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The Libyan War
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Ya-ta Boy



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994

PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
That hasn't quite worked out as we had hoped as Ghaddfi's troops seem to have retaken the Tunisian border, through extensive shelling. Some shells landed on the newly liberated Tunisian side.


This morning al-Jazeera is reporting the rebels have retaken the border crossing and are massing for an offensive. And Tunisia has told the Libyan gov't to knock off intruding into its territory. Go Rebs!
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Butterfly



Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: Kuwait

PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya-ta Boy wrote:
Quote:
That hasn't quite worked out as we had hoped as Ghaddfi's troops seem to have retaken the Tunisian border, through extensive shelling. Some shells landed on the newly liberated Tunisian side.


This morning al-Jazeera is reporting the rebels have retaken the border crossing and are massing for an offensive. And Tunisia has told the Libyan gov't to knock off intruding into its territory. Go Rebs!


Go Rebs!
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Ya-ta Boy



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994

PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While it's possible to look at the Brega front as stalled, it's also possible to think of it as the rebels holding back Qaddafi's forces.

Second front: Misarata has been mostly cleared of Qaddafi forces, although they are able to shell the city from outside. Still, an improvement.

Third front: I'm not clear if this is a new front opening or if it's just that we're now getting information from there. Either way, the fighting there seems to be intensifying.

I can't help but think things have steadily improved for the rebels this week.

It's too bad war isn't more like a TV drama with all the plot threads wrapped up by the end of the hour and a cute little denoument to end it all before everyone lives happily ever after, since elements of the Syrian army have clashed with each other. My apprehension grows by the day.
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Space Bar



Joined: 20 Oct 2010

PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Title is probably a bit OTT. I doubt it eclipses the Fed's bailouts.

Financial Heist of the Century: Confiscating Libya's Sovereign Wealth Funds

The objective of the war against Libya is not just its oil reserves (now estimated at 60 billion barrels), which are the greatest in Africa and whose extraction costs are among the lowest in the world, nor the natural gas reserves of which are estimated at about 1,500 billion cubic meters. In the crosshairs of "willing" of the operation �Unified Protector� there are sovereign wealth funds, capital that the Libyan state has invested abroad.

The Libyan Investment Authority (LIA) manages sovereign wealth funds estimated at about $70 billion U.S., rising to more than $150 billion if you include foreign investments of the Central Bank and other bodies. But it might be more. Even if they are lower than those of Saudi Arabia or Kuwait, Libyan sovereign wealth funds have been characterized by their rapid growth. When LIA was established in 2006, it had $40 billion at its disposal. In just five years, LIA has invested over one hundred companies in North Africa, Asia, Europe, the U.S. and South America: holding, banking, real estate, industries, oil companies and others.

In Italy, the main Libyan investments are those in UniCredit Bank (of which LIA and the Libyan Central Bank hold 7.5 percent), Finmeccanica (2 percent) and ENI (1 percent), these and other investments (including 7.5 percent of the Juventus Football Club) have a significance not as much economically (they amount to some $5.4 billion) as politically.

Libya, after Washington removed it from the blacklist of �rogue states,� has sought to carve out a space at the international level focusing on "diplomacy of sovereign wealth funds." Once the U.S. and the EU lifted the embargo in 2004 and the big oil companies returned to the country, Tripoli was able to maintain a trade surplus of about $30 billion per year which was used largely to make foreign investments. The management of sovereign funds has however created a new mechanism of power and corruption in the hands of ministers and senior officials, which probably in part escaped the control of the Gadhafi himself: This is confirmed by the fact that, in 2009, he proposed that the 30 billion in oil revenues go "directly to the Libyan people." This aggravated the fractures within the Libyan government...
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Butterfly



Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: Kuwait

PostPosted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya-ta Boy wrote:
Third front: I'm not clear if this is a new front opening or if it's just that we're now getting information from there. Either way, the fighting there seems to be intensifying.


And seriously pissing Tunisia off, understandably. Ghaddaffi's forces are utterly desperate if they taking their fight into Tunisian towns. No command, just wild west stuff. Freaky.
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Ya-ta Boy



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994

PostPosted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Wall Street Journal is reporting NATO will step up efforts along the Tunisian border.

