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Chet Wautlands
Joined: 11 Oct 2008
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 Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
Imagine if the United States Government had an official advisory on avoiding cracks to ensure the continued well-being of your mother's back. |
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Fishead soup
Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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Flatulence and Fan Death.
The purity of the oxegen we breath has a direct relationship with our feeling of well being. A negative air current or air current that is saturated with impurities will influence our ability to survive in a given habitat or location. An enviroment with a free air flow with the immediate enviroment will allow for the elimination of toxic gases mixed in with the air we breath.
The average adult male produces at least 3 gallons of compressed flatulence in a twenty four hour period add alcohol and meat to that mix and the methane injected into the air increases. If the male is obese then the lack of free moving air becomes more deadly. |
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RMNC
Joined: 21 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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| It's cute more than anything to me. |
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Gatsby
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:52 pm Post subject: |
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Korean culture is built on lies. Virtually everything about Korea is a myth or lie. Koreans are trained from childhood to believe these lies. They are enforced as they grow into adults through the pressures of conformity. If Koreans do not conform they are ridiculed and ostracized.
One of the biggest myths concerns ondol heating, specifically, using hot air from a fire. This is considered one of the great Korean inventions. It is part of Korean national identity, and Korean individuals derive their sense of self from their national identity -- as individuals they feel worthless.
The problem is hot air ondol heating has killed countless thousands of Koreans over the years, and left thousands or perhaps millions with brain damage and partial paralysis. You can see these semi-paralyzed people slowly hobbling around many rural Korean towns with a blank stare. Millions of Korean children over the years have probably suffered brain damage and impaired IQ from ondol heating.
Yet you do not see any warnings from the Korean government or Korean doctors about the dangers of hot air ondol heating, or of the carbon monoxide it produces. Instead, you see warnings about fan death and carbon dioxide. Apparently, they are using fan death to cover up the carnage from ondol heating. If someone dies sleeping in a room with the doors and windows closed, it must be fan death. Have you noticed many students are terrified to be in a classroom with the windows and doors closed, even if their is central heat and air conditioning? Most Koreans have never even heard of carbon monoxide; carbon monoxide is colorless and odorless, so perhaps to Koreans this means it doesn't exist. Every Korean knows of the potentially fatal dangers of using an electric fan in a closed room. You can see a fan.
Koreans, the people running your country don't give a flying puck about your welfare. They would rather have you and your children suffer brain damage than to admit that they and their Korean ancestors were wrong.
The danger is not just from the old form of ondol heating, once the seals on the pipes deteriorate; it is a very current danger in the form of kerosene heaters used in closed rooms. But if someone is asphyxiated by a kerosene heater, the coroner will probably rule it fan death. If you explain the dangers of carbon monoxide to Koreans, you will probably find they prefer to suffer brain damage or death than to deviate from Korean conformity or to question the culture of Korean lies. You may also find they will not want you around next year.
Oh, and Koreans did not invent the current form of heating they call ondol, using circulating hot water. This was invented by an American. His name is Frank Lloyd Wright. He first installed it in a Japanese hotel in 1915. In America it is called radiant heat.
| Quote: |
| Wright in fact invented the modern radiant floor heating, using hot water running through pipes instead of hot air through flues. From the true hybrid of Japanese and Western architecture came a true hybrid of the heating system. |
http://www.ideal-heating.com/article.php?a=31
I will say one thing positive about the Korean government. Some nameless bureaucrat finally had the good sense to take down the official warning about fan death in English:
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Beware of Summer Hazards!
The Korea Consumer Protection Board (KCPB) issued a consumer safety alert after analyzing injury data related to summer accidents collected for the past three years through its Consumer Injury Surveillance System (CISS).
The top five recurring accidents are ▲ asphyxiation from electric fans and air conditioners ▲ children�s asphyxiation inside cars ▲ explosions inside cars ▲ air conditioner explosions and ▲ sanitary accidents at home.
