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This is so wrong...
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TeacherinDeajeon



Joined: 09 Sep 2010

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I understand the sentiment of a few posters, but I do not deal with this by warning them of "what would happen
to them if they did that in America". The explanation of likely violent repercussions as a consequence of their actions
is not appropriate. And I would hope that no one resorts to such methods. This is entirely the wrong message to convey.

I also appreciate the some of the sympathies with the situation. However, I'm an adult, I can handle it. The issue has never been how offended I was as a black person. This has also never been about acknowledging the perceived sensitivities of a black/African and/or understanding the particular cultural and historical context of blacks in America.

I am sensitive in many regards, as I hope we all are, but certainly not in regards to what has been implied, by a few, in this thread.

I hope that it is the case that any offense taken by someone who read the post was not out of concern for me or any sensitivities that a black/African may have, justified or not.

My particular background is and should be irrelevant. I hope that one would be offended for other reasons.
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Steelrails



Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TeacherinDeajeon wrote:
Steelrails wrote:
Anytime any kind of racial laughter happens it gets quickly squelched by me and my co-teacher. I have to give him credit, he is on top of that.

I try to be subtle with changing attitudes by showing Africans/Blacks in professional roles in my PPT pics.

I have to say, face painting for middle schoolers????? Having them dance around?????

You treat students like kids and they'll act like kids.

And as you said you just had a presentation of cultures and whatnot...when you showed Africa, what sort of pictures did you show? I certainly hope it wasn't pictures out of a National Geographic.

I can't help but say that this might reflect on the way you presented Africa during your lesson and what your students learned and retained from it. If Africa was properly presented and the students engaged, then that sort of behavior shouldn't have happened. If you presented it well, then you would have been right to stop the class and give the students a tongue lashing for failure to properly learn their previous cultural lesson.

As it stands, I see this as the logical conclusion of a cultural lesson on Africa, featuring a bunch of photos of tribal people with spears, followed up with a face painting activity.


Unfortunately, my co-teacher doesn't possess that sort of presence/ability.
But this is another topic altogether. Good on you and your co-teacher for
your actions.

I should clarify. The lesson up to that point had been a PPT of various maps of the world and several handouts.
There were no depictions of any persons representing their respective countries- just maps. My two
co-teachers did not want my input on any aspect of the camp. Everything was planned by them.


Then what happened with your co-teachers is absolutely awful.

The students, well they are still young so they don't know any better. The co-teachers? Disgraceful.

Sorry for casting aspersions on your teaching. I got a different mental picture from your post and through out a wild theory (a bad habit of mine). I agree, that was a terrible scene and should not have happened.

Sadly, too many times when people mention Africa or use it in PPTs, its either a tribal village or abject poverty/warfare.
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koreandefence



Joined: 05 Oct 2007

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:32 pm    Post subject: Re: This is so wrong... Reply with quote

TeacherinDeajeon wrote:
So, it is the second day of winter camp for the 2nd grade middle school boys. The planned activity was face painting. One student was to paint the face of the other. All is well until I hear these two students repeating �aprika�.aprika� and then laughter. We had just completed a presentation about countries and cities. The only place to receive laughter (any animated response at all), out of a 50 min lecture was �Africa�.

So, you can imagine what came next. The aforementioned student gets out of his seat and begins to give his impression/dance of an African person. Foot stomping, cradling of the stomach and tear inducing laughter from the class ensued while the student is dancing/shouting �aprika, aprika�- and I am not exaggerating. I was speechless.

I just could not believe that such a mocking impersonation would be construed to be so unashamedly hilarious. The warm approval of my fellow co-teachers-evident by the fact that they were in stitches is what was most disturbing. I have never seen them laugh so hysterically. It was truly a cringe worthy scene that went on far too long.



Wow, you really think this was bad? Kids a re kids. YOU have the problem as you see a racist connection, they probably just sawa funny dance.

But we are lucky that white people have never been racist. Rodney King anyone?
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TeacherinDeajeon



Joined: 09 Sep 2010

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The students, well they are still young so they don't know any better. The co-teachers? Disgraceful.

Sorry for casting aspersions on your teaching.

