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English Matt
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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 Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
| English Matt wrote: |
| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
I emailed Korean immigration in Ireland and they say I need the check from Ireland!?
This is getting ridiculous at this stage!
I guess I should just get the Irish one now based on this information, right? |
If the paperwork phases you then you shouldn't even bother leaving Ireland. It may be a bit of a pain, but it's so incredibly easy to get a job, that you should be thankful that the paperwork is the difficult bit and not the job hunt / interview.
From my own experience, applying for a work permit for Canada was more complicated, and even here in Germany (another EU state) it's a mountain of paperwork to get things like an apartment sorted out (something that will be taken care of for you in Korea) and once you find a job there is another ton of paperwork almost equivalent to the process in Korea.
You can apply for a subject access request (essentially a criminal record check) via mail from the police force of the area that you last lived in in the UK. Or you can spend a little more money and apply for the check (again via mail) from Disclosure Scotland (doesn't matter if you have never lived in Scotland).
http://www.met.police.uk/information/request_forms.htm
http://www.met.police.uk/information/forms/3019.pdf
http://www.disclosurescotland.co.uk/
http://www.disclosurescotland.co.uk/request/ |
With respect, Matt, my situation is a little more complicated in that I have not resided in the UK for any meaningful length of time since I was a one year old baba.
This obviously creates a number of complications.
Disclosure Scotland only accept online applications if you've resided in the UK in the previous 12 months. The postal application process is hideously time consuming and costly to boot.
Then there is the issue of the notarisation and apostille: both of these have to be done in the UK -- far from easy if you have no contacts in close proximity to Milton Keynes. 
So I don't think I'm being overly melodramatic when I display my displeasure at having to possibly trudge through this swamp of bureaucracy.
It's easy for those in uncomplicated situations to berate those who find themselves in more inauspicious circumstances.
Anyway, I'm going to get the Irish check and hope for the best. |
And with respect you are being whiny. I'm not in an uncomplicated situation, I had to get an apostille for my UK wedding certificate from the FCO in Milton Keynes and I live in Germany. It took a week to get it back. I also had to wait, 40 days I think it was, to get my SAR back from the police. I did not tell you to go the Disclosure Scotland route via the online application.....I am well aware that you need to have lived in the UK within the last 12 months, which is why I told you that you could apply via the post. Finally, spending a few hundred euros to get a job that provides you with free accommodation and the chance to save thousands of euros a year, when 1 in 3 men of your age in Ireland are unemployed is not a big ask...nor is it really that expensive.
Displeasure is one thing, but when you ask for people's advice in 1 post and then in the next seem ready to throw in the towel because you have to get a few papers together makes it difficult for people to sympathise with you and you come across as a tad entitled.
Please remember that everybody on this board has had to go through the same process....and in fact for Canadians and Americans things have become a lot more complicated over the last couple of years.
Finally, why don't you just get yourself an Irish passport.....you've lived there long enough. Heck, I've never even visited Ireland and I have one!
Last edited by English Matt on Thu Jul 07, 2011 12:02 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Gorf
Joined: 25 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 2:01 pm Post subject: |
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| If this is so grating then you might just want to stay home, you've got it easy compared to most Americans and South Africans, even with your current situation. |
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Weetabix TEFL Certified
Joined: 25 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 4:14 pm Post subject: |
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| English Matt wrote: |
| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
| English Matt wrote: |
| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
I emailed Korean immigration in Ireland and they say I need the check from Ireland!?
This is getting ridiculous at this stage!
I guess I should just get the Irish one now based on this information, right? |
If the paperwork phases you then you shouldn't even bother leaving Ireland. It may be a bit of a pain, but it's so incredibly easy to get a job, that you should be thankful that the paperwork is the difficult bit and not the job hunt / interview.
From my own experience, applying for a work permit for Canada was more complicated, and even here in Germany (another EU state) it's a mountain of paperwork to get things like an apartment sorted out (something that will be taken care of for you in Korea) and once you find a job there is another ton of paperwork almost equivalent to the process in Korea.
