|
Korean Job Discussion Forums "The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
smartwentcrazy
Joined: 26 Feb 2009
|
Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Riker wrote: |
Exactly. People with STD's are still human and deserve to be treated like the rest of us.
I've know many people with HIV, and I would personally rather work with them than half the people on this board.
People that equate whats legal with whats right scare me. Often times the two are not equivalent, sometimes not even close.
What's scary is people like smartwentcrazy called this guy a "moron" for trying to find work. Its not like the guy said "hey I'm going to look for people to infect with minor STD's" |
Sweet Jesus you are impossible to have a logical, coherent discussion with. I'm only concerned with the letter of the law regarding immigration policies in KOREA. That's it. I don't care about anything else. Regardless of what is morally right or wrong, that's the law. Sure, it can be unfair and at times discriminatory, but we're not the ones who make policy. We are simply asked to follow it. If you can't abide by the law in a foreign country, then get the **** out. I'm through having these circular discussions with you. You are obviously too thickheaded to see past your own personal biases. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Riker

Joined: 28 Dec 2010
|
Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
A.)You still have not explained why this person is a "moron" for trying to get a job in Korea. I've never heard of a person failing a medical anything short of HIV or HEP-C or drugs. Neither of which he had.
B.)You were also seemingly unaware that the USA allows HIV infected people to immigrate here, and I will go out on a limb here and assume your from the USA.
Eagerly awaits explanation of both.
Correct answers are as follows:
A.) I was mistaken about Korean immigration policies.
B.) I'm not from the USA - or - I'm from the US, but am again ignorant of immigration policies. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
|
Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Yes according to smartwentcrazy other countries won't let in people with diseases and certain conditions but he/she is completely wrong. My country the UK, the US, Australia and Canada to name only four have and do allow in migrants and asylum seekers with serious conditions such as HIV and TB to name only two.
I also like the way smartwentcrazy slags off people with STDs, in this case a poster asking a question re health standards for English teachers here. Personally I don't think it's an issue unless the poster is looking to infect his students with whatever he has and I doubt that.
On a wider scale, I accept Korea has the right to demand whatever health standards they like for 1 yr contract foreign English teachers but that doesn't make the demands reasonable. Nor do these demands improve public health in Korea because the mind boggles thinking of all the sexually transmitted diseases here and undiagnosed HIV because of Korean society's refusal to deal with the mainstream brothel culture for men especially married ones and the downlow culture of male homosexuality and bisexuality as a public health issue far bigger and more relevant than any to do with mostly temporary foreigners.
Crazy needs to brush up on his/her facts - smart they are not.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
madtownhustl
Joined: 04 Jun 2009
|
Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Riker, I skimmed this thread and already understand what he said, and how your taking it out of context. He's talking about idiots who try to bypass the immigration process into this country. Nothing more, nothing less.
And sure, the U.S., according to you, may let ppl with the HIV into the country, but they still want these ppl(ppl with the HIV) documented... |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Riker

Joined: 28 Dec 2010
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 6:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
| madtownhustl wrote: |
Riker, I skimmed this thread and already understand what he said, and how your taking it out of context. He's talking about idiots who try to bypass the immigration process into this country. Nothing more, nothing less.
And sure, the U.S., according to you, may let ppl with the HIV into the country, but they still want these ppl(ppl with the HIV) documented... |
The person he blasted as a moron never mentioned HIV. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009 Location: Earth, Solar System
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 8:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
Uhm, this is not going to be popular, but if you get an STD, generally its your own fault. Yes there are exceptions, but they are exceptions. I'm talking people from the developed world here, unlike Africa where children are born with HIV.
If you can't exercise self-control and good judgment so as to avoid that kind of thing, well...maybe you shouldn't be barred from entry, but its reason enough to raise red flags. Yes, yes everyone around the world engages in stupidity. Treating people with STDs like innocent victims is a bit much though.
And I'm sorry but the naive policy of free-travel with HIV has utterly failed to reduce the scope of the disease. Sometimes you have to be cold-blooded about things.
At the same time I say if you can trust people with guns, you should be able to trust people with AIDs. If you can't trust people carrying guns, well then you might not be able to trust people with AIDs. I support the 2nd Amendment, so to be consistent, I should support free travel for HIV infectees...
I guess you would have to ask yourself would you be fine with a law-abiding person who carries a legal concealed firearm into school teaching your children? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 8:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
Ahhheeeemmmm...
Back on topic,
The reason for so many health checks is because immigration doesn't communicate with the education office.
So even though you got a check done already for immigration, you have to do another for your local education office.
Some schools are more diligent at enforcing these checks than others. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Riker