Sadly, too many times when people mention Africa or use it in PPTs, its either a tribal village or abject poverty/warfare.


No worries. I do not get ruffled by the ignorance of children. But I am disgusted by the indifference of those that know better. On the street in everyday life, its a given, but in a classroom with teachers interacting with children, it should not be ignored.

No offence taken. I would also be curious as to how the lesson was planned and executed. It was a fair inquiry. The teachers bear the responsibility.

Sadly, this co-teacher has had surprise lessons on "Poor people", which included playing the old version of "we are the world" 4-5x over, complete with her own PPT of pictures depicting pictures of babies with distended bellies and every other picture of abject poverty/warfare. No context was given at all. My tenure here has had innumerable head shaking moments like this.
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wiganer



Joined: 13 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steelrails wrote:
If you could start a class of the realities of Asian students in a lot of inner city areas. It would be quite an interesting lesson, when the Korean students point out 'We're not Chinese' and you respond 'To a bully, that doesn't matter' then it might strike home.

Then the lesson that is learned is that if you go to America, people there are racist. Do you think this is a good way to confront racism?


The word some dropped out of the sentence somewhere Steelrails. Rolling Eyes Yeah, why not discuss it?


Quote:
I'd prefer showing something like the pages from my yearbook showing students of different backgrounds in BPA or Science Olympiad and showing the African students holding trophies from competitions or the students all celebrating their competition wins together.


Very good Steelrails, I think these kids know that black people can achieve great things. It still doesn't stop the racism and amongst young boys full of testosterone - they are not going to care about some kid winning a physics award no more than I would have done at their age.

Quote:
I didn't say that, Asian kids are getting the snot beaten out of them daily in South Philly. That won't be the only place.

Well if Korean kids are doing mock tribal dances, and American kids are using racially targeted violence, I think one country's students are in a lot worse shape.


I would say in one country, something is being done about it and in another country something is not being done about it. There will be a day when this really annoying 'pure blood' crap will stop being taught in school in Korea but it won't be anytime soon eh? Rolling Eyes

Quote:
Again, I fail to see how bringing up this story does anything to reduce racism.


It is not going to reduce racism, but it will make them think. Maybe for one second. In their own country, their pure blood and their history and their racial superiority is something to be proud of and used to humiliate and belittle others who they think they are superior to. In other places they are just one of many from a big continent.

Quote:
Who said anything about deserving it?

Well, considering that you were quite upset about Korean student racism via the mock tribal dances, and considering you were rather unperturbed about unwarranted acts of physical violence towards Asian students, I have to wonder.


Well, don't 'wonder' Steelrails, good job you are not practising law because you would never win a case, keep your bigoted views and thoughts out of it. You don't know me so shush.

[quote]
Quote:
Oh, sorry Steelrails - is your inferiority complex about physicality flaring up again.

So violence is the answer then?


It has it's place. Has to be said.

Quote:
It's not a physical inferiority complex. It's a "Aren't you supposed to be an academic teacher?" complex.


OK academic teacher. Tell me about your academic teaching qualifications?

Quote:
Bit of self projection on behalf of your fellow Koreans there Steelrails. How many times did I see that 'lovestick' being used?

There's a difference between holding up a chair or getting the ruler on the hands and blasting someone in the mouth. A ruler to the hands doesn't send someone to the hospital or the dentist.


Hahahaha - the apologist in you never stops does it? A ruler on the hands? I have seen soles of the feet being beaten, heads being smacked, kids being punched.

Quote:
Sorry Steelrails, some people do learn from a punch in a mouth, sorry to be 'old skool' here but it is true, and you know what - that would be the reality of the situation if any Korean kid was stupid enough to do a tribal dance to make fun of an African American in a racially mixed school. You know that, I know that so save your sermon because if you didn't inform the students of this realit yif they were sent to an American school then you are doing that kid no favours.

Yes people learn from a punch to the mouth, but what do they learn?


You have heard of the old saying 'live by the sword, die by the sword' yes, there are some people you can reason with and some you cannot. Neither way works with everybody and I never said it did but it does work with some people. Don't blame me, I didn't invent humanity, there are many flaws to many people.

