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enchoo
Joined: 04 Jul 2004
Location: Heading to a reality show near you
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 Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:18 am Post subject: Wow this drama is getting quite interesting^^ |
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| Wow can you all summarize this discussion so far??? |
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thegadfly
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 7:41 am Post subject: |
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Summary?
Well, the last few pages have been methdxman saying : take responsibility for yourself and your situation, that racism is not the root reason that companies work in their own best interests, that this kind of treatment is not unique to Korea, and that it would be better for folks that live outside of their home countries remember these things, in order to perhaps be happier and more successful. Then there are the folks telling him he is wrong, somehow, for suggesting such things, mainly 'cause their feelings got hurted by the bad-man.
Personally, I am in the "man up, Nancy" camp, which is why I chimed in.... |
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sojusucks
Joined: 31 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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| thegadfly wrote: |
Summary?
Well, the last few pages have been methdxman saying : take responsibility for yourself and your situation, that racism is not the root reason that companies work in their own best interests, that this kind of treatment is not unique to Korea, and that it would be better for folks that live outside of their home countries remember these things, in order to perhaps be happier and more successful. Then there are the folks telling him he is wrong, somehow, for suggesting such things, mainly 'cause their feelings got hurted by the bad-man.
Personally, I am in the "man up, Nancy" camp, which is why I chimed in.... |
Do you fully understand the "evaluation process"? No one does. It changes from school to school and from teacher to teacher, and is used to punish those who don't kiss butt, and to shift blame for anything and everything to the younger Korean teachers and the foreign teachers. |
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methdxman
Joined: 14 Sep 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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| sojusucks wrote: |
| thegadfly wrote: |
Summary?
Well, the last few pages have been methdxman saying : take responsibility for yourself and your situation, that racism is not the root reason that companies work in their own best interests, that this kind of treatment is not unique to Korea, and that it would be better for folks that live outside of their home countries remember these things, in order to perhaps be happier and more successful. Then there are the folks telling him he is wrong, somehow, for suggesting such things, mainly 'cause their feelings got hurted by the bad-man.
Personally, I am in the "man up, Nancy" camp, which is why I chimed in.... |
Do you fully understand the "evaluation process"? No one does. It changes from school to school and from teacher to teacher, and is used to punish those who don't kiss butt, and to shift blame for anything and everything to the younger Korean teachers and the foreign teachers. |
So kiss butt. Everyone likes a little ass kissing. That's life. Why is this so hard to understand? Kiss tons of ass. Even when there is an evaluation process that is crystal clear, you still need to remember to always make your boss look good and kiss his/her ass.
Again, no one gets judged impartially in life. |
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languistic
Joined: 25 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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...
Last edited by languistic on Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:35 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:22 pm Post subject: Re: Wow this drama is getting quite interesting^^ |
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| enchoo wrote: |
| Wow can you all summarize this discussion so far??? |
Enchoo - apart from the usual naysayers (languistice ect), the troll methdx who crashes threads yet he has admitted he has never been an English teacher and doesn't live/hasn't lived in Korea has basically been slagging off English teachers because of his low self-esteem.
He's probably a plant from Korean sentry, a collection of Koreans with social, mental, and identity issues, many of whom have been banned from other forums, who constantly attack foreigners for having sex, enjoying life and teaching English and make threats of violence against non Koreans.
Read the next post I put up - this what happened when this sad fellow did his usual trolling-slagging and then couldn't answer my replies to him. He wrote more rubbish, but there's no need to reproduce it. It's obvious where he's coming from.
Last edited by earthquakez on Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:25 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:23 pm Post subject: |
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1) For enchoo's information:  The troll's assertions are in normal font, my answers are in bold.
| earthquakez wrote: |
| methdxman wrote: |
1) Isn't this the language of Dave's ESL Cafe? I would communicate in a nice way, but all I've read on this forum is snide remarks and smart-ass sarcasm, so if that's the love language here, that's how I'll roll.
ALL you've read on Dave's? Negativity only? I and I am sure many others agree with you if you're referring to your own posts.
2) If you get screwed 3 times, that's your fault. Nobody else's. That is life. You did something wrong.
Yes, yes, of course when people lie to people they employ during interviews and then break the contracts they offered to the employee, it's always the fault of the person they employ.
Especially in Korea when the employee is careful and makes sure the conditions and benefits are written the same in Korean and English on the contract to make these binding. It just so happens that foreigners don't understand the Korean mind and how this excuses manifestly illegal actions.
To perpetuate this myth that when you get screwed that it's always someone else's fault is doing a disservice to humanity.
Somehow you don't come across as a person who gives half a damn about humanity. In fact it's probably fair to say that many people on this cafe have no need of any 'service' you think you can offer.
3) I'm giving blunt but great insight on life. Nobody in life gets judged impartially. We're human. You better get people to like or love you at work. Korean people aren't robots that just naturally want to take advantage of foreigners. People are the same everywhere at the core.
'Great insight on life' eh? Snap out it, you're sounding ridiculous. Koreans may very well not want to 'naturally' take advantage of foreigners but it sure is part of the culture, work culture included.
Korean heirarchies take advantage of Korean people perceived as lower on the totem pole so of course in the case of non Koreans the effects will be just as bad or worse as this is a society that openly discourages the idea that Koreans have to treat foreigners with equality, regardless of the intentions of certain sections of Korean society.
