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Mosley
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Mon Dec 06, 2010 2:45 pm Post subject: |
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You said it, brudder.
Welfare is only one other example of a publicly-funded system that is abused to the nth degree. The truly disabled and the WORKING poor have my sympathy. Others...nada.
During the sub-prime debacle, all the pundits asked of the banks and government "What were they thinking?!" Fine. But hardly anyone asked that Wal-Mart guy and his waitress wife the same Q. |
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geldedgoat
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Mon Dec 06, 2010 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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| mises wrote: |
So you have organization "x" that sell product "q". The culture holds "q" to such a high regard that it is nearly impossible to live a middle class life without obtaining it. Then this other organization "g" says it will guarantee the loans of "X's" customers - to almost any amount and without the possibility of default.
What do we think is going to happen? X will raise prices to the highest upper limit that can be tolerated. |
Sure. Now what in this equation should be corrected?
Our culture holding "q" in high regard? I think attempting to intelligently persuade anyone that education is of even less worth than most North Americans already view it will fall fairly short.
The government guaranteeing loans for most anyone wanting to better themselves by buying "q" from "X"? Again, I fail to see you getting anywhere by claiming that a more educated populace is not a worthwhile investment.
"X" raising its prices in abuse of the system to increase its profit margins by obscene amounts without any government correction? Yeah, I think we have a winner here. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2010 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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This is also a symptom of college being available to every Tom, Dick, and Harry. The fact is, 20% of people in college have no business even being there. Hence, they help devalue College degrees.
And to all those people with some degree in Greek Literature or whatever they decided to major in while stoned, the life lesson here is that you should have paid more attention in "boring" math class, studied harder, and hung out with the nerds in Science Olympiad.
When it comes to money and finances, never listen to teachers unless they run a business on the side. Listen to business people. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 8:01 am Post subject: |
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This is somewhat related: The Disposable Academic
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One thing many PhD students have in common is dissatisfaction. Some describe their work as �slave labour�. Seven-day weeks, ten-hour days, low pay and uncertain prospects are widespread. You know you are a graduate student, goes one quip, when your office is better decorated than your home and you have a favourite flavour of instant noodle. �It isn�t graduate school itself that is discouraging,� says one student, who confesses to rather enjoying the hunt for free pizza. �What�s discouraging is realising the end point has been yanked out of reach.� |
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Sergio Stefanuto
Joined: 14 May 2009
Location: UK
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| Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 11:30 am Post subject: |
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Schools of humanities should be shut down forthwith, as a matter of national urgency, and all the left wing loafers therein made to lick public toilets clean for a living.
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In the midst of unparalleled social mobility in the West, they cry �caste.� In a society of munificent goods and services, they cry either �poverty� or �consumerism.� In a society of ever richer, more varied, more productive, more self-defined, and more satisfying lives, they cry �alienation.� In a society that has liberated women, racial minorities, religious minorities, and gays and lesbians to an extent that no one could have dreamed possible just fifty years ago, they cry �oppression.� In a society of boundless private charity, they cry �avarice.� In a society in which hundreds of millions have been free riders upon the risk, knowledge, and capital of others, they decry the �exploitation� of the free riders. In a society that broke, on behalf of merit, the seemingly eternal chains of station by birth, they cry �injustice.�
.....
The humanities in general have become schools of �oppression studies� in the very societies that have extended more freedom, choice, and bounty than humanity has ever known. Everyone who cares about this should take one afternoon to wander the aisles of required reading at a local college bookstore and to examine college syllabi. It is far, far worse than you surely think, even if you are a pessimist.
http://www4.ncsu.edu/~nvdemanc/socialism.html |
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Koveras
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 11:58 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| This is also a symptom of college being available to every Tom, Dick, and Harry. The fact is, 20% of people in college have no business even being there. Hence, they help devalue College degrees. |
More like 75%. Yes, over attendance devalues degrees in an economic sense, because it creates an oversupply, but more importantly it lowers the quality of the education. If all it did was produce an oversupply of well educated people there could be no problem with it; the problem is that egalitarianism in education creates an *undersupply* of well educated people.
| Steelrails wrote: |
| And to all those people with some degree in Greek Literature or whatever they decided to major in while stoned, the life lesson here is that you should have paid more attention in "boring" math class, studied harder, and hung out with the nerds in Science Olympiad. |
The Classics and Literature curricula should be returned to their old standards. They're more demanding and more important than science. |
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Koveras
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 12:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Sergio Stefanuto wrote: |
Schools of humanities should be shut down forthwith, as a matter of national urgency, and all the left wing loafers therein made to lick public toilets clean for a living.