■ Doors should be left open when sleeping with the electric fan or air conditioner turned on
If bodies are exposed to electric fans or air conditioners for too long, it causes bodies to lose water and hypothermia. If directly in contact with a fan, this could lead to death from increase of carbon dioxide saturation concentration and decrease of oxygen concentration. The risks are higher for the elderly and patients with respiratory problems. [/size]
From 2003~2005, a total of 20 cases were reported through the CISS involving asphyxiations caused by leaving electric fans and air conditioners on while sleeping. To prevent asphyxiation, timers should be set, wind direction should be rotated and doors should be left open. |
http://english.cpb.or.kr/user/bbs/code02_detail.php?av_jbno=2006071800002
Hmmm, I wonder what "sanitary accidents" are?
Last edited by Gatsby on Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:08 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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JBomb
Joined: 16 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| didn't the Romans use underground heating in their baths? |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:51 am Post subject: |
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Gatsby, you talk a whole lot of tripe. the poster above is right, that style of heating goes back far more than 100 years.
As to your impressions of Koreans, I gather you don't have conversations with Koreans adults on a regular basis. Either that, or your circle is filled with idiots. |
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interestedinhanguk
Joined: 23 Aug 2010
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:33 am Post subject: |
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| Gatsby wrote: |
| The problem is hot air ondol heating has killed countless thousands of Koreans over the years, and left thousands or perhaps millions with brain damage and partial paralysis. You can see these semi-paralyzed people slowly hobbling around many rural Korean towns with a blank stare. |
More likely from malnutrition during childhood. You know this was a very poor country way back when. |
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morrisonhotel
Joined: 18 Jul 2009
Location: Gyeonggi-do
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:37 am Post subject: |
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| JBomb wrote: |
| didn't the Romans use underground heating in their baths? |
I believe the earliest evidence of underfloor heating is in Pakistan. |
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Gatsby
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:00 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Gatsby, you talk a whole lot of tripe. the poster above is right, that style of heating goes back far more than 100 years.
As to your impressions of Koreans, I gather you don't have conversations with Koreans adults on a regular basis. Either that, or your circle is filled with idiots. |
Captain Corea, is that the best you can do?
I made some specific accusations about Korea, and what do you do? You insult me. To your credit, you did attempt one vague rebuttal:
"... that style of heating ..."
I don't think that would get you any points in a debating competition. WHAT "style of heating" are you referring to?
I said that Koreans did not invent the current form of floor heating using circulating hot water. What Koreans invented was ondol heating using hot air exhaust from a fire circulated under the floor, and this is, indeed, hundreds of years old.
In the West, we invented chimneys to vent this exhaust away because it can make you drowsy or kill you in your sleep -- what we now know is due to a build up of carbon monoxide in the blood.
I have looked at many traditional style Korean houses built in the 20th century or earlier, and have not seen any chimneys (or lightning rods) on them. I have seen vents sticking out the side of the house, underneath the roof eaves near windows, so the fire exhaust can carry the carbon monoxide right back into the house.
So, I repeat: An American invented radiant heating through using circulating hot water under the floor. Koreans then plagiarized this invention, claiming it was "ondol" heating invented by Koreans. Koreans are liars; their culture is built on lies. What do you say to that, Captain Corea? If I am wrong about this, show me evidence that Koreans invented floor heating using circulating hot water first.
Instead, you attack my character and belittle me. Why? Could it be because you cannot disprove my charges?
Koreans are terrified of being laughed at, of being shamed or ostracized. Guess what? If I believe I am right, I really do not care in the least. That's the way Westerners are: We believe in standing up for what we believe in, even if others laugh at us, or even if others kill us for our beliefs. This is one of the most sacred of all values in the West. I am not Korean. Your tactics do not work on me. Sorry.
However, if I am wrong, and there is always that possibility, I am open to any evidence, and will change my mind if so because as a Westerner, I hold sacred the value of Truth. If you don't know what that is, I can't help you.
I, as a Westerner, believe in respecting the opinions of others, even if they challenge my own. This is expressed in the well-known saying:
"I may disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
Implied here is that the third person is making a statement of belief or fact, rather than a mean-spirited attack on another person's character. I am certainly not going to die defending a knave's libels.
These are not Korean values. They are the opposite of Korean values. Here is how Koreans respond when someone says something they disagree with: They belittle the person. This is so common, the only thing unpredictable is how long it will take them. Generally, you need a stopwatch with split second timing.