Whining about how badly you are being discriminated against is not how you live abroad. There are plenty of people in way worse situations in this world who have triumphed in a country that is not their own.
Not all but a significant proportion of them have also lived and worked in western societies that have the structures to accommodate diverse people even if these societies have their negative elements that need to catch up with those authorities, institutions and groups encouraging diversity.
To 'triumph' in a country that is not yours, you also need legal status that allows you to stay longer than from year to year unless you're married to a national of the country concerned.
Korea does not fit the description of such a country, even Japan that has similar inbuilt xenophobia allows foreigners including English teachers far more visa freedom and legal rights.
In short, this is all a microcosm of why so many westerners (namely, Americans) have such a bad reputation in a lot of countries. And I do personally have a stake in all of this, because I will probably live outside of the U.S. for a long, long time and have to mitigate the reputation that precedes me. |
No, don't worry, you'll suceed in alienating non Americans after you open your mouth all on your own. |
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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="languistic"]
The second was the 'it may be your own fault' camp, mainly headed up by methdxman. This too was full of reasoning; that Korea is not unique in this matter, its just business, take some responsibility for your situation and basically absolving Korea Inc. from being the villain.
For me, the second camp seems a more comfortable place to rest. Not just here on Dave's, but in life. I have been a visitor to the first, but in the end, if we really are all completely at the convenience/disposal of another, we cannot live. Did methdxman say that Koreans are blameless? No. He said that stuff happens everywhere, so don't play the weak race card every time something bad happens to you here. It's called living with people. People who are petty, weak, insecure, power-hungry, thoughtless and small and they are everywhere in the world.quote]
 I've read many of your diatribes here and seeing you defending a nasty little troll whose position has been cut down with no real defence or ability to debate back, makes me suspicious of your claims to be a university teacher.
It's Fail, Fail, Fail for your friend methdxman yet you hold this misfit up to be an example for yourself and others. There are a lot of reasonable posters here but you certainly take the prize for your over-personalisation of many issues. However, if you do agree with the little troll's prescription of 'kissing ass' it's easy to see why you may hold a position in a Korean higher education institution.
Your attacks on oldfatfarang haven't gone unnoticed by a lot of us. Defend a nasty troll, attack a respected poster - by your words we know you. |
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languistic
Joined: 25 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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...makes me suspicious of your claims to be a university teacher....
...it's easy to see why you may hold a position in a Korean higher education institution.
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Nice. |
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methdxman
Joined: 14 Sep 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:53 pm Post subject: Re: Wow this drama is getting quite interesting^^ |
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| earthquakez wrote: |
| enchoo wrote: |
| Wow can you all summarize this discussion so far??? |
Enchoo - apart from the usual naysayers (languistice ect), the troll methdx who crashes threads yet he has admitted he has never been an English teacher and doesn't live/hasn't lived in Korea has basically been slagging off English teachers because of his low self-esteem.
He's probably a plant from Korean sentry, a collection of Koreans with social, mental, and identity issues, many of whom have been banned from other forums, who constantly attack foreigners for having sex, enjoying life and teaching English and make threats of violence against non Koreans.
Read the next post I put up - this what happened when this sad fellow did his usual trolling-slagging and then couldn't answer my replies to him. He wrote more rubbish, but there's no need to reproduce it. It's obvious where he's coming from. |
Please kindly copy and paste where I said I don't/haven't lived in Korea. Thanks.
Also, I've already responded to most of your weak assertions and whining.
Most of what you write doesn't even deserve a response. A Korean sentry?
Dude, have as much as fun as you want in Korea, I don't care. That's totally beyond the scope of this thread. The hell are you talking about?
Last edited by methdxman on Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:58 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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| languistic wrote: |
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...makes me suspicious of your claims to be a university teacher....
...it's easy to see why you may hold a position in a Korean higher education institution.
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Nice. |
Chalk up another Fail, this time for languistic. Not very clever - do you omit vital information when supposedly doing research? When you're not coming here to attack other people, Korean sentry supporters in tow?
As for your Korean sentry friend, it's easy to see that he will end up in troll exile if he is not careful. |
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methdxman
Joined: 14 Sep 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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| earthquakez wrote: |
| languistic wrote: |
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...makes me suspicious of your claims to be a university teacher....
...it's easy to see why you may hold a position in a Korean higher education institution.
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Nice. |
Chalk up another Fail, this time for languistic. Not very clever - do you omit vital information when supposedly doing research? When you're not coming here to attack other people, Korean sentry supporters in tow?
As for your Korean sentry friend, it's easy to see that he will end up in troll exile if he is not careful. |
Man just go back to wherever you came from. You're just not cut out for this. |
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languistic
Joined: 25 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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Last edited by languistic on Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:36 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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silkhighway
Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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I'm a fence-sitter as always. It's very hard for a foreign teacher to be evaluated with any meaning. What are the benchmarks of success? And who evaluates those benchmarks? Your co-teacher of course, since virtually all communication is done through them. Therefore, your assessment boils down to entirely your relationship with your co-teacher, who may bring their own bag of issues to the table or may have an agenda inherently not in line with yours.
So basically, one bad assessment means one bad experience. I'd evaluate what I could have done differently (maybe nothing), and shake it off. 2, 3...4 bad experiences, I'd start considering a new line of work. |
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languistic
Joined: 25 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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Last edited by languistic on Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:37 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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