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madoka
Joined: 27 Mar 2008
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 Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:34 am Post subject: One thing I miss about Korea |
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In Korea, I'd see about one, maybe two beggars a week. And they were usually the obviously elderly/handicapped/missing limbs variety. There were generally very few aggressive beggars/panhandlers.
Now that I'm back in California, I see perhaps 10 beggars any given day and all of them are physically healthy and of working age. They are on the offramps and onramps holding signs. Some will wash my windshield despite my pleas that I just got my car detailed and will expect me to pay them for messing up my clean car. They wait next to ATMs. I had a beggar come inside a restaurant I was in and ask for a slice of my pizza and threatened to spit on my food if I didn't comply. I once saw a woman sitting with her two young kids begging for food for them. Her kids were both eating Dove ice cream bars at the time. This past week, I was sitting in a cafe and a woman, who was holding a Starbucks frap in one hand, went table to table asking people for spare change so she could buy a sandwich. When I left the cafe, two more beggars approached me before I could get to my car. I was at a gas station this past month and the guy next to me in a Honda Civic asked me for money for gas.
Good grief. Is this what the U.S. is coming to? |
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nero
Joined: 11 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:51 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, this was one thing that horrified me about the US. There were so many frightening and aggressive homeless people, especially in San Francisco. I didn't see that in the other western countries I have visited (Australia, NZ) or even SE Asia. Perhaps this is because Aus and NZ are welfare states? The only homeless people I saw in those two countries had obvious mental problems. The government gives low/no income earners housing in NZ.
I can't speak for England, Ireland, SA or Canada, but Korea and Japan have a far worse homeless situation than NZ. |
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Sticks
Joined: 13 Mar 2011
Location: Seoul, Korea
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 12:36 am Post subject: |
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| Yep, they hand out welfare like paper in Australia, free housing for the really disadvantaged, $500/fortnight for dole bludgers (purposely not working), one off payments of $5500 spread over 24 weeks for each baby someone gives birth to. Hence you'll see little to no homeless people or beggars in main cities, certainly not to the extent of cities in America. |
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Triban
Joined: 14 Jul 2009
Location: Suwon Station
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:18 am Post subject: |
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I see like 5 homeless people everyday begging/passed out at Suwon Station. Some look infirm, some don't.
When I was a Chapel Hill, NC though...there were so many beggars that had no excuse. If you offered them food, they'd be like "Give me more."
That doesn't fly. I took what I gave them back. At Seoul Station a guy asked for money, I tried to give him 500원 because I never carry cash, and he refused because it wasn't enough!
The nerve of some people. I'll beg, but I will not be insulted by such a low offer.  |
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recessiontime
Joined: 21 Jun 2010
Location: Got avatar privileges nyahahaha
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:58 am Post subject: Re: One thing I miss about Korea |
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| madoka wrote: |
In Korea, I'd see about one, maybe two beggars a week. And they were usually the obviously elderly/handicapped/missing limbs variety. There were generally very few aggressive beggars/panhandlers.
Now that I'm back in California, I see perhaps 10 beggars any given day and all of them are physically healthy and of working age. They are on the offramps and onramps holding signs. Some will wash my windshield despite my pleas that I just got my car detailed and will expect me to pay them for messing up my clean car. They wait next to ATMs. I had a beggar come inside a restaurant I was in and ask for a slice of my pizza and threatened to spit on my food if I didn't comply. I once saw a woman sitting with her two young kids begging for food for them. Her kids were both eating Dove ice cream bars at the time. This past week, I was sitting in a cafe and a woman, who was holding a Starbucks frap in one hand, went table to table asking people for spare change so she could buy a sandwich. When I left the cafe, two more beggars approached me before I could get to my car. I was at a gas station this past month and the guy next to me in a Honda Civic asked me for money for gas.
Good grief. Is this what the U.S. is coming to? |
yes that is ridiculous. I saw maybe one amputee beggar in Korea and he was faking the entire thing by covering his lower half with a blanket and rope. I actually saw him a few days later in the same area walking around.
I live in Australia now and it's true that welfare gets handed out like water. It's about 900~1000 a month and it is very easy to qualify for it. Your parents can be wealthy and you can still qualify for it by claiming to be an 'independent' or get some doctor to say that you have a psychological illness or some other handicap. I know several Australians in my school getting student loans and welfare at the same time. They all easily acquired it by claiming to be disabled or living independently of their parents. The people that ask me for money on the street are typically kids 17~22 that are not homeless but think they can intimidate people into coughing up spare change.
In Canada I think welfare is a lot more difficult to access and even when you get it the average pay out is around 500~600 per month, not exactly enough to rent a place and eat unless you know how to game the system properly like some people that I know who live in big houses for welfare recipient and rent out the rooms under the table to students. The overall situation in Toronto where I lived was pretty terrible. There were homeless people on every street corner downtown. Whereas in Australia it is pretty rare to see homeless people unless they are illegal immigrants or something.
I know both Canada and Australia are nanny states but comparing them really is like night and day. I've seen beggars in Australia that are literally wearing better clothes than me and be stocking up for groceries and then proceed to ask me for some change the very next day in their usual spot in front of the post office.
Anyway, it's almost unbelievable that California has become such a cesspool. Can you tell us what part of Cali this happens in? |
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ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:38 am Post subject: |
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The number of beggars is primarily due to their success in getting money. In areas where the public gives generously to beggars you will get more beggars. If the public is too generous, people will choose begging over working. Welfare recipients can double dip and collect their government checks and work as beggars.