Quote:
And again, stop lumping African and African-American together. Africans are not African-Americans and vice versa.


This is why I don't have any respect for you as an intelligent person. You do this kind of projection crap all the time and it doesn't work with anyone with half a brain. I have stated time and time again you imbecile that it is actually the students and the teachers who have a hard time distinguishing between the two. Take another look at my posts.

Quote:
Also if we are big on ending racism, can we end the stereotype of the angry, violent black youth which your counterpoints seem to be full of?


You seem to want to run away from the real world. What the hell is the matter with you Steelrails. You really sound like a big baby who hasn't a clue about whats going on, meaning you will fit in over there in Korea. And watch what you are saying. You always accuse people of using absolutes in their argument when it is in fact something you are guilty of most of the time.

Quote:
Thankfully both the black student body, and the teachers at my school confronted such things with 'teachable moments' and books, not blasts to the mouth. In fact, one of the notable incidents at our school (which made national headlines) was where one of our students (African-American female) shielded a man who was being beaten by a mob because he had a Confederate flag tattoo and happened to be near the Klan rally that was being held downtown.

That is how my school and our teachers and student body learned about racism and the lessons we tried to impart.

Sure our school had some racial problems. Black on Arab/Arab on Black violence was high. Arab vs. Chaldean violence also happened and students did segregate themselves somewhat. But I do appreciate the effort our school put into dealing racism by not just saying "its wrong", but by creating opportunities for students of all backgrounds to work together.

I 100% disagree with your punch to the mouth teaching method, especially for middle schoolers.


No-one is here to convert you Steelrails. It is one side that can be considered and that works sometimes. Have another look at the different views on the 'corporal punishment' thread.

Quote:
A nice story there buddy, what would have happened if you had a 'super Korean' turn up at your school and do tribal dances and taking the piss out of African Americans, sharing his views on racial superiority and pure bloodlines? It would have been a week before someone would have stomped him into the floor. You know it brother.

We would have had him go head to head with one of the African Students in AP Calc and AP Physics and had them get stomped there. Through their exam scores. Then we would have had them go head to head with one of the African-American students and get stomped academically again. And also show them how the other Korean students there are collaborating with their African and/or African-American peers in our academic associations or how they are the club president. If you want to be in BPA and Science Olympiad you are going to have to learn how to act and be respectful or else the other Korean students will ostracize you and continue to hang out with their non-Korean academic colleagues. Take them to our church and see our Pastor and congregation working together the pastor of the majority Caucasian and majority African-American churches that shared our building. Have them meet the family at our church that was biracial Korean - African-American and part of our church family.

That's how you put that kind of person in their place. Not with brawn, but brains and patience and education.


Grow up Steelrails! The school bully is really going to be shamed into losing a physics contest in public! Laughing You were sober this time when you typed this crap out. Do you think any of those methods would stop him? Go and work in a proper school for God's sakes and see how ineffective your pollyanna methods would be?

Quote:
And again, Africans and African-Americans are not the same.


You really are one imbecile. Rolling Eyes

[quote]
Quote:
You think I am this angry person when there are a lot of people who know me personally on this board who know otherwise. Do I think you are this pompous, uptight know-it-all - you probably are actually!

All three of your posts here have been laced with violence and conflict.


And all your posts are lacced with pompousity, smugness a lack of intellect and logic - I'll admit the violence and conflict if you admit the pompousity, smugness and the lack of intellect and logic - deal?

Quote:
Don't you have any positive lessons or happy moments you can share with your students regarding multiculturalism? Or is the best we can come up with "If you do this, you'll get beat down."


I'll save it for another post.

Quote:
Like I said, if I wanted to confront racism I'd just pull open my HS yearbook to our BPA/Science Olympiad team sharing success across cultures. Give them African role models. Teach about confronting racism through non-violent means. Have examples of Africans and people of color as scientists and engineers and business executives and world leaders.

Not punches to the mouth and stories of gang violence.