Joined: 28 Dec 2010
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Steelrails wrote: |
Uhm, this is not going to be popular, but if you get an STD, generally its your own fault. Yes there are exceptions, but they are exceptions. I'm talking people from the developed world here, unlike Africa where children are born with HIV.
If you can't exercise self-control and good judgment so as to avoid that kind of thing, well...maybe you shouldn't be barred from entry, but its reason enough to raise red flags. Yes, yes everyone around the world engages in stupidity. Treating people with STDs like innocent victims is a bit much though.
And I'm sorry but the naive policy of free-travel with HIV has utterly failed to reduce the scope of the disease. Sometimes you have to be cold-blooded about things.
At the same time I say if you can trust people with guns, you should be able to trust people with AIDs. If you can't trust people carrying guns, well then you might not be able to trust people with AIDs. I support the 2nd Amendment, so to be consistent, I should support free travel for HIV infectees...
I guess you would have to ask yourself would you be fine with a law-abiding person who carries a legal concealed firearm into school teaching your children? |
So lets sum this up.
You know you will never catch HIV from people, since as you say people who catch it are at fault ( which I don't argue with by the way ).
Yet you still would rather see them not travel and hold jobs freely. Even though you know you can never contract this disease, since you have "good" judgment.
So the only reason I can conclude for your position is pure hate? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009 Location: Earth, Solar System
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 2:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Riker wrote: |
You know you will never catch HIV from people, since as you say people who catch it are at fault ( which I don't argue with by the way ).
Yet you still would rather see them not travel and hold jobs freely. Even though you know you can never contract this disease, since you have "good" judgment.
So the only reason I can conclude for your position is pure hate? |
It's not just about 'me' when making a policy decision. Not everything goes according to plan. People aren't perfect. Yes, I may be fine, but I don't believe that my stance on the issues should have such a narrow focus.
The free-travel premise seems to be based on the premise that HIV individuals will exhibit self-control and responsibility and not engage in behavior that will put other people at risk.
Considering that these lapses in judgment already took place, hence why the person has HIV, it seems risky at best to give that level of trust. It's funny how the same people who argue that HIV infectees can be trusted, are the same people who argue against abstinence-only education as "unrealistic". Throw alcohol in the mix and those risks dramatically increase.
The other major way of contracting HIV in the developed world is through IV drug use. Not exactly a prime candidate for trustworthiness either.
Why is regulation of travel not an option? For infectious diseases it has always been an option, and indeed the standard practice. Why the sudden change? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Riker

Joined: 28 Dec 2010
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:16 pm Post subject: |
|
|
We could make the same argument about letting people drive cars or drinking alcohol.
Both of which are much more likely to kill you in an industrialized nation. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
IlIlNine
Joined: 15 Jun 2005 Location: Gunpo, Gyonggi, SoKo
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Obviously they are greatly concerned about your health! Take it as a compliment. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
madtownhustl
Joined: 04 Jun 2009
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Riker wrote: |
| madtownhustl wrote: |
Riker, I skimmed this thread and already understand what he said, and how your taking it out of context. He's talking about idiots who try to bypass the immigration process into this country. Nothing more, nothing less.
And sure, the U.S., according to you, may let ppl with the HIV into the country, but they still want these ppl(ppl with the HIV) documented... |
The person he blasted as a moron never mentioned HIV. |
Still can't find where he said that... Could you point it out for me?
To answer your question from awhile back. The free checkup from your school is the same as the immigration one, but I had to answer some questions about drinkin and smoking, and also pee on a stick. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
sadguy
Joined: 13 Feb 2011
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| smartwentcrazy wrote: |
| Riker wrote: |
| smartwentcrazy wrote: |
You're required to take a test because of morons like this:
| Holster wrote: |
| Ok...basically I'm concerned that I may an STD...HPV which can result in genital warts but I don't think it shows in blood or urine tests anyway? Will get tested before I leave but I don't have much time for getting tests/results/treatment if it turns out I do have anything! Very embarassing and I've never had anything before so I'm hoping it's just not the case! |
| Holster wrote: |
| Ok I realise I'm not coming off great here but... can you also tell me if HSV-2 (ie herpes) is on the test? Please! |
You're working in a public school environment and employed by the government, therefore, drug tests, medical checks, blood tests, etc. are all mandatory. This is the case even if you're renewing and/or have stayed in Korea for an extended period of time. They're not accusing you of anything, it's just a precautionary measure that every school takes. When you have idiots who try to bypass the screening process and are eventually caught with a STD/drugs, the school is plastered all over the media with parents going nuts after they realize their childrens' teacher had possibly infected their kids with an STD. Something I'm sure most schools would like to avoid.. |
You can't give STD's by teaching ESL. |
You come up with that all by yourself genius? Well, no **** sherlock. But, I don't think ANY parent (much less fear-driven Korean parents) would want their kids hanging around a teacher who has HIV/HPV/etc. And I don't think any country would accept someone with a transmittable disease to legally immigrate to this country. |
that's kind of a dumb statement. hpv is so common. about 50% of people get it in their lifetime. YOU probably have it. lots of times, it's asymptomatic and sometimes it even goes away on it's own. anyway, that was an off topic rant. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
NYC_Gal 2.0

Joined: 10 Dec 2010
|
Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
A good 25% of my students have cold sores on a fairly regular basis. I've also seen plenty of the teachers with them. I think I'll use my own cup for the ceremonial soju pour, thanks.
To the OP: I was told that I had to do another health check after having taken my renewal one. I asked why, and they said it was for all public school teachers. I asked if they could get a copy of the one I'd taken a month before, and they sent that one to the education office with no problems at all. See if you can get them to do that. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|