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Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
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 Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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| earthquakez wrote: |
| creeper1 wrote: |
| 2. Applicants who want to renew and renew their contracts in PS have shown a woeful lack of ambition, vision and work ethic. It's hard to feel any sympathy for them. |
Regardless of those Koreans who like to belittle foreigners who work as English teachers in the school system, those foreigners who have good to great work histories teaching English in other countries should let the disparaging 'wonomin' roll off their backs.
Unlike the insular Koreans slagging them off, they got off their duffs to go to other countries and the fact that they have been employed in these countries says something significant. A business or psychology degree is hardly a reason for Koreans or you or anybody to look down on the person who holds the degree.
And the foreign holder of that degree is likely to have worked far harder for it than many of the Koreans who see enrolling in university as an end in itself. Such are the basic educational 'values' of Korean society, all about heirarchy and image rather than ability and substance.
Do tell us about these applicants who apparently are 'woeful' and are denied renewal. I've know of a woman denied renewal because she fell foul of a nasty Korean fellow at the same school who wanted to see her out of school and then used his own perceived loss of face to hound her out of her job. I've known foreign teachers loved by most of their students who never played hangman or other games but taught English using interesting methods that Korean teachers struggle to even think of.
Please go on with your condemnation of native English teachers - we're all waiting to hear if you can come up with something new because so far we've heard what sounds like a resentful Korean English teacher talking, you know, the kind who teaches their students that "Every Jack has his Jill" is important English.  |
This. |
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kiwipenny
Joined: 22 Mar 2010
Location: South Korea
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 10:22 pm Post subject: true at my school for 2011 |
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I'm about to finish 2yrs at my current school (GEPIK PS) and I am leaving because I wish to change location and so on. However, even if I wanted to stay I don't they could afford me. I introduced two teachers for interview and the recruiter found one ....the school is intending to hire one of the teachers I introduced because he is the cheapest one to hire and seems pretty friendly and his demo lesson was good( he's actually the only one of 3 interviewed that has no PS experience). Budget is tight and they are hiring people who really want it and don't mind working for a low salary.
** To be honest one teacher that applied had years of experience and did a wicked demo lesson... however, he is toooo expensive for the school to even consider. bummer. Feel sorry for the guy because he seems really keen to teach ... had heaps of interviews... but many schools keep giving him the same response.no money sorry. |
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jrwhite82
Joined: 22 May 2010
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Things must be really tight and our job priority is really low. Who do you think gives the school more bang for their buck? Us or two security guards that sleep in a shack in the parking lot? If you even think the security guards for a second, you better step it up! |
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prettypetal
Joined: 14 Jul 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 1:58 am Post subject: |
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My contract finishes at the end of January and a few weeks ago I signed a new contract with my school, got my new visa, and booked my flight home for vacation. Two days before my flight was to leave (Jan 1st), my co-teacher comes to me and tells me they can't afford to keep me on because of the government budget cuts. I asked to see the memo and about 50 other schools in the region were on the notice my school was sent. My co-teacher called the supervisor and said there may or may not be funding, they won't know until after my contract finishes. If they do have enough funding, my next contract will be with my school and not through GEPIK.
Needless to say this is REAL and everyone should start figuring out a backup plan now. I had to cancel my trip home because I would come back to Korea and have to leave again in 2 days, and also because it wouldn't be a paid trip. I have a month to sell/ship stuff and look for a new job....but then again maybe not?? |
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No_hite_pls
Joined: 05 Mar 2007
Location: Don't hate me because I'm right
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| Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:31 am Post subject: |
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| creeper1 wrote: |
| 2. Applicants who want to renew and renew their contracts in PS have shown a woeful lack of ambition, vision and work ethic. It's hard to feel any sympathy for them. |
What is wrong with you? Please get some help. |
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blonde researcher
Joined: 16 Oct 2006
Location: Globalizing in Korea for the time being
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| Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Prettypetal; What city area are you in Gyeonggi ? Was the notice you saw from the main provincial GEPIK office? |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
creeper1 wrote:
2. Applicants who want to renew and renew their contracts in PS have shown a woeful lack of ambition, vision and work ethic. It's hard to feel any sympathy for them.