�Our campaign will now shift targets to now hit more pro-Gadhafi troops targeting civilians,� said Brigadier General Rob Weighill in comments relayed by video to Brussels from Naples. �We cannot, and will not, disclose the plan. You will see the results in the next few days.�

Asked what he meant, he said NATO was watching �more activity in Zintan and Yefren,� two cities near the Tunisian border.


Another sign that things are getting tougher for Qaddafi: Apparently the government has asked its soldiers to stop firing their guns in the air in order to save their bullets for the rebels. Looks like an admission that ammunition is starting to be a problem.

There's also a weird report that gov't troops in Tripoli are having spats with civilians at gas stations. Don't armies usually have their own fuel supplies?
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caniff



Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map

PostPosted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
France Is Dropping Concrete Chunks on Libya

By Adam Martin Apr 29, 2011

French planes have started dropping bomb-shaped chunks of concrete instead of actual bombs on Muammar Qadaffi's tanks in Libya. The idea is that a 600-pound concrete training bomb, dropped from thousands of feet up, can crush a tank without creating a huge explosion that kills a lot of people.

The move was rumored early on to be the result of a munitions shortage within NATO, but that's been debunked. Agence France-Presse reported on Thursday that "[m]ilitary spokesman Thierry Burkhard denied rumours the use of the 300-kilo (660-pound) training devices was prompted by a shortage of real bombs. He said the first such strike crushed an armoured vehicle on Tuesday."

It's worth pointing out that the story hasn't gotten much traction in the U.S. press. While foreign agencies from the Middle East's Zawya to the Philippines' ABS-CBN to Chinese state agency Xinhua have run the story, only blogs appear to be picking it up domestically. Maybe the idea of essentially throwing rocks isn't that impressive.


This can hardly please the MIC.
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geldedgoat



Joined: 05 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 2:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

caniff wrote:
This can hardly please the MIC.


While I relish the thought of making innumerable jokes about the French because of this, I actually like this idea.

On a side note, is your new avatar Donald Trump or Rutger Hauer?
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Kuros



Joined: 27 Apr 2004

PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

caniff wrote:
Quote:
France Is Dropping Concrete Chunks on Libya

By Adam Martin Apr 29, 2011

French planes have started dropping bomb-shaped chunks of concrete instead of actual bombs on Muammar Qadaffi's tanks in Libya. The idea is that a 600-pound concrete training bomb, dropped from thousands of feet up, can crush a tank without creating a huge explosion that kills a lot of people.

The move was rumored early on to be the result of a munitions shortage within NATO, but that's been debunked. Agence France-Presse reported on Thursday that "[m]ilitary spokesman Thierry Burkhard denied rumours the use of the 300-kilo (660-pound) training devices was prompted by a shortage of real bombs. He said the first such strike crushed an armoured vehicle on Tuesday."

It's worth pointing out that the story hasn't gotten much traction in the U.S. press. While foreign agencies from the Middle East's Zawya to the Philippines' ABS-CBN to Chinese state agency Xinhua have run the story, only blogs appear to be picking it up domestically. Maybe the idea of essentially throwing rocks isn't that impressive.


This can hardly please the MIC.


Caniff didn't post the important detail concerning targeting.

Quote:
Keep in mind that the bombs, while concrete, are still guided by modern technology like GPS or lasers onto their targets since a near miss with a concrete bomb won�t get you much.


Pictures of the bombs in the link.

But as much as the French will try to spin this as being "responsible," its another example of the yawning gap between American and European military capabilities. The Americans have the $40,000 (ZOMG THIS WAR IS SO EXPENSIVE!) GBU-39B Small Diameter Bomb System.

Still, the French are resourceful.
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Space Bar



Joined: 20 Oct 2010

PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AU insists on ending military action against Libyan officials

Posted: 2011/04/28
From: Mathaba


The African Union wrote:
Council urges all involved to refrain from actions, including military operations targeting Libyan senior officials� that would further compound the situation and make it more difficult to achieve international consensus on the best way forward.
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Kuros



Joined: 27 Apr 2004

PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Space Bar wrote:
AU insists on ending military action against Libyan officials

Posted: 2011/04/28
From: Mathaba


The African Union wrote:
Council urges all involved to refrain from actions, including military operations targeting Libyan senior officials� that would further compound the situation and make it more difficult to achieve international consensus on the best way forward.


