feel they will come up with the same hair-brained ideas that Noh's ministers have in the past.
Be prepared for some REALLY dumb ideas coming out if htey get into power! |
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dutchman

Joined: 23 Jan 2003 Location: My backyard
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Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2004 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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Juggertha wrote: |
Basically IMO he's done jack as president. His party may sweep into power because of all this but I really feel they will come up with the same hair-brained ideas that Noh's ministers have in the past.
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Not true! He appointed Goh Kun as prime minister. At least he did one thing right. This guy is solid. I liked him as mayor of Seoul and I like him now. Hopefully, he stays in the post as long as possible. He's a much better face to Korean politics than Roh ever was. |
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Len8
Joined: 12 Feb 2003 Location: Kyungju
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Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2004 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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Was an article in the newspaper about other countries that had impeached their leaders. I seem to remember them as being Paraguay, Indonesia, The Philipines and a few others. Korea now ranks up there with the worst of them.
A lot of my students say Roh lacks charisma, and that he suffers from foot in the mouth disease. The latter is very apparent considering his string of political gaffes. His last public meeting was suppose to have been full rehtoric, and winging. Didn't show much heart. |
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