Why are sportsmen so important as role models Steelrails? Especially to young men? Because most young men don't admire academics? They don't and you know it and I know it. Ask any class of 14 year old boys who their favourite MMA/K-1 fighter is and they will give you an anwser, ask them who their favourite nobel prize winner in the sciences are and they won't give you an anwser. You spout off at me from your ivory tower when it seems you have no idea what makes a teengae boy tick. You have written some complete and utter ridiculous crap on here. None of it would work outside this fantasy world you have created where the rules are different.

Is a more robust approach a cure all and applicable to every case? No.

Does it work sometimes? Yes.

Does a kind word and showing others lead by example work sometimes? Yes.

Go and read the book/watch the film 'To Sir With Love' E.R Braithwaite will teach you something about the subject you seem to know little about.
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wiganer



Joined: 13 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TeacherinDeajeon wrote:
I understand the sentiment of a few posters, but I do not deal with this by warning them of "what would happen
to them if they did that in America". The explanation of likely violent repercussions as a consequence of their actions
is not appropriate. And I would hope that no one resorts to such methods. This is entirely the wrong message to convey.

I also appreciate the some of the sympathies with the situation. However, I'm an adult, I can handle it. The issue has never been how offended I was as a black person. This has also never been about acknowledging the perceived sensitivities of a black/African and/or understanding the particular cultural and historical context of blacks in America.

I am sensitive in many regards, as I hope we all are, but certainly not in regards to what has been implied, by a few, in this thread.

I hope that it is the case that any offense taken by someone who read the post was not out of concern for me or any sensitivities that a black/African may have, justified or not.

My particular background is and should be irrelevant. I hope that one would be offended for other reasons.


Something happened similar to me, in one of the textbooks for middle school, there is a picture of a tribesman in full regalia and the class were laughing and making of fun chanting 'Africa' and I stopped them and told that it was a picture of my dad and they better desist from making fun of my dad. They did desist thinking that the picture was of my dad! Laughing


Later on, they saw pictures of me and my family where they saw my black mum and brother, they then understood.

And I don't want to criticize you too much but you obviously didn't handle it too well if it has upset you to this degree. A lot of crap that happens you just have to shrug off. Secondly, the next time it happens then you pull the teachers up because they behaved badly and they know it, but they will continue to behave badly as long as you don't do anything about it.


However you deal with racism in your classroom is up to you, we are all different and we all have different stories to tell.
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offtheoche



Joined: 21 Mar 2007

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you think this is racist and want (as one poster mentioned) to turn the tables, then take a look at this link, or show your co-teachers and ask for their opinions.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/3207410/Fury-after-footy-fans-woof-at-Celtics-South-Korean-star-Ki-Sung-Yueng.html

Basically, you sing........who ate all the dogs, woof woof.

Ps. I don't think this is racist towards the Korean Celtic player and I don't think what happened inside your classroom is racist, just ignorant.
Both incidents did a raise a laugh though, as I'm sure they did with most people.
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wiganer



Joined: 13 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

offtheoche wrote:
If you think this is racist and want (as one poster mentioned) to turn the tables, then take a look at this link, or show your co-teachers and ask for their opinions.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/3207410/Fury-after-footy-fans-woof-at-Celtics-South-Korean-star-Ki-Sung-Yueng.html

Basically, you sing........who ate all the dogs, woof woof.

Ps. I don't think this is racist towards the Korean Celtic player and I don't think what happened inside your classroom is racist, just ignorant.
Both incidents did a raise a laugh though, as I'm sure they did with most people.


Do you remember when Nakamura played for Celtic and the famous 'Nakamura ate my dog' ditty.


nakamura ate my dog
ate my dog
nakamura ate my dog
ate my dog
& he sliced them
& he diced them
he fried them in a wok
nakamura ate my dog

I am sure the Rangers faithful would listen to someone like Steelrails about the difference between Japan, China and Korea whilst blabbing on about science fairs. That would go down a storm I don't think. Rolling Eyes
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chellovek



Joined: 29 Feb 2008

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wiganer wrote:
offtheoche wrote:
If you think this is racist and want (as one poster mentioned) to turn the tables, then take a look at this link, or show your co-teachers and ask for their opinions.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/3207410/Fury-after-footy-fans-woof-at-Celtics-South-Korean-star-Ki-Sung-Yueng.html

Basically, you sing........who ate all the dogs, woof woof.