You can apply for a subject access request (essentially a criminal record check) via mail from the police force of the area that you last lived in in the UK. Or you can spend a little more money and apply for the check (again via mail) from Disclosure Scotland (doesn't matter if you have never lived in Scotland).
http://www.met.police.uk/information/request_forms.htm
http://www.met.police.uk/information/forms/3019.pdf
http://www.disclosurescotland.co.uk/
http://www.disclosurescotland.co.uk/request/ |
With respect, Matt, my situation is a little more complicated in that I have not resided in the UK for any meaningful length of time since I was a one year old baba.
This obviously creates a number of complications.
Disclosure Scotland only accept online applications if you've resided in the UK in the previous 12 months. The postal application process is hideously time consuming and costly to boot.
Then there is the issue of the notarisation and apostille: both of these have to be done in the UK -- far from easy if you have no contacts in close proximity to Milton Keynes.
So I don't think I'm being overly melodramatic when I display my displeasure at having to possibly trudge through this swamp of bureaucracy.
It's easy for those in uncomplicated situations to berate those who find themselves in more inauspicious circumstances.
Anyway, I'm going to get the Irish check and hope for the best. |
And with respect you are being whiny. I'm not in an uncomplicated section, I had to get an apostille for my UK wedding certificate from the FCO in Milton Keynes and I live in Germany. It took a week to get it back. I also had to wait, 40 days I think it was, to get my SAR back from the police. I did not tell you to go the Disclosure Scotland route via the online application.....I am well aware that you need to have lived in the UK within the last 12 months, which is why I told you that you could apply via the post. Finally, spending a few hundred euros to get a job that provides you with free accommodation and the chance to save thousands of euros a year, when 1 in 3 men of your age in Ireland are unemployed is not a big ask...nor is it really that expensive.
Displeasure is one thing, but when you ask for people's advice in 1 post and then in the next seem ready to throw in the towel because you have to get a few papers together makes it difficult for people to sympathise with you and you come across as a tad entitled.
Please remember that everybody on this board has had to go through the same process....and in fact for Canadians and Americans things have become a lot more complicated over the last couple of years.
Finally, why don't you just get yourself an Irish passport.....you've lived there long enough. Heck, I've never even visited Ireland and I have one! |
Matt,
I am whining not because I resent compiling the necessary documentation, but because it's both bizarre and nonsensical to get a criminal check done from a country you have never resided in for a meaningful length of time.
In fact, I would argue this policy is a dangerous one(if it's true): under this system I could be an arsonist with a reputation for cannibalism, but because of my squeaky clean UK record, I am at liberty to teach children in Korea!?!?
Regarding your last point: I don't have an Irish passport because I am not, nor do I ever intend to be, Irish. There is a crystal clear distinction between nationality and living in another country. Some teachers on here have lived in Korea for decades, does that make them Korean?
If you have difficulty comprehending this perhaps you should consider a career where teaching others isn't part of your obligations?
Yours truly,
Weetabix |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
<edited for brevity>
Matt,
I am whining not because I resent compiling the necessary documentation, but because it's both bizarre and nonsensical to get a criminal check done from a country you have never resided in for a meaningful length of time.
In fact, I would argue this policy is a dangerous one(if it's true): under this system I could be an arsonist with a reputation for cannibalism, but because of my squeaky clean UK record, I am at liberty to teach children in Korea!?!?
Regarding your last point: I don't have an Irish passport because I am not, nor do I ever intend to be, Irish. There is a crystal clear distinction between nationality and living in another country. Some teachers on here have lived in Korea for decades, does that make them Korean?
If you have difficulty comprehending this perhaps you should consider a career where teaching others isn't part of your obligations?
Yours truly,
Weetabix |
Seriously, you are whining.
The fact that immigration in Korea requires your check from your country of passport isn't going to change. Getting one from Ireland when you hold a British passport will get your application denied by K-immi when your visa confirmation number is applied for (and LONG BEFORE it ever gets to the Korean consulate for the visa application).
The fact that western logic is not used is something you have to get used to. This isn't Ireland, the UK or Kansas. You simply have 2 choices: 1) play by their rules or 2) stay home.
If you think things are somewhat different in other countries in Asia you are vastly mistaken. Compared to Korea the paperwork in Thailand (after your arrival) becomes onerous and expensive to say the least (including the visa cost, extension, work permits, medicals and reporting to the immigration office every 90 days.
Put your logic away, open your mind, get the paperwork done and come over or continue thinking like a westerner and you'll never make it onto the plane. Pick one cause they aren't about to change the rules to accommodate you.