What is wrong with you? Please get some help. |
Creeper of course expresses this in a rather tactless way but to back him up slightly I would venture that to suggest that one or two of his points may be valid. PS positions are entry level and if you are serious about teaching kids, playing second fiddle to a Korean teacher would not be most people's idea of a long term good prospect. Showing a bit of ambition would entail getting a job in a country where you could teach kids' classes on your own or upgrading your qualifications to enable you to work in your own country or at an international school. Similarly if your long term aim is just to stay in Korea, there are plenty of better jobs around which may involve a bit of networking, skills upgrading etc...Of course if people like their jobs there's nothing wrong with sticking at lower level positions but then they shouldn't be surprised if their employers want to exchange them for lower paid workers. Personally I'd be appalled at the idea of working for an educational organisation that places no value on experience or qualifications and would want to get out of the system ASAP. I have sympathy for those getting canned but I've been canned once before and have left jobs slightly reluctantly a few times in the past and have always gone on to better positions. |
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prettypetal
Joined: 14 Jul 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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blonde researcher: I live in Anseong and the document came directly from the Anseong Office of Education. It's all in Korean, but my friend read it and told me the gist of it; as of December 2010, the following (50) schools will not be receiving government funding.
Some further information I've heard is that some schools don't depend on government funding to pay for their foreign teacher and receive moneys elsewhere. So that's why a few other teachers in this area have been told by their schools NOT to worry and that they will be able to finish off their contracts, and a couple are even able to renew their contracts starting in Jan or March. After that, the likelihood of renewing does not look good. |
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wiganer
Joined: 13 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Quote: |
creeper1 wrote:
2. Applicants who want to renew and renew their contracts in PS have shown a woeful lack of ambition, vision and work ethic. It's hard to feel any sympathy for them.
What is wrong with you? Please get some help. |
Creeper of course expresses this in a rather tactless way but to back him up slightly I would venture that to suggest that one or two of his points may be valid. PS positions are entry level and if you are serious about teaching kids, playing second fiddle to a Korean teacher would not be most people's idea of a long term good prospect. Showing a bit of ambition would entail getting a job in a country where you could teach kids' classes on your own or upgrading your qualifications to enable you to work in your own country or at an international school. Similarly if your long term aim is just to stay in Korea, there are plenty of better jobs around which may involve a bit of networking, skills upgrading etc...Of course if people like their jobs there's nothing wrong with sticking at lower level positions but then they shouldn't be surprised if their employers want to exchange them for lower paid workers. Personally I'd be appalled at the idea of working for an educational organisation that places no value on experience or qualifications and would want to get out of the system ASAP. I have sympathy for those getting canned but I've been canned once before and have left jobs slightly reluctantly a few times in the past and have always gone on to better positions. |
I agree with this too, I never used to agree with this but I have now come around to the thought process that if you have spent ten years in Korea and have not made one bit of effort in upgrading your qualifications (especially if you don't have a BA TESOL/Linguistics/English base to begin with) then it shows a woeful attitude and lack of ambition which shouldn't be rewarded. The work at GEPIK is entry level. There are many MA TESOL courses in English that are available very cheaply in Korea. There is no real excuse to be fighting with 22 year old kids for these GEPIK jobs if you have anything over 5 years experience here. |
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sojusucks
Joined: 31 May 2008
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| Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Junior wrote: |
| earthquakez wrote: |
| creeper1 wrote: |
| 2. Applicants who want to renew and renew their contracts in PS have shown a woeful lack of ambition, vision and work ethic. It's hard to feel any sympathy for them. |
Regardless of those Koreans who like to belittle foreigners who work as English teachers in the school system, those foreigners who have good to great work histories teaching English in other countries should let the disparaging 'wonomin' roll off their backs.
Unlike the insular Koreans slagging them off, they got off their duffs to go to other countries and the fact that they have been employed in these countries says something significant. A business or psychology degree is hardly a reason for Koreans or you or anybody to look down on the person who holds the degree.