Ps. I don't think this is racist towards the Korean Celtic player and I don't think what happened inside your classroom is racist, just ignorant.
Both incidents did a raise a laugh though, as I'm sure they did with most people.


Do you remember when Nakamura played for Celtic and the famous 'Nakamura ate my dog' ditty.


nakamura ate my dog
ate my dog
nakamura ate my dog
ate my dog
& he sliced them
& he diced them
he fried them in a wok
nakamura ate my dog

I am sure the Rangers faithful would listen to someone like Steelrails about the difference between Japan, China and Korea whilst blabbing on about science fairs. That would go down a storm I don't think. Rolling Eyes


Ach aye, I'm sure he'll be welcomed with a Glasgow Kiss.
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wiganer



Joined: 13 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chellovek wrote:
wiganer wrote:
offtheoche wrote:
If you think this is racist and want (as one poster mentioned) to turn the tables, then take a look at this link, or show your co-teachers and ask for their opinions.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/3207410/Fury-after-footy-fans-woof-at-Celtics-South-Korean-star-Ki-Sung-Yueng.html

Basically, you sing........who ate all the dogs, woof woof.

Ps. I don't think this is racist towards the Korean Celtic player and I don't think what happened inside your classroom is racist, just ignorant.
Both incidents did a raise a laugh though, as I'm sure they did with most people.


Do you remember when Nakamura played for Celtic and the famous 'Nakamura ate my dog' ditty.


nakamura ate my dog
ate my dog
nakamura ate my dog
ate my dog
& he sliced them
& he diced them
he fried them in a wok
nakamura ate my dog

I am sure the Rangers faithful would listen to someone like Steelrails about the difference between Japan, China and Korea whilst blabbing on about science fairs. That would go down a storm I don't think. Rolling Eyes


Ach aye, I'm sure he'll be welcomed with a Glasgow Kiss.


Indeed! Followed by a...

'Away ye go and blather to someone else who gives a shite ya tube' Laughing
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oldfatfarang



Joined: 19 May 2005
Location: On the road to somewhere.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TeacherinDeajeon wrote:
The response of the children aside, it is the reaction and indifference, or more appropriately, the encouragement by my "colleagues/teachers" that I find unsettling.

I am just struggling to decide my response to my co-teacher. I am going to respond, I am just not sure how measured my response should be.

Chellovek- what was your co-teachers response ?


Just roll with it. Koreans are not politically correct - in any way, shape or form.

I once had an acting class do the bow scene from Titanic. The kids wrote their own scripts, then acted out the Flying Scene. Two high school girls played a scene where Rose was a cripple. Rose was holding her arms by her sides like a duck wing - and making some pretty strangeee noises.
The class went into riot mode. I asked the lady co-teacher if it was appropriate to make fun of cripples (oops), and she said: "I think so, I told them to do it!". Speechless.
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Steelrails



Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The word some dropped out of the sentence somewhere Steelrails. Yeah, why not discuss it?


Because I don't think that's the best way to approach the problem. You have to give people positive examples and preferably teach lessons that aren't laced with violence and hatred.

I for one do not want to teach Korean students that if they go to an inner-city school that they will be the target of racial abuse. I would rather show the community outreach groups that cut across racial lines in the inner-city. Should it be mentioned? Of course. Should it be the focus of the lesson? Absolutely not.

Quote:
Very good Steelrails, I think these kids know that black people can achieve great things. It still doesn't stop the racism and amongst young boys full of testosterone - they are not going to care about some kid winning a physics award no more than I would have done at their age.


Well that's the attitude we have to change isn't it? That winning a physics award is something that people should aspire to. That's why we have schools.

Fortunately here in Korea, while athletes and celebrities are idolized, saying that you want to be like Bill Gates isn't grounds for teasing and people beating you up. Hence why I don't see a problem with focusing on business leaders.

I also don't want to perpetuate the stereotype that the only way people of darker color can succeed is through athletics or entertainment.

But yes, I guess I should just throw slide after slide of soccer stars and rappers.

