|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
akcrono
Joined: 11 Mar 2010
|
 Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:41 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| myenglishisno wrote: |
I'm not an edutainer and resent it when I get bullied into acting like one. I try to be a teacher. Sometimes, I'm respected for this, other times I'm not. In Korea I find that if you're working in a good hagwon or a public school, they want you to be a real teacher more or less. When I was working in Japan, it was constant: "sing more!" "Dance more!" "BE GENKI!!!" "Why aren't you genki?" "Here, wear this costume!" "SMILE!"
I think teaching in Korea can be like this too but they don't force it on you which is nice.
I have noticed a trend amongst foreign teachers to kind of fall into being edutainers naturally. Like, they think if the kids are smiling, laughing and happy than the class is going well. They think that if the class flows nicely and everything fits together well then it's a good class.
While these are good things, they don't have much bearing on how much the students are actually learning. You have to ask yourself after each class, are the children actually learning anything? Will they remember it? If not, you could be the best "edutainer" in the world and still fail miserably as a teacher.
Too many foreign teachers in Korea fall into this trap. Yes, being entertaining helps but it's secondary to the kids actually learning. |
It's actually primary, as kids who aren't interested (or motivated) won't learn. Read enough books on teaching (and have 2 parents who have been teachers for 70 years between the 2) to understand how important this is. Do not underestimate the value of being entertaining or you will not be an effective teacher. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
myenglishisno
Joined: 08 Mar 2011
Location: Geumchon
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| akcrono wrote: |
| myenglishisno wrote: |
I'm not an edutainer and resent it when I get bullied into acting like one. I try to be a teacher. Sometimes, I'm respected for this, other times I'm not. In Korea I find that if you're working in a good hagwon or a public school, they want you to be a real teacher more or less. When I was working in Japan, it was constant: "sing more!" "Dance more!" "BE GENKI!!!" "Why aren't you genki?" "Here, wear this costume!" "SMILE!"
I think teaching in Korea can be like this too but they don't force it on you which is nice.
I have noticed a trend amongst foreign teachers to kind of fall into being edutainers naturally. Like, they think if the kids are smiling, laughing and happy than the class is going well. They think that if the class flows nicely and everything fits together well then it's a good class.
While these are good things, they don't have much bearing on how much the students are actually learning. You have to ask yourself after each class, are the children actually learning anything? Will they remember it? If not, you could be the best "edutainer" in the world and still fail miserably as a teacher.
Too many foreign teachers in Korea fall into this trap. Yes, being entertaining helps but it's secondary to the kids actually learning. |
It's actually primary, as kids who aren't interested (or motivated) won't learn. Read enough books on teaching (and have 2 parents who have been teachers for 70 years between the 2) to understand how important this is. Do not underestimate the value of being entertaining or you will not be an effective teacher. |
You can be entertaining without being an edutainer, though. An edutainer is someone whose primary function is: "LOOK AT ME! AREN'T I SILLY?!"
I went to a class observation in a public middle school a few years ago where the foreigner came in with no lesson plan and started carrying on with the students for an hour. I think his original topic was animals in Africa but by the end of the class he was just chucking candies at the kids and running around wailing his arms and saying ridiculous stuff.
Everyone had a good time, including the teachers. Everyone thought it was funny. This guy probably had a great reputation at his school. But were the kids learning? Hell no. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
akcrono
Joined: 11 Mar 2010
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Pretty sure edutainer isn't a word (spell checker doesn't find it), therefore the definition is up to interpretation. Since its a combination of the 2 words, I would assume it to mean someone who is an educator and an entertainer (like Bill Nye), incorporating both and neglecting neither. What you're describing seems to be more of a clown with the title of "teacher". I sometimes feel like I'm being pushed in that direction and I have to sneak learning into my classes. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
alistaircandlin
Joined: 24 Sep 2004
Location: Seoul
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| myenglishisno wrote: |
I went to a class observation in a public middle school a few years ago where the foreigner came in with no lesson plan and started carrying on with the students for an hour. I think his original topic was animals in Africa but by the end of the class he was just chucking candies at the kids and running around wailing his arms and saying ridiculous stuff.
|
 The poor sod! Honestly people come here straight out of Uni, with little or no teaching experience, and they are expected to do a job that really needs a lot of guidance, and practice to do well. It's a tough think to run a big class effectively, and get all the students engaged. So he turns it into a circus, and everybody has fun. Understandably.