Stop giving and most of the beggars will get real jobs.
Americans are too generous: Too much giving to able-bodied slackers. Too much welfare for the non-needy.
OTOH, there are many homeless and individuals who are in need who are not beggars. |
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madoka
Joined: 27 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 11:12 am Post subject: Re: One thing I miss about Korea |
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| recessiontime wrote: |
Anyway, it's almost unbelievable that California has become such a cesspool. Can you tell us what part of Cali this happens in? |
Mostly Pasadena and Santa Monica, which are two fairly affluent areas. The gas station one happened in Ontario.
The Lake Ave. exit off the 210 in Pasadena usually has 3-6 beggars working seven days a week. One guy has been there for years. I estimate he makes $20 an hour and he is there early in the morning every day of the week to stake out his spot. During the recession, I didn't see anybody give him anything though. So all of a sudden, he rewrote his cardboard sign to claim that he was a veteran. Now that people are more generous, he's removed the veteran part. |
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cert43
Joined: 17 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:29 am Post subject: |
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Proabably all over Asia and many parts of Europe,too
Is this correct to assume? |
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tukmax
Joined: 06 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:44 am Post subject: |
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Freeloaders - Creating Dependency by John Stossel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4teq7aKTNJ4
You might enjoy this clip. This was the original freeloading segment by John Stossel he did several years ago. He has since came up with a new Freeloading segment.
New edition (different from old) hehe I love the part where Stossel dresses up as a begger and is wearing a 'Canada' sweater, lol.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OQjlzh279E part 1 |
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English Matt
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:53 am Post subject: Re: One thing I miss about Korea |
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| madoka wrote: |
| recessiontime wrote: |
Anyway, it's almost unbelievable that California has become such a cesspool. Can you tell us what part of Cali this happens in? |
Mostly Pasadena and Santa Monica, which are two fairly affluent areas. The gas station one happened in Ontario.
The Lake Ave. exit off the 210 in Pasadena usually has 3-6 beggars working seven days a week. One guy has been there for years. I estimate he makes $20 an hour and he is there early in the morning every day of the week to stake out his spot. During the recession, I didn't see anybody give him anything though. So all of a sudden, he rewrote his cardboard sign to claim that he was a veteran. Now that people are more generous, he's removed the veteran part. |
Homeless people make more than the median hourly wage in the US? Wow, that's my next move then. Who cares if I have to smell like I peed myself, risk getting beat up or set on fire, sacrifice my dignity, and be viewed by others (like the people on this thread) as sub-human.......it's not like sitting in a warm office with free coffee and cookies is easier than panhandling on the street in all weather is it...oh, wait a minute yes it is.
I am lazy as the next guy, but there is no way in hell I would choose to be on the street over any other alternative. |
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cert43
Joined: 17 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:58 am Post subject: |
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yeah
Last edited by cert43 on Mon Jul 04, 2011 7:19 am; edited 1 time in total |
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madoka
Joined: 27 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 10:13 am Post subject: Re: One thing I miss about Korea |
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| English Matt wrote: |
Homeless people make more than the median hourly wage in the US? Wow, that's my next move then. Who cares if I have to smell like I peed myself, risk getting beat up or set on fire, sacrifice my dignity, and be viewed by others (like the people on this thread) as sub-human.......it's not like sitting in a warm office with free coffee and cookies is easier than panhandling on the street in all weather is it...oh, wait a minute yes it is.
I am lazy as the next guy, but there is no way in hell I would choose to be on the street over any other alternative. |
The reason I brought up that particular guy is because he is the most successful (and hard-working) beggar I've ever encountered. He works seven days a week and his schedule seems to be from 7 AM to about 3 PM. He's in his late 30s to early forties, tall with a very slim build. He's in different clothes and shoes every time I see him. Today he was in a clean Hawaiian shirt and blue jeans. If you saw him on his corner, you may think he's just another pedestrian. In fact, he hides his sign inside a newspaper and only flashes when there is a new line-up of cars. He has a cooler full of drinks hidden nearby and I suspect his car is also close by. Judging by his hygiene and clothes, I also believe that he has a residence of some kind.
I do have a great deal of sympathy for the truly homeless. However, having worked with homeless people in a professional capacity and having watched him for near a decade, I know that this particular individual is there by choice. And I don't blame him. He works hard and makes good money on that corner. Hell, if I went broke, I daydreamed about how I am going to take that corner from him.  |
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RangerMcGreggor
Joined: 12 Jan 2011
Location: Somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:18 pm Post subject: Re: One thing I miss about Korea |
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| English Matt wrote: |
Homeless people make more than the median hourly wage in the US? . |
Most beggars aren't really "homeless" as we mostly think of them. Most real homeless people generally avoid the public |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 7:23 pm Post subject: |
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This is what really turned me off of San Francisco when I went last year. I arrived on a Friday night, and my first few days there (in the downtown/tourist areas) all I could see were tourists and homeless people. I seriously wondered where all the "normal" ppl had gotten to.
I did get the opportunity to talk to one really nice beggar. He noticed me doing laps around one block (looking for a store that had moved) and offered his advice. We eneded up chatting for a few minutes (with me dropping a few bucks) and I asked him about how such an apparently able-bodied, charming guy could be doing what he was doing.
He mentioned that the recession, plus a divorce and vengeful wife had cleaned him out. And now, with taxes, alimony, and child support, he was actually better off making cash from day to day. |
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Yaya
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 9:04 pm Post subject: |
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| I hear Scandinavia is the worst when it comes to giving money away to complete losers. |
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