And the foreign holder of that degree is likely to have worked far harder for it than many of the Koreans who see enrolling in university as an end in itself. Such are the basic educational 'values' of Korean society, all about heirarchy and image rather than ability and substance.
Do tell us about these applicants who apparently are 'woeful' and are denied renewal. I've know of a woman denied renewal because she fell foul of a nasty Korean fellow at the same school who wanted to see her out of school and then used his own perceived loss of face to hound her out of her job. I've known foreign teachers loved by most of their students who never played hangman or other games but taught English using interesting methods that Korean teachers struggle to even think of.
Please go on with your condemnation of native English teachers - we're all waiting to hear if you can come up with something new because so far we've heard what sounds like a resentful Korean English teacher talking, you know, the kind who teaches their students that "Every Jack has his Jill" is important English. |
This. |
c
This article is so true. Receiving rewards here is all about creating friends, possibly even using bribes. Being successful here has little to do with talent. Perhaps that is why MOST Koreans aren't taken seriously outside of Korea. I have even seen some foreign English teacher training programs specifically targeting Korean teachers. Too bad most Korean teachers will never attend some of these. |
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sojusucks
Joined: 31 May 2008
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| Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Pretty petal wrote: |
My contract finishes at the end of January and a few weeks ago I signed a new contract with my school, got my new visa, and booked my flight home for vacation. Two days before my flight was to leave (Jan 1st), my co-teacher comes to me and tells me they can't afford to keep me on because of the government budget cuts. I asked to see the memo and about 50 other schools in the region were on the notice my school was sent. My co-teacher called the supervisor and said there may or may not be funding, they won't know until after my contract finishes. If they do have enough funding, my next contract will be with my school and not through GEPIK.
Needless to say this is REAL and everyone should start figuring out a backup plan now. I had to cancel my trip home because I would come back to Korea and have to leave again in 2 days, and also because it wouldn't be a paid trip. I have a month to sell/ship stuff and look for a new job....but then again maybe not? |
Interesting that GEPIK isn't keep their contract. Someone probably wanted to get GEPIK out of the contract. Who knows what happened exactly but bribes were probably involved to get GEPIK to bow out (which they are happy to do but only with a bribe). Yes I have stories about the latter claim which is why I made it. |
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creeper1
Joined: 30 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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| earthquakez wrote: |
| creeper1 wrote: |
Two quick points
1. You are not considered teachers. When the Koreans speak about you they use the term "wonomin" which translates as native speaker. They only use the term "songsimnim" to describe you when you are in ear shot. "Songsimnim" is an honourable title which backpackers with nothing more than business or psychology degrees haven't earned.
2. Applicants who want to renew and renew their contracts in PS have shown a woeful lack of ambition, vision and work ethic. It's hard to feel any sympathy for them. |
Regardless of those Koreans who like to belittle foreigners who work as English teachers in the school system, those foreigners who have good to great work histories teaching English in other countries should let the disparaging 'wonomin' roll off their backs.
And the foreign holder of that degree is likely to have worked far harder for it than many of the Koreans who see enrolling in university as an end in itself. Such are the basic educational 'values' of Korean society, all about heirarchy and image rather than ability and substance.
Please go on with your condemnation of native English teachers - we're all waiting to hear if you can come up with something new because so far we've heard what sounds like a resentful Korean English teacher talking, you know, the kind who teaches their students that "Every Jack has his Jill" is important English. |
I actually don't want to start condemning anyone but neither should I start praising those who deserve none.
I have been in Korea a while and I know what the score is. Native speakers or "wonamins" aren't somehow sinister or evil characters and a few are actually good people.
A more balanced view has me come to the conclusion that an apt description of them is bums. Nothing more, nothing less. They are bums. Most of them are proud of being bums. They brag about long vacation and short work days as they down beer and tell tall stories. They have no idea where they are going in life and no ambition.
If that's what they want then fine. There is certainly nothing wrong with having an easy lifestyle and enjoying yourself. However you should recognize yourself as a bum. And you what you shouldn't do is criticize hard working Korean teachers busting their asses. That's what I object to.
I came to this conclusion after many discussions with them, seeing idiotic shoutouts and photographs on facebook. In fact I have many sources.
