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OculisOrbis

Joined: 17 Jul 2006

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 5:54 pm Post subject:

superNET wrote:

Quote:

And I see you are recycling the same tired points that I have already addressed multiple times

You actually haven't proven your point, all you have done is assert your interpretation of a few words which do not include 'housing allowance' as part of their definition.

Which part of 'regardless of how it is termed' is too difficult for you to understand?

superNET wrote:

I do not want to keep going over this as I know you are wrong, if you read your contract {which so many ignore when it is against them} you will see that it is NOT part of your salary.

Law supersedes contact. Legal definitions of wage and income have already been provided.

superNET wrote:

Does taxing the allowance make it income? Of course NOT, for governments tax anything--gas tax, office tax, property tax, sales tax--none of those are considered income. Thus your argument fails on ALL accounts and demonstrates you are trying to get money you have not earned nor deserved..
You were lucky ONCE. Housing allowance has never been considered income.

Gas tax? Sales tax? Property tax? Of course those are not considered as income, those are expenditures - the opposite of income. The tax is on the commodity with each having it's own legislation to determine the tax rate for the product or asset. Housing allowance is taxed because it IS income.

Last edited by OculisOrbis on Thu Dec 16, 2010 6:04 pm; edited 1 time in total

winterfall

Joined: 21 May 2009

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 5:57 pm Post subject:

superNET wrote:

You were lucky ONCE. Housing allowance has never been considered income.

Check your IRS forms. It includes housing or a living allowance as part of your net income

TheUrbanMyth

Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 6:25 pm Post subject:

[quote="superNET"]

Quote:

A if you read your contract {which so many ignore when it is against them} you will see that it is NOT part of your salary.

.

Which contract? SMOE, EPIK, or GEPIK? Or any or all of the hundreds of different hakwon contracts out there?

I fail to see a single clause in my contract which states that a housing allowance is not part of my salary.

TheUrbanMyth

Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 6:38 pm Post subject:

superNET wrote:

Quote:

No difference at all. If you don't work, you don't get the housing allowance payment. Therefore, it's a payment for your work - regardless of how it is termed.

No, you are stretching it and putting your own meanings to the clause. A good lawyer would defeat your argument no problem.

if I am sick, I am not working but I still get housing, so it is not for my work that I have a place to stay. Plus, those people who get housing provided for them do not get to collect on this clause and prove that housing is not the same as 'for work'.

Except that a lawyer (actually a law firm) has already stated the opposite to what you are claiming.

http://www.k-labor.com/tiki-index.php?page=Korean+Labor+Law+for+Teachers

5. If a housing allowance is stated in the contract and is stated in Korean WON then that amount is considered part of your employment contract and will increase the amount of severance and the overtime rate."

This is a Korean LABOR LAW firm saying this. Why should we believe you and not them? It's considered part of your employment contract so it is payment for your work.

And read number 2 as well as it contradicts what you were saying about bonuses in a previous thread.

Last edited by TheUrbanMyth on Thu Dec 16, 2010 6:47 pm; edited 1 time in total

morrisonhotel

Joined: 18 Jul 2009
Location: Gyeonggi-do

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 6:42 pm Post subject:

Ladies and gentlemen, did you not learn from arguing with Seoulio that he never gives up despite frequently being wrong?

superNET

Joined: 08 Dec 2010

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:01 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Except that a lawyer (actually a law firm) has already stated the opposite to what you are claiming

NOt completely, but then you read what you want to read don't you:

Quote:

If a housing allowance is stated in the contract and is stated in Korean WON per month

Read the quote carefully, if your contract simply states you will receive a housing allowance then it is not added to the severence but if it is stated as quoted then it is.

So OO and I are both correct. I do not care which contract, read yours.

As for #2, I never said opposite of the average of 3 months, I said I didn't care if they did or not and that those who did were nickelling and diming their employer. I also said you needed to learn to be conttent with what you receive instead of always looking for more.