We have a term for this type of attack in the West: the Ad Hominem.
| Quote: |
Translated from Latin to English, "Ad Hominem" means "against the man" or "against the person."
An Ad Hominem is a general category of fallacies in which a claim or argument is rejected on the basis of some irrelevant fact about the author of or the person presenting the claim or argument. Typically, this fallacy involves two steps. First, an attack against the character of person making the claim, her circumstances, or her actions is made (or the character, circumstances, or actions of the person reporting the claim). Second, this attack is taken to be evidence against the claim or argument the person in question is making (or presenting). This type of "argument" has the following form:
1. Person A makes claim X.
2. Person B makes an attack on person A.
3. Therefore A's claim is false.
The reason why an Ad Hominem (of any kind) is a fallacy is that the character, circumstances, or actions of a person do not (in most cases) have a bearing on the truth or falsity of the claim being made (or the quality of the argument being made). |
http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/ad-hominem.html
In the West we call this a logical fallacy. What do you call this in Korea? Sound logic?
So what did you do? You attacked my character.
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I gather you don't have conversations with Koreans adults on a regular basis. Either that, or your circle is filled with idiots. |
Slightly more creative than calling me an idiot, you suggest the Koreans around me are idiots. I wouldn't go that far. I am not saying all Koreans are idiots, or even that the principal, assistant principal and my co-teachers are idiots because they have never heard of the dangers of carbon monoxide. Ignorant, yes; idiots, no.
But when not a single Korean doctor I have talked to believes carbon monoxide is dangerous, then I become very concerned. Clearly, something is fundamentally wrong with the education and beliefs of Koreans. The closest I came to any acknowledgment of the dangers of carbon monoxide by a Korean was from a doctor in a hospital, with his windows open in the winter, who said this was not due to any concern about carbon monoxide; he said carbon monoxide is only produced by buses, so it is nothing to worry about. He claimed to have received his medical degree in the U.S., but when I asked him where, it took him about a minute to think up the name of the school, a rather generic one. I think this lead doctor in a Korean hospital was a liar.
Captain Corea, if you want to disprove the factual statements in my post, you can begin with this very simple challenge:
-- Show my where online there is any warning by the Korean government about the danger of carbon monoxide.
-- Next, show me where the Korean government warns of the danger of carbon monoxide from hot air ondol heating, and the importance of proper maintenance to keep the piping system sealed.
-- Next, show me where the Korean government warns of the danger of carbon monoxide poisoning from using kerosene heaters in a closed room.
-- And for extra credit, show me where the Korean government has posted statistics for hospitalization and death from carbon monoxide. (I have only been able to find old statistics, and they were shocking, probably some of the highest rates in the world.)
Such statistics are routinely available in the West. In many places in the West, the use of carbon monoxide detectors in homes is required by law. I could show you, but a google search will do just as well.
If the Korean government and Korean education leaders and teachers truly cared about the welfare of the Korean people, especially Korean children, they would educated people about the dangers of carbon monoxide through public service announcements, newspaper articles, and most of all, education in the schools.
Show me where Koreans have done this?
I don't think they care. They only care about maintaining Korean mythology and their own power, even if other Koreans die in the process.
If I am wrong, prove it. Don't waste your breath making fun of me. I really couldn't care less about what someone who couldn't think his way out of a paper bag thinks about me.
Don't you see, what you think about me, or for that matter, what I think about myself, is totally irrelevant.
But I doubt this will stop you and other posters on this site from making the same boring ad hominem attacks on everyone who criticizes Korea. It happens over and over and over again, the same tactics, as regular as clockwork. Sad, very sad. Is that the best you can do? |
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excaza
Joined: 27 Aug 2010
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Gatsby wrote: |
I made some specific accusations about Korea, |
Yes you did. But you offered no links or proof. Nothing but your unsupported opinion. Since you made these accusations or claims the burden of proof falls on YOU. Give us some links to your proof and then we can have a discussion. If you are simply going to repeat your unsubstantiated opinions then we can simply dismiss it as such. |
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Gatsby
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:44 am Post subject: |
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I write:
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Captain Corea, if you want to disprove the factual statements in my post, you can begin with this very simple challenge:
-- Show my where online there is any warning by the Korean government about the danger of carbon monoxide.