Quote:
I would say in one country, something is being done about it and in another country something is not being done about it. There will be a day when this really annoying 'pure blood' crap will stop being taught in school in Korea but it won't be anytime soon eh?


My school is 20% mixed students. No one goes on and on about that stuff. The half-Japanese kids are some of the most popular. Maybe in certain places they still carry on and on about it, but you'd be surprised at how liberal people can be here.

Quote:
It is not going to reduce racism, but it will make them think. Maybe for one second. In their own country, their pure blood and their history and their racial superiority is something to be proud of and used to humiliate and belittle others who they think they are superior to. In other places they are just one of many from a big continent.


Yes, I agree that we can change that attitude. Through positive examples. Show how the students from India, China, Japan, and Korea all work together at Asian Pacific Exchange Club. Show how all the ethnic student unions work together to put on the annual talent show.

Or we can have videos of the LA riots. It might be "cool and exciting" but I don't believe that that should be the primary focus of the lesson.

Quote:
It has it's place. Has to be said.


And constitute 10% of the lesson whereas the positive examples constitute the other 90%.

Quote:
OK academic teacher. Tell me about your academic teaching qualifications?


Not advocating teaching through punches to the mouth. Not teaching about social phenomenon and racism through violence and conflict. That and TESOL certified, 3 years experience in the Korean ESL field, lifetime experience from having a public school teacher for a parent. Nothing great.

I'd be happy to put my approach, as demonstrated on this thread, up any day vs. yours before a panel of educators, parents, administrators, counselors, philosophers, and students.

Quote:
Hahahaha - the apologist in you never stops does it? A ruler on the hands? I have seen soles of the feet being beaten, heads being smacked, kids being punched.


Never seen kids punished by a blast to the mouth though. Nothing ever drew blood. Seriously I'm an apologist because I think the lovestick is not as bad as teaching a lesson through socking someone in their mouth?

Quote:
You have heard of the old saying 'live by the sword, die by the sword' yes, there are some people you can reason with and some you cannot. Neither way works with everybody and I never said it did but it does work with some people. Don't blame me, I didn't invent humanity, there are many flaws to many people.
Quote:


Yes but we try the reasonable, academic, non-violent, positive lessons first. We don't go with the punch to the mouth approach first.

We don't yell and scream first. We react calmly and sincerely. We educate minds.

Quote:
This is why I don't have any respect for you as an intelligent person. You do this kind of projection crap all the time and it doesn't work with anyone with half a brain. I have stated time and time again you imbecile that it is actually the students and the teachers who have a hard time distinguishing between the two. Take another look at my posts.


Quote:
I would make the next lesson about the problem in Philadelphia schools were Chinese students are getting the snot smacked out of them by African American students and it made national headlines. If they (the students) are learning English with the future hope of studying in America, Canada or the UK then doing what they did yesterday is going to get them a damn good hiding. Being an Asian student in a lot of places - you don't have to do all that much to get a good beating as it is.


In nowhere do you mention that the students perceive the two groups as the same. This is your first post.

The other posts I'll agree that you did state that the student would be the one doing the tribal dance in front of the African-American student.

I do have one question though, why is it in these scenarios the student is doing it in front of an African-American and the person reacts violently? Why isn't the Korean student doing it in front of an African Immigrant student?

I don't agree with this kind of example because to me it perpetuates violent stereotypes of African-Americans. That is precisely what we have to avoid.

Fortunately the student body and our many African-American teachers at our school would react to such things with teaching and education, or in the case of the students, a joke that would totally embarrass the insensitive idiot. Not beat downs. Usually.

Quote:
Grow up Steelrails! The school bully is really going to be shamed into losing a physics contest in public! You were sober this time when you typed this crap out. Do you think any of those methods would stop him? Go and work in a proper school for God's sakes and see how ineffective your pollyanna methods would be?


This isn't the school bully we're talking about. This is some Korean kid FOB who thinks Africans or African-Americans are incapable of academic success or being excellent students.