Doesn't the Korean government need to put in a better programme of training for public schools? I went to a SMOE training course last October, but the demo lessons were more like lessons in how not to teach - they'd just got some random teachers with a 'big' personalities who would yell at the kids non-stop for an hour to make it look like something was happening. They wouldn't even have passed a CELTA course, if they'd taught like that. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 5:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| As has been said many times on here already, the education authorities need to decide on the role of NETs before they start thinking of ways to train them. If they want young, cheap teaching assistants straight out of Uni, great, then make it clear to the KETs that they will expected to hold the hands of these people and decide when to use them best in the lesson. They should not be expected to write lesson plans or create materials. If the KETs are not up to this then the education authorities should be employing more experienced qualified NETS at a higher rate, who will co-teach literally and improve the performance of the KET into the bargain. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
myenglishisno
Joined: 08 Mar 2011
Location: Geumchon
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 6:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| As has been said many times on here already, the education authorities need to decide on the role of NETs before they start thinking of ways to train them. If they want young, cheap teaching assistants straight out of Uni, great, then make it clear to the KETs that they will expected to hold the hands of these people and decide when to use them best in the lesson. They should not be expected to write lesson plans or create materials. If the KETs are not up to this then the education authorities should be employing more experienced qualified NETS at a higher rate, who will co-teach literally and improve the performance of the KET into the bargain. |
They do this in Japan, almost %100.
When I went there, the company I was working for told me I wouldn't have as much control over the class as I did in Korea but instead I would be working alongside Japanese teachers and we would do everything from planning to teaching together (50/50). I was excited because I always thought this is the way it should be.
When I got there, they had me stand in the corner for 95% of the class and then I'd say the occassional sentence from the textbook out loud. Some classes I would say absolutely nothing, other classes I'd stand around for the entire class and only get to say "apple, apple, orange, orange."
I thought the job was a joke so I just mentally checked out and told myself I'd do it for a year and enjoy Japan. Then all the teachers I worked with started nitpicking every detail of my day there and reporting it back to my company. I got in big trouble for things like not speaking loud enough, looking bored, seeming uninterested, not being uber-genki and worst of all, one time my "co-teacher" didn't show up for 30 minutes so I started the lesson without him. I had absolutely no problems but it almost got me fired.
On top of this, the teachers refused to listen to any kind of corrections, feedback or input from the NET so they often taught the wrong English, or they taught English poorly, or they made up English because their English levels were terrible and all the NET could do was stand there and cringe. I corrected one of my co-teachers once in private and she gave me the look of death followed by a month of being ignored even more than usual.
They were basically looking for idiots that would somehow be inspired by doing a monkey's job and have enough ADHD to want to chase the kids around in the hallways between classes and even follow the kids to their other classes and sit in with them. The only work they had me doing outside of work was arts and crafts. Seriously. I was making English murals for the hallways.
I think this is one of the many reasons Japan's English level is so low. The NETs have zero responsibility and very few chances to speak English to the students. If Korea does this, then it's over.
For better or for worse, NETs should be responsible for at least 50% of the class (not at the KET's discretion as I've pointed out because it would lead to the NET being involved from 0-5%). Maybe it's cultural differences but what seems to happen when a teachers is told to lead the class and have the NET follow, then the NET ends up not being used at all. It's an epidemic in Japan and I'm sure it'd be the same here.
I think the Korean government knows this and it's the reasoning behind not putting any guidelines on the NET. The NET is supposed to make their own place in the school. It makes a weird kind of sense whether it's intentional or not. If a school gets a bad NET, at least a lot of English gets spoken around the students. If a school gets a good NET, then they might get a really good teacher that the kids will remember forever. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Savant
Joined: 25 May 2007
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 6:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| alistaircandlin wrote: |
| myenglishisno wrote: |
I went to a class observation in a public middle school a few years ago where the foreigner came in with no lesson plan and started carrying on with the students for an hour. I think his original topic was animals in Africa but by the end of the class he was just chucking candies at the kids and running around wailing his arms and saying ridiculous stuff.
