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superNET
Joined: 08 Dec 2010
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 Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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Thought I would bring the following over for those who think pieces of paper make them more qualified than those who have a regular non-educational degree:
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| Teachers who have been versed is western teaching methods wouldn't last in Korea unless they totally overhauled their training and methods as, from experience, western teaching methods that we consider conventional do not work with a Korean audience hence the mantra 'adapt to the culture because the culture won't adapt to you'. |
Taken from st...4ever's post in What makes a Good Teacher thread. |
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winterfall
Joined: 21 May 2009
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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Here's a loaded question. What's the difference between: an amateur photographer, a professional photographer, and a hobbyist?
If they all charged the same price and there's no samples to compare quality. Which one would you pick to take care of your daughter's wedding? And why? |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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| superNET wrote: |
Thought I would bring the following over for those who think pieces of paper make them more qualified than those who have a regular non-educational degree:
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| Teachers who have been versed is western teaching methods wouldn't last in Korea unless they totally overhauled their training and methods as, from experience, western teaching methods that we consider conventional do not work with a Korean audience hence the mantra 'adapt to the culture because the culture won't adapt to you'. |
Taken from st...4ever's post in What makes a Good Teacher thread. |
Although quoting another poster is perhaps not the strongest argument. What we need is a poll of certified teachers who've taught both here and back home to verify this statement. |
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superNET
Joined: 08 Dec 2010
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| What we need is a poll of certified teachers who've taught both here and back home to verify this statement. |
And I suppose you want their vote apsotillized and endorsed from the embassy from their home countries as well?
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| Although quoting another poster is perhaps not the strongest argument |
But it does show that I am not blowing smoke nor the only one who thinks this way.
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| If they all charged the same price and there's no samples to compare quality. Which one would you pick to take care of your daughter's wedding? And why? |
Photography is not the same as teaching for the latter is a gift and one does not neccessarily have to learn how to teach like one has to learn how to take good photographs. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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| superNET wrote: |
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| What we need is a poll of certified teachers who've taught both here and back home to verify this statement. |
And I suppose you want their vote apsotillized and endorsed from the embassy from their home countries as well?
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Nope. But since the statement was made about teachers who were certified back home that's why I think said teachers should be the ones voting as they are the ones who have the experience. I for one did not have to overhaul my methods completely. Much of what works there will work here. Some won't. |
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winterfall
Joined: 21 May 2009
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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Photography is not the same as teaching for the latter is a gift and one does not neccessarily have to learn how to teach like one has to learn how to take good photographs. |
Well both have techniques involved that can only be learned through experience and, or if someone specifically taught you (A training course). Like synchronizing the contrast between shadows, selecting film, processing photos and how to consistently get the best results out of nothing. Eg: not having the latest technical gizmo vs a high tech classroom or one without even most basic supplies. |
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superNET
Joined: 08 Dec 2010
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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| But since the statement was made about teachers who were certified back home that's why I think said teachers should be the ones voting as they are the ones who have the experience. I for one did not have to overhaul my methods completely. Much of what works there will work here. Some won't. |
Well I think we are getting far afield from the topic but I will say in response to your last sentence, I found that the majority of stuff that works in the west does not work here.
Maybe to close off this discussion, and you two can have your final say as well, I think that teachig transcends location and whether one teaches in a hagwon or posco or the air force academy or a public school, and so on, they all belong to the profession of teaching and they should act like it.
Too many people listen to the wrong advice and degrade their status and do not ensure that they are prepared to teach students. Nor do they try to become good teachers.
Just like doctors, there are good ones who take the time to ensure they know what they are doing and know their field and their are bad ones who use the profession for their own gain only. |
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le-paul
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Location: dans la chambre
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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OP, imo, Id say - No.
You are not percieved as being a professional. Nor are your korean co-teachers (who are no better or worse than you on the heirarchy ladder).
If you were to ask a korean co-teacher what was their hogwans expectations, Im pretty sure they would answer somewhere in there that they are expected to respect the fact that they are working for a business and to keep the students and parents happy, probably at the risk of compromising their teaching/work/personal ethics, against what they believe is correct teaching.
In my western understanding/belief, I would say that is unprofessional (if i did that in a hospital for example, Id get imprisoned)
Id also say that if you were a professional, your opinions would count against what teachers, parents, students, the system etc. think is correct teaching methodology, diadactics etc. with regard to what weve studied on the subject.
They dont. Partially because you probably never did/do anything to develop professionally as a hogwan teacher but mostly because no-one cares what we think.
That makes me think Im not seen as a professional.
That doesnt stop me from pretending though - but Im under no illusion. |
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ESL Milk "Everyday
Joined: 12 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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Hagwons are about money and run by non-teachers, so there's no way to tell... but I think the overall impression of it is that hagwon waeguks = non-professionals, but this depends on your boss and how he sells you to the customers.
If by 'professional', you mean 'respected', here's my take:
In Korean public schools, people will respect you as a professional if you have the appropriate degree, and experience. Unless you like to argue and cause problems, then they might respect you and might not, but they will definitely hate you.
If you have just the degrees, they will respect you as someone who is educated but inexperienced, so it will not be the same thing, but there will be respect involved, because they will assume that you will at least try to do a good job.
If you have experience but no degrees, they may respect or they may not, but they will be wary and you will have to do a lot more to prove yourself... because experience in ESL is kind of easy to come by.
Finally, if you have no experience and no degrees, they will be super nice to you and respect you at first, and you'll be given concessions based on your physical appearance/youth, but their patience will run out if you don't prove yourself to be a dedicated worker who is willing to admit that you don't know what you're doing and take their advice without getting all defensive or upset... even if you're drop dead gorgeous, you won't get anywhere by being rudely confrontational.
The only people who get no respect are those who don't take things at all seriously, dress like slobs (eg: baseball caps, MP3 players in plain sight, unkempt hair and face), don't take care of themselves, don't plan, put absolutely nothing in and expect huge returns... or people who won't back down or admit that they're wrong-- even if they're not completely wrong.
Ultimately, I think most people in Korea know what our position entails and it's not at the top of the social ladder... we're more like PE teachers or Administration-- above the janitors and the cafeteria people, but not at all on the level of math or science teachers... we're basically unskilled workers... and sometimes a few steps above.
We're not really English 'teachers'-- the Koreans are. Our job is sort of like an enrichment teacher... but for everyone, not just advanced students... we don't have to adhere to any curriculums or meet any goals, we're just there to supplement and provide 'real life' contact with English in a less formal fashion. It doesn't necessarily mean going all the way to 'edutaintment', either... but it does mean keeping things more about stimulation, participation and encouragement than the real teachers are required to.
Last edited by ESL Milk "Everyday on Tue Dec 14, 2010 8:56 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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