OculisOrbis

Joined: 17 Jul 2006

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:06 pm Post subject:

superNET wrote:

Quote:

Except that a lawyer (actually a law firm) has already stated the opposite to what you are claiming

NOt completely, but then you read what you want to read don't you:

Quote:

If a housing allowance is stated in the contract and is stated in Korean WON per month

I appreciate the nod for being correct (because I am), but unfortunately you are still not.....a housing allowance without a stated amount in the contract would essentially be provided housing - not an allowance.

jrwhite82

Joined: 22 May 2010

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:29 pm Post subject:

Thanks TUM for putting this thread to rest. I stand corrected OO. 100 internet points to you! 400,000W for me!!!

superNET

Joined: 08 Dec 2010

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:35 pm Post subject:

Quote:

I fail to see a single clause in my contract which states that a housing allowance is not part of my salary.

And you also fail to see where it states it is part of your salary. Come on, anyone can play that game.

Quote:

but unfortunately you are still not.....a housing allowance without a stated amount in the contract would essentially be provided housing - not an allowance

Sorry but I am correct and the law firm supports me on that as well. If your contract doesn't give a won amount per month then you do not get to add it to your severance. And by that clause, even the words 'up to...' do not count. You are not entitled to add housing allowance in as income for the severance.

But then it is only the greedy westerner who makes this an issue and I do not care and am grateful for the one month severance without all the add ons. The employer is not screwing me, taking advantage of me or anything like that because I do not care about money.

I care about my students and if they see me fighting for 5,000- 100,000 won then everything I have taught them goes out the window. I would rather they see me do what is right than be seen as another greedy westerner who only cares about money.

It is no wonder that Foreigners have problems in this country, because you put money above your students.

Last edited by superNET on Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:39 pm; edited 1 time in total

TheUrbanMyth

Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:36 pm Post subject:

superNET wrote:

Quote:

Except that a lawyer (actually a law firm) has already stated the opposite to what you are claiming

NOt completely, but then you read what you want to read don't you:

Quote:

If a housing allowance is stated in the contract and is stated in Korean WON per month

Read the quote carefully, if your contract simply states you will receive a housing allowance then it is not added to the severence but if it is stated as quoted then it is.

.

Except you didn't say that before. You simply stated that a housing allowance was not income, was not added to the severance and was not compensation for work. And you maintained that stance throughout several posts in this thread until I posted the link from the legal firm whereupon you modified your claim.

TheUrbanMyth

Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:38 pm Post subject:

[quote="superNET"]

Quote:

I
You are not entitled to add housing allowance in as income for the severance.

Yes you are if the contract states a certain amount in won. (which most contracts do).

superNET

Joined: 08 Dec 2010

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:43 pm Post subject:

Quote:

(which most contracts do).

Prove it, with links to the majority of contracts up in the contract thread.

Quote:

Except you didn't say that before

Right I didn't and I acknowledged that OO was correct upon reading that link BUT I was still correct which you did not acknowledge.

TheUrbanMyth

Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:44 pm Post subject:

superNET wrote:

Quote:

I fail to see a single clause in my contract which states that a housing allowance is not part of my salary.

And you also fail to see where it states it is part of your salary. Come on, anyone can play that game.

[.

I see it quite clearly in the link I provided.

Labor law trumps contract law...always has and always will

TheUrbanMyth

Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:48 pm Post subject:

superNET wrote:

Quote:

(which most contracts do).

Prove it, with links to the majority of contracts up in the contract thread.

Quote:

Except you didn't say that before

Right I didn't and I acknowledged that OO was correct upon reading that link BUT I was still correct which you did not acknowledge.

Simply read the contract sticky thread since you know where it is. I've personally reviewed a majority of them so I'm well aware of what the majority of them look like. Some similarities are: They tend to be poorly written, have no mention of pension, violate labor law multiple times and offer either provided housing or a housing allowance with a clearly stated maximum.

You were not correct, you were making a blanket statement about housing allowances. If you'd said SOME housing allowances cannot be added to the severance then I would have agreed with you.

Last edited by TheUrbanMyth on Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:54 pm; edited 1 time in total

TheUrbanMyth

Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:50 pm Post subject:

[quote="superNET"]

Quote:

I
But then it is only the greedy westerner who makes this an issue and I do not care and am grateful for the one month severance without all the add ons. The employer is not screwing me, taking advantage of me or anything like that because I do not care about money.

.

So you don't care about money but are grateful for the one month severance?

Well I care about money so if you don't...sign over your paychecks to me.

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