So you can call them backbackers or you can call them bums. I would call the younger ones that stay for a year then get a career types backpackers. I would call the more long term guy a bum.
That's my conclusion and I think 90 percent fit into one of these categories - backpacker or plain bum. |
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silkhighway
Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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| creeper1 wrote: |
A more balanced view has me come to the conclusion that an apt description of them is bums. Nothing more, nothing less. They are bums. Most of them are proud of being bums. They brag about long vacation and short work days as they down beer and tell tall stories. They have no idea where they are going in life and no ambition.
...
So you can call them backbackers or you can call them bums. I would call the younger ones that stay for a year then get a career types backpackers. I would call the more long term guy a bum.
That's my conclusion and I think 90 percent fit into one of these categories - backpacker or plain bum. |
That's not very fair, a lot of teachers, both new and old try their best and succeed despite the personal and professional challenges. Since you're setting the bar so high, what exactly do you do? I hope you're genetic programming a cure for cancer or something. |
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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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| creeper1 wrote: |
I actually don't want to start condemning anyone but neither should I start praising those who deserve none.
I have been in Korea a while and I know what the score is. Native speakers or "wonamins" aren't somehow sinister or evil characters and a few are actually good people.
A more balanced view has me come to the conclusion that an apt description of them is bums. Nothing more, nothing less. They are bums. Most of them are proud of being bums. They brag about long vacation and short work days as they down beer and tell tall stories. They have no idea where they are going in life and no ambition.
If that's what they want then fine. There is certainly nothing wrong with having an easy lifestyle and enjoying yourself. However you should recognize yourself as a bum. And you what you shouldn't do is criticize hard working Korean teachers busting their asses. That's what I object to.
I came to this conclusion after many discussions with them, seeing idiotic shoutouts and photographs on facebook. In fact I have many sources.
So you can call them backbackers or you can call them bums. I would call the younger ones that stay for a year then get a career types backpackers. I would call the more long term guy a bum.
That's my conclusion and I think 90 percent fit into one of these categories - backpacker or plain bum. |
I think you're in a timewarp from the pre IMF days before Koreans blamed the world because the chaebols and other elites needed to do a drastic turnaround and the country had to swallow some bitter medicine because of mostly Korean mismanagement. Kim Dae Jung showed leadership and economic commonsense.
Anyway, this 'bums' complex you've acquired seems to have been inflated from some of the characters you met then, or you've just heard about it if you weren't around before the IMF crisis. Everywhere I go in Korea I see foreigners at bars too, although they don't tend to litter the streets, train and subway cars, and eating places post-drinking.
The great majority of them are unwinding with a drink, not talking about how great it is to work 8 hours plus a day for conditions that often depend on the mood of the Koreans they work with.
Experienced or not, many of them work at jobs where they had to provide the curriculum and materials because for some reason many Korean hagwons and indeed public schools don't think to have those things.
Many foreign teachers have to confront Korean disorganisation, hopelessly mixed classes, students taught to not take anything that is not Korean seriously or respectfully.
This is not an easy job, it takes a lot of organisation on the part of the foreign teacher, and the pay does not equate with the responsibilities where foreign teachers are by themselves in the classroom for whatever reason - at public schools it's because of texting, sleeping Korean teachers who think they're entitled to skive off that particular part of the schedule.
It's the 'foreigner brings it all' mentality which I honestly have never encountered in language teaching in the UK or Japan or Taiwan. Where the native language teacher is creating and developing the curriculum, in most instances outside Korea they get paid more for it.
Now back to those longer/long term 'bums'. Mostly the longer/long term foreigners I've met have family responsibilities because they're married to Koreans. They work hard and I've never heard of them boasting how 'easy' it all is.
Your claims belong right down there with the Anti English people's claims of foreigners living like high rollers off 2 million won a month, raping Koreans of all ages including the females they are dating, and deserving Korean resentment for somehow coming to the country that wanted them to teach English, working and paying taxes.
Last edited by earthquakez on Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:40 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:21 pm Post subject: |
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Deleted.
Last edited by earthquakez on Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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