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In the midst of unparalleled social mobility in the West, they cry �caste.� In a society of munificent goods and services, they cry either �poverty� or �consumerism.� In a society of ever richer, more varied, more productive, more self-defined, and more satisfying lives, they cry �alienation.� In a society that has liberated women, racial minorities, religious minorities, and gays and lesbians to an extent that no one could have dreamed possible just fifty years ago, they cry �oppression.� In a society of boundless private charity, they cry �avarice.� In a society in which hundreds of millions have been free riders upon the risk, knowledge, and capital of others, they decry the �exploitation� of the free riders. In a society that broke, on behalf of merit, the seemingly eternal chains of station by birth, they cry �injustice.�
.....
The humanities in general have become schools of �oppression studies� in the very societies that have extended more freedom, choice, and bounty than humanity has ever known. Everyone who cares about this should take one afternoon to wander the aisles of required reading at a local college bookstore and to examine college syllabi. It is far, far worse than you surely think, even if you are a pessimist.
http://www4.ncsu.edu/~nvdemanc/socialism.html |
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This is just how progress works. What was progressive ten years ago is reactionary today. Who opened the doors for these people? Who set them up on a pedestal? Probably the kind of person who wrote that article. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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The humanities in general have become schools of �oppression studies� in the very societies that have extended more freedom, choice, and bounty than humanity has ever known. Everyone who cares about this should take one afternoon to wander the aisles of required reading at a local college bookstore and to examine college syllabi. It is far, far worse than you surely think, even if you are a pessimist. |
Maybe if you look at the syllabus for something like "Women's Studies" this would be true. If by contrast you look at the kind of literature you'd read through in a number of other humanities fields, you'd find this to be a much less reasonable conclusion. Humanities hasn't become "oppression studies." Rather, "oppression studies," has sprouted off of the side of the humanities. The main body of the humanities still has a wide and varied range of content. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| Quote: |
The humanities in general have become schools of �oppression studies� in the very societies that have extended more freedom, choice, and bounty than humanity has ever known. Everyone who cares about this should take one afternoon to wander the aisles of required reading at a local college bookstore and to examine college syllabi. It is far, far worse than you surely think, even if you are a pessimist. |
Maybe if you look at the syllabus for something like "Women's Studies" this would be true. If by contrast you look at the kind of literature you'd read through in a number of other humanities fields, you'd find this to be a much less reasonable conclusion. Humanities hasn't become "oppression studies." Rather, "oppression studies," has sprouted off of the side of the humanities. The main body of the humanities still has a wide and varied range of content. |
Sergio's criticism is way too sweeping. There are a number of models for humanities fields. But the phenomenon he describes exists, and is corrupting the reputation of a humanities education. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| Quote: |
The humanities in general have become schools of �oppression studies� in the very societies that have extended more freedom, choice, and bounty than humanity has ever known. Everyone who cares about this should take one afternoon to wander the aisles of required reading at a local college bookstore and to examine college syllabi. It is far, far worse than you surely think, even if you are a pessimist. |
Maybe if you look at the syllabus for something like "Women's Studies" this would be true. If by contrast you look at the kind of literature you'd read through in a number of other humanities fields, you'd find this to be a much less reasonable conclusion. Humanities hasn't become "oppression studies." Rather, "oppression studies," has sprouted off of the side of the humanities. The main body of the humanities still has a wide and varied range of content. |
Sergio's criticism is way too sweeping. There are a number of models for humanities fields. But the phenomenon he describes exists, and is corrupting the reputation of a humanities education. |
That's an excellent way to put it: a reputation problem. I'm not really certain how to amend that problem, but it's certainly not for schools to stop offering Philosophy, Ancient Greek Literature, and so forth as options. |
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catman
Joined: 18 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 8:52 pm Post subject: |
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At York University you can be a major in "Socialist Revolutions". 
I've heard many Unis now offer "Queer Studies" as a major. |
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Illysook
Joined: 30 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Fri Dec 24, 2010 4:10 am Post subject: |
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| You probably can't even teach ESL in Korea with a degree in "Queer Studies." But if by chance you did get a job, you would certainly get some strange questions when they looked at your diploma. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Fri Dec 24, 2010 5:41 am Post subject: |
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| catman wrote: |
| At York University you can be a major in "Socialist Revolutions". |
I can't find that program on the York website. Do you have a link? I believe you, but want to read more. |
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catman
Joined: 18 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Fri Dec 24, 2010 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| mises wrote: |
| catman wrote: |
| At York University you can be a major in "Socialist Revolutions". |
I can't find that program on the York website. Do you have a link? I believe you, but want to read more. |
It is anecdotal from about 10 years ago. Student protesting rising tuition fees in an interview. May have been UofT but I'm pretty sure it was York. |
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