See where I grew up we did have immigrant kids who'd join BPA or Science Olympiad and be visibly surprised at the presence and talent of African Immigrant and African-American students there. Many of them made their first friendships with people of African descent because of that time spent together in those clubs and the time they'd spend together studying for certain subjects. They grew to respect the intellectual abilities of their fellow students.

We did have one racist fool who constantly got in fights. Did his opinions ever change? No. But it was nice to see him get ostracized by the other Korean students and he ended up becoming a loner.

Quote:
I'll save it for another post.


Would have been nice to see it within the first three posts.

Quote:
Why are sportsmen so important as role models Steelrails? Especially to young men? Because most young men don't admire academics? They don't and you know it and I know it.


Maybe with the people you hung out with growing up. The 100+ members of the Humanities program, which included most of the popular kids and a high percentage of our student-athletes, sure respected academics. A large percentage of students, of all backgrounds, had parents who were in the academic fields or in high-tech fields. Sure we had a large number of people who could care less about their grades, but every school has that.

Every Friday in humanities you'd see a couple dozen school football jerseys on the students learning about Greek philosophy and Rococo Art. Everyone in that program was shooting for the U-M and no one wanted to look dumb.

Sure everyone had their favorite sports stars and musicians and actors. Everyone also had a person from history they respected and teachers that were well regarded and authors and artists and the like. I think out of all it was comedians that were the most well regarded. A blend of personality and intelligence. Maybe wannabe funnyman ignorant student could find an African-American role model in the comedy field (laughing with, not at).

Quote:
Go and read the book/watch the film 'To Sir With Love' E.R Braithwaite will teach you something about the subject you seem to know little about.


As I said, the lessons I learned were all from my HS where I grew up. It worked there (not 100%) and I will repeat there approach.

But I will give that book a gander. What lessons did you take from the book?


Last edited by Steelrails on Wed Jan 05, 2011 10:04 pm; edited 3 times in total
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NYC_Gal 2.0



Joined: 10 Dec 2010

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@steelrails

How about teaching them that if they do this in the west, people will think that they are uneducated barbarians? That they are primitive and stupid? That nobody will respect them?

Instead of focusing on the beatings (which wouldn't happen in every case) focus on how they are considered low if they act like that.
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Steelrails



Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote:
@steelrails

How about teaching them that if they do this in the west, people will think that they are uneducated barbarians? That they are primitive and stupid? That nobody will respect them?

Instead of focusing on the beatings (which wouldn't happen in every case) focus on how they are considered low if they act like that.


Another good approach. I sorta mentioned this with the social isolation they'd face from other Korean students. Turn them into wangta- now there is something that will strike fear into the hearts of a K-student.

And yes, maybe compare racists to Burberry Men or a caveman or something...
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sublunari



Joined: 11 Jun 2009

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My attempts to do something about the racism I frequently witnessed in the classroom were only successful when I simply asked my students, through my Korean co-teacher, how they would feel if they were mistaken for a Chinese person if they were traveling in America, which is basically an inevitability. After that the racism in the classroom really cooled down, but I still winced whenever I knew a black person was about to come up on the TV.

At the moment in my camp we're learning about Africa, and I've made a point to focus on almost everything except the problems Koreans generally seem to hear about whenever the continent is mentioned; i.e, disease, starvation, war, poverty, etc. As much of these issues can be traced to a history of centuries of western colonialism, which is itself fairly easy to dovetail with Korea's experience with Japan, I think it's possible to make a dent in the endemic racism here in Korea, which for nearly all of the kids is just ignorance and really not their fault. For adults it is less excusable.

Anyway, instead of the problems of Africa, we learn about countries, musicians, historical people and places, the landscape, wildlife, etc. This approach isn't perfect but when I'm not able to explain the roots of the violence in Somalia to a Korean child in Korean it's really the best I can do.

My own public school education in America largely omitted Africa from its curriculum as well, which is a damn shame, as I think many people have absolutely no awareness of the contributions Africa has made to the world. Egyptian architecture and mathematics, west African music (the "DNA of the blues", most American rock music, and therefore all the KPOP that shamelessly rips it off), are the the easiest to mention here, to say nothing of the art I once saw when I visited the Schomburg Center in Harlem; America was also built on the backs of slaves.
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