The African Union and Mathaba are very much alike; neither has any credibility.
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Ya-ta Boy



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994

PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saif Al-Arab Gaddafi, Libya Leader's Son, Killed By NATO Airstrike
TRIPOLI, April 30 (Reuters) - Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi survived a NATO airstrike on Saturday night that killed his youngest son Saif al-Arab and three of his grandchildren, a Libyan government spokesman said.

Mussa Ibrahim said Saif al-Arab was a civilian and a student who had studied in Germany. He was 29 years old.

Libyan officials took journalists to the house, which had been hit by at least three missiles. The roof had completely caved in in some areas, leaving strings of reinforcing steel hanging down among chunks of concrete.

A table football machine stood outside in the garden of the house, which was in a wealthy residential area of Tripoli.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/30/saif-al-arab-gaddafi-libya-killed_n_855920.html
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Ya-ta Boy



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994

PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^
The feeling of inevitability of this doesn't take away from the tragedy of three little kids getting killed. That's just awful.
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Ya-ta Boy



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994

PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is a terrific blog by a Libyan worth reading:

Cantgetright is�well�lets just say he could never �get it right.� I don�t know how many times he delayed us or even made us turn around for him. We lost an hour in Alexandria looking for him, at one point I heard the driver say �The sea should NOT be at your left�. Because that clearly indicated that he was going east (towards Gaza). Six hours later in the middle of the night/desert the guy runs out of gas even though we stopped plenty of times for gas. And it was perfect timing too because we were at least 200 Km from civilization. So the genius starts to withdraw gas from our tank. I step out of the car and into the dark expanse of the desert, and on my way back I see that Cantgetright has a bottle of gasoline in his hands and a cigarette in his mouth. I didn�t think he could top that but once we got to the Libyan border he almost got us all into hot water.

So here we are on free Libyan soil. A young freedom fighter is checking the van when he finds a large GREEN rag in Cantgetright�s car. A scuffle breaks out near the car and one soldier pulled out his gun thinking he�s caught himself a Gaddafi loyalists. Cantgetright insists he uses the rag to clean the windows, etc., and the dirt and grime on the rag corroborate his story. One guy breaks the tension by setting it on fire so I took a picture and yelled ALLAHU AKBAR, only to be joined by the entire border guard. We went on our way and it wasn�t until later we discovered Cantgetright left his passport at the border so we had to turn around �..again.


http://enoughgaddafi.com/?category_name=blog
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Space Bar



Joined: 20 Oct 2010

PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kuros wrote:
Space Bar wrote:
AU insists on ending military action against Libyan officials

Posted: 2011/04/28
From: Mathaba


The African Union wrote:
Council urges all involved to refrain from actions, including military operations targeting Libyan senior officials� that would further compound the situation and make it more difficult to achieve international consensus on the best way forward.


The African Union and Mathaba are very much alike; neither has any credibility.

No, we couldn't possibly let Africans have any significant say in the control of Africa., of course not. Leave it up to FrUKUS.

And let's kill Qaddafi and his grandchildren while we are at it. Now, that's credibility right there, I tell ya.

I suppose the IAC has no credibility either:
Quote:
International Action Center Statement on Libya:

U.S., Britain and France: Hands off Libya! Get out of Africa!

U.S., British and French imperialism have escalated their military intervention in Libya beyond the criminal bombardment of Libya, begun on March 19.

The one dominant imperialist power and the two former colonial rulers of the world jointly stated their intentions in a open letter published on April 15 in the Washington Post and other media. U.S. President Barack Obama, British Prime Minister David Cameron and French President Nicolas Sarkozy wrote that their goal was to remove Moammar Gadhafi, the leader of Libya. for good. That�s what they call �regime change.� This is even in violation of the resolution rammed through the UN Security Council. It is international lawlessness on a grand scale...
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