-- Next, show me where the Korean government warns of the danger of carbon monoxide from hot air ondol heating, and the importance of proper maintenance to keep the piping system sealed.
-- Next, show me where the Korean government warns of the danger of carbon monoxide poisoning from using kerosene heaters in a closed room.
-- And for extra credit, show me where the Korean government has posted statistics for hospitalization and death from carbon monoxide. (I have only been able to find old statistics, and they were shocking, probably some of the highest rates in the world.) |
Not a peep out of Captain Corea. Instead, UrbanMyth responds (tag team?):
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| But you offered no links or proof. Nothing but your unsupported opinion. Since you made these accusations or claims the burden of proof falls on YOU. |
Would anyone care to point out to UrbanMyth the elementary (and this is an understatement) logical fallacy in his response? It hurts my brain just contemplating how anyone could be so muddle headed. |
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calicoe
Joined: 23 Dec 2008
Location: South Korea
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 1:23 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Gatsby wrote: |
I made some specific accusations about Korea, |
Yes you did. But you offered no links or proof. Nothing but your unsupported opinion. Since you made these accusations or claims the burden of proof falls on YOU. Give us some links to your proof and then we can have a discussion. If you are simply going to repeat your unsubstantiated opinions then we can simply dismiss it as such. |
Do you know Google?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ondol
That's a start, which took about 1 minute. |
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le-paul
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Location: dans la chambre
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 3:07 am Post subject: |
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| interestedinhanguk wrote: |
| Gatsby wrote: |
| The problem is hot air ondol heating has killed countless thousands of Koreans over the years, and left thousands or perhaps millions with brain damage and partial paralysis. You can see these semi-paralyzed people slowly hobbling around many rural Korean towns with a blank stare. |
More likely from malnutrition during childhood. You know this was a very poor country way back when. |
and years of back breaking labour bent over in rice fields... |
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Gatsby
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 10:05 am Post subject: |
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le-paul wrote:
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| and years of back breaking labour bent over in rice fields... |
Just out of curiosity, on what do you base this diagnosis?
Is it based on a knowledge of medicine?
Or could it just be a wild guess, le paul?
Do you or interestedinhanguk know what the symptoms and long term consequences of carbon monoxide poisoning are? Did you bother to look it up online?
At least calicoe googled ondol. Did you read the entry?
I'm not talking about arthritis. I'm not talking about osteoporosis.
I'm talking about brain damage. Severe, permanent brain damage. Brain damage that makes it difficult for a person to talk or walk. Go to a rural town and you will see these people. And they're not just old people.
Carbon monoxide poisoning is still destroying the lives of Koreans. And the Korean government does not seem to be warning its citizens about this danger. It appears to be covering it up. This myth about fan death appears to be part of the cover up story. It is just one of the many lies by the leadership of Korea. I say these Korean leaders are accessories to murder. They should be ashamed of themselves, if not sent to prison, and the Korean people should be outraged. Are they? No, because Koreans are trained from childhood to accept as truth the lies their government and schools feed them. Most Koreans are so confused they don't even understand the concept of "truth." They think that lies are truth, and myth is truth, and that the truth is actually a conspiracy of lies made up by evil foreigners. And I'm talking about South Korea.
It seems UrbanMyth will only be satisfied when I show him an official Korean government webpage admitting that fan death is a cover story to hide the truth about carbon monoxide poisoning. Ummm, let's see now, then it wouldn't be a cover up, anymore, would it?
I say, show me the Korean government is not hiding the dangers of carbon monoxide, that it is warning the public. And UrbanMyth demands I show him webpages proving that it is hiding the truth. OK, now what's wrong here? ANYONE know the name of this logical fallacy?
I know the U.S. government, and most state governments have public awareness campaigns to educate people to the dangers of carbon monoxide; some also have laws regarding carbon monoxide detectors. I suspect most or all Western countries, especially those in colder climates, have similar information programs.
Where's Korea's?
Show me! |
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