|
It's a tough think to run a big class effectively, and get all the students engaged. So he turns it into a circus, and everybody has fun. Understandably. |
If only we [the NET] could be the ringmasters in said circus. Instead, a lot of us end up feeling like that person at the very bottom of the human pyramid act - holding everything together without support from anyone else. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 8:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| When I got there, they had me stand in the corner for 95% of the class and then I'd say the occassional sentence from the textbook out loud. Some classes I would say absolutely nothing, other classes I'd stand around for the entire class and only get to say "apple, apple, orange, orange |
So, as I said. if the KET isn't up to the task of using the inexperienced NET properly maybe they should pay a bit more moeny and employ someone who knows what they're doing without any help from the KET |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
myenglishisno
Joined: 08 Mar 2011
Location: Geumchon
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 09, 2011 8:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
So, as I said. if the KET isn't up to the task of using the inexperienced NET properly maybe they should pay a bit more moeny and employ someone who knows what they're doing without any help from the KET |
Or just train NETs in the current system.
An online course, testing, a system where experienced NETs observe new NETs regularly and give them feedback as well as evaluate their performance. A system where NETs can pool their resources. Imagine if every area had like a head NET that was in charge of the other NETs and they met regularly (during work hours) to help each other out and the head NET was to report to a higher body of other foreign teachers responsible for that particular area and so on. That way they'd be organized and wouldn't feel entirely isolated and ignored.
Imagine an open ended national curriculum for NETs with concrete goals, performance feedback and plenty of room for creativity. They don't need people with teaching degrees from Western countries for this. Part of the reason most NETs end up being "edutainers" is because the students themselves aren't evaluated on anything the NET teaches. It's a bird course. If the students were tested on it and the class actually mattered, then the classes would be a dozen times more effective.
Right now the system is a bit ridiculous in that there is nothing. No curriculum, no feedback, no support... just nothing. You an be a NET for five years and they don't expect anything more from you at the end and the only real standards are those you set for yourself. Just look like you're trying and they'll leave you alone.
Even though this system would be a lot stricter and could cost some NETs their job (you could get fired if you consistently suck -- boohoohoo) it would be much better for everyone, overall, especially the kids.
Anyway, they have a NET in more than half of the country's schools yet there are no curriculums, no communication and no real guidelines for how the NET should operate so most people just end up doing their own thing. If Korea is serious about this they need to start being serious about this  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
alistaircandlin
Joined: 24 Sep 2004
Location: Seoul
|
| Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 10:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| As has been said many times on here already, the education authorities need to decide on the role of NETs before they start thinking of ways to train them. |
I totally agree with this: I think the lack of clarity of the role of the NET, is the cause of many problems with relationships between Korean and Foreign teachers. There really should be some guidance on exactly what each person is supposed to do. In practice it is left up to the individual.
| myenglishisno wrote: |
Or just train NETs in the current system.
An online course, testing, a system where experienced NETs observe new NETs regularly and give them feedback as well as evaluate their performance. A system where NETs can pool their resources. Imagine if every area had like a head NET that was in charge of the other NETs and they met regularly (during work hours) to help each other out and the head NET was to report to a higher body of other foreign teachers responsible for that particular area and so on. That way they'd be organized and wouldn't feel entirely isolated and ignored. |
Yeah, I think this is more realistic than getting qualified teachers and paying extra for them - I think they would have to pay a much higher salary to entice teachers over, as they would miss the yearly pay increase, the opportunities for advancement, and the depth they can go into with their subject, that are possible in their own country.
Although having said that, I'm qualified as an English teacher myself and have experience teaching in England, yet I quit my job there to come back here. Some of the reasons I did that though are: that my wife is Korean, that the job is less stressful, and allows me more time to write, and that we can actually save money in Korea, because we can both work as teachers. I think for teachers whose spouse is not Korean, or is not a teacher, the idea of quitting their job to come over here is not so attractive. Plus, for me the idea of living elsewhere, wherever that is, is always tempting. There were some things we missed about Korea when we were back in the U.K.
So I think myenglishisno's idea is more realistic. I work for the Gangnam public school system, which for some reason is separate from SMOE, and they do have a professional training programme in place there. I think the guy who is in charge of it is very good, and gives useful advice on how to improve one's teaching. I don't really see why SMOE cannot do the same - things like observing other teachers, writing reflective journals online, having a discussion group with other teachers etc etc., as you already suggested above. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
