Korean Job Discussion Forums

[northway]

It really depends on the school and the area you're in. Working in a pretty wealthy area with relatively high tuition (940,000 a month for kindy, 440,000 a month for 10 hour a week elementary), my kids' parents tend to be very involved, and many of them speak to me personally about their children. They tend to be a bit shy, but at the same time do make an effort to meet me and say hello, as well as sending detailed notes on appropriate holidays (Teacher's Day, Chuseok, Christmas).

[Juregen]

[Netz]

[creeper1]

If you don't feel important or a full human being here then then the question is why don't you go home and be important or human there?

Oh yeah wait ..............

As an unskilled worker you are not important or human ANYWHERE.

[myenglishisno]

[Julius]

[northway]

[minos]

First off. They have other classes at a hagwon. Did your parents meet all your high school teachers for a private 1 on 1 chat?

For many, hagwons are daycare because daycare doesn't really exist here. They're not expecting a miracle unless they're dropping big bucks. The parents do come by to make suggestions and even tell teachers to focus on their child specifically.

[Julius]

[PatrickGHBusan]

[litebear]

[Netz]

[PatrickGHBusan]

True I left Kotrea in 2008 but lived there from 1997 to 2008.

I have been back every year (sometimes more than once) for family visits and work as my job deals in part with Korea.

In my time in Korea I became fluent in the language, worked in numerous schools (Hakwon, PS and Uni) and managed a consulting agency that dealt with Korean and North Am companies. I also volunteered and met tons of Koreans that way.

So...let me tell you...acceptance is based on the groups that KNOW you. Strangers are not relevant in that perspective and it puzzles me that any person would want or think about acceptance on a larger scale than work, friends or family. Good grief, not everyone accepts or likes you (the you is generic here). Thats a fact of life. You esyablish relationships with people and acceptance comes from there.

If by acceptance you mean citizenship than sure, it is exceedlingly hard to obtain Korean citizenship. Do you need this to be accepted? Not in my experience or in the experience of most of the long term residents I know in Korea.

I do not have to look Korean to be part of my wifes' family who accepted me like one of their own. I also needed no plastic surgery to belong to groups at my various workplaces and volunteering endeavors. I am still in touch with most of these people today. Many have visited us in Canada and when we visit Korea we get invitations to their houses or to dinners on a regular basis. That my friend is called belonging and acceptance.

Now, to be crystal clear: I DO NOT CARE what Mr Kim whom I do not know thinks about me. I fully understand what my status (in legal terms) was in Korea. It was first that of a foreign temporary worker and then that of a legal resident. That did not stop me from being accepted in groups and again, that harabogi in Masan who looked at me and thought bad thoughts of me is completely irrelevant to my life. Just like that John Doe in the subway back here in Canada who stands next to me in the morning. What they think of me is irrelevant to my life.

In Korea I am a wayguk....because I am indeed NOT FROM THERE. Thats no big deal. The same holds true for my brother in Japan who after more than 13 years there remains a gaijin despite being fluent in Japanese and having a japanese wife. However, he is fully accepted by his in-laws, friends and most co-workers. He, like me, does not care one iota what some stranger thinks of him down the street in Tokyo.

All I am saying is that your initial post was in my opinion to general in nature and missed the mark on what acceptance can be in Korea. Establishing a relationship is crucial in Korea as it puts you into the social interaction structure. Once that is done you can be accepted with little to no problems as long as you too make efforts. Strangers in Korea are non-entities and that goes for everyone.

Now, we can surely avoid insults right? This can be debated or discussed rationally and with respect. I apologize if the tone of my initial response offended you.

Finally you do not have to be KOREAN to be accepted by KOREANS; that too should be simple enough for this forum

[Netz]

I'm not sure if you even read what I wrote, but at this point I could care less.

Furthermore, I didn't insult you, so I'm sorry that you're sensitivity was aroused, I would think that after 10 years in Korea, and especially considering the topic of discussion, that your skin would be a little thicker.

At any rate, I get the feeling that deep down, you understand what I'm saying, but being as you are the ultimate apologist on this board, I sometimes get the feeling you post your contrariness just for the sake of argument.

So, that's wonderful that you are so connected (or at least believe to be) to this foriegn culture, even though it's clear to me that there are elements of this place, these people, and this culture, that you clearly fail to understand.

You know what they say; "Ignorance is bliss", and in your situation that is clearly the case.

I won't engage further with you on this topic, as it's a redundant waste of time, and I do not have endless hours to sit around and troll an ESL forum, unlike some other people. I just hope to counter some of what I deem to be "misinformation" on occasion, as some people might not be able to decipher the rhetoric that commonly gets splayed across this forum.

And just when I thought there was no one who could hold a candle to your superieority, I find that there is someone, so kudos to your brother for having achieved that same feat of multi-culturalism as yourself, it must be genetic......

Good luck Pat.

[PatrickGHBusan]

Sigh...

I did ot say you insulted me. I said we should avoid resorting to insults. You insulted someone else (the shut your piehole comment) but thats not my business.

I was wondering how long it would take you to pull out the apologist line.

Turns out it took you all of one reply! Well done you almost beat the record.

As for my understanding or lack of understanding of some part so Korean culture, I would not so arrogant to pretend that I completely understand that culture. I do know a fair bit about it having family ties to Korea and speaking the language. Bascially Korea and its culture have been an integral part of my life for the better part of 14 years, ya learn a thing or two in that time span right?

I am far from ignorant and you miss the critical point in my post here: I care about acceptance in the groups I mentionned (family, friends, work place and to an extent while we lived in Korea my local community (neighborhood)). I got that acceptance and that was enopugh for me. I do not care one iota about the rest. I do not need acceptance from them do you?

My Korean in-laws are fully accepting and I am not ignorant or blind to this. I have proof of it through a decade of interaction in their own language. The way they treated me and interacted with me, the way they involved me in family events and decisions (funerals, ancestors ceremony, weddings, graduations...). My nieces are not giving me fake affection either and do not treat me as a foreigner, they treat and see me as their uncle (gomo bu). My brother in law and I went fishing, hiking, camping....

As for friends, how do I know I am accepted by them? Heck...dinners, vacations, invitations to weddings, visits in Canada since we moved here, open house at their place when we visit. Thats acceptance on the smaller group level and that is what is important to me.

My brother and I achieved no feat we took it as it came and adapted and thrived in another culture. Thrived does not mean love everything about it, far from it.

The thing is here that you and I are saying the same thing on many levels but that there seems to be a big difference: you seem to care about acceptance or lack thereof on a national scale (laws, status, what a random Korean thinks of you when he sees you) while I do not care about this random Koreans thoughts of me and kind of dediced that in Korea my status was foreign resident. That was no big deal to me because I had a full social life in Korea with family and friends.

That in no way makes me better or superior to anyone (that is YOUR interpretation and your attempt to be provocative). It is my experience and opinion and on this particular issue it differs from yours on some levels. That does not make me ignorant, blind or an apologist even if you freely tossed these in your reply.

As for not reading your responde, I did read it and responded to IT.

Best of luck to you out there Netz. I hope you find this magical land of full acceptance out there, just follow the yellow brick road or click your heels together 3 times...it may just happen. (yeah that was a bit insulting, but after being called ignorant, blind or an apologist I figured I would respond in kind).