Oh, and to respond to your comment about being, "an arsonist with a reputation for cannibalism," ... well, perhaps you should google "Christopher Paul Neil" (A teacher in Korea with a squeaky clean record in his home country that was on Interpol's 10 most wanted list for crimes against children in SE Asia). {the reason for this nonsense in the first place}.
The solution didn't fix the problem but does let the public in Korea sleep at night.
.
Last edited by ttompatz on Wed Jul 06, 2011 5:30 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Weetabix TEFL Certified
Joined: 25 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
<edited for brevity>
Matt,
I am whining not because I resent compiling the necessary documentation, but because it's both bizarre and nonsensical to get a criminal check done from a country you have never resided in for a meaningful length of time.
In fact, I would argue this policy is a dangerous one(if it's true): under this system I could be an arsonist with a reputation for cannibalism, but because of my squeaky clean UK record, I am at liberty to teach children in Korea!?!?
Regarding your last point: I don't have an Irish passport because I am not, nor do I ever intend to be, Irish. There is a crystal clear distinction between nationality and living in another country. Some teachers on here have lived in Korea for decades, does that make them Korean?
If you have difficulty comprehending this perhaps you should consider a career where teaching others isn't part of your obligations?
Yours truly,
Weetabix |
Seriously, you are whining.
The fact that immigration in Korea requires your check from your country of passport isn't going to change. Getting one from Ireland when you hold a British passport will get your application denied by K-immi when your visa confirmation number is applied for (and LONG BEFORE it ever gets to the Korean consulate for the visa application).
The fact that western logic is not used is something you have to get used to. This isn't Ireland, the UK or Kansas. You simply have 2 choices: 1) play by their rules or 2) stay home.
If you think things are somewhat different in other countries in Asia you are vastly mistaken. Compared to Korea the paperwork in Thailand (after your arrival) becomes onerous and expensive to say the least (including the visa cost, extension, work permits, medicals and reporting to the immigration office every 90 days.
Put your logic away, open your mind, get the paperwork done and come over or continue thinking like a westerner and you'll never make it onto the plane. Pick one cause they aren't about to change the rules to accommodate you.
. |
But I emailed the Korean embassy and they said the following:
"Dear [Weetabix],
If you have lived in Ireland for entire your life you will need to apply your criminal backgound check in Ireland.
Thank you."
This contradicts what you say, no?
All this conflicting information I'm getting is more than likely the reason I'm whinning somewhat. How can I proceed with the application if I don't know precisely which documents I even need? |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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Do what they tell you and when your application for a visa confirmation number is denied by immigration in Korea you can come back and ask what you really need to do.
I am certain my track record for advice regarding K-immi will stand up.
It has certainly withstood the test of time.
. |
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Weetabix TEFL Certified
Joined: 25 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
Do what they tell you and when your application for a visa confirmation number is denied by immigration in Korea you can come back and ask what you really need to do.
I am certain my track record for advice regarding K-immi will stand up.
It has certainly withstood the test of time.
. |
But how can the Korean embassy be wrong here!?
I don't want to question your record, but perhaps it's possible you might be wrong for once?
I just wish I knew for certain so I can get started with the application process!  |
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morrisonhotel
Joined: 18 Jul 2009
Location: Gyeonggi-do
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Look around this very website. You'll find ample examples of embassies not knowing their rear from their elbow. |
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Modernist
Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Location: The 90s
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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If I were you, I would strongly advise listening to ttompatz.
I have yet to see a case where his advice has been off-the-mark. He's been around ESL stuff in Asia for a lot longer than most on this board.
You should understand that what is said, what is written and what is actually done/expected here are rarely the same.
Even on my contract, with a PS, there must be at least a dozen things that have happened that flatly contravene what it says would happen. Most of them have been to my advantage so I don't say anything. That's what you have to get used to if you want to work here.
If you are going to insist on knowing precisely everything exactly at the beginning before you DO anything, you will be all set for a miserable time here, IF you get here at all.
FWIW, I agree that if you submit a CBC from Ireland along with an British passport you are asking for your application to be denied. |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
Do what they tell you and when your application for a visa confirmation number is denied by immigration in Korea you can come back and ask what you really need to do.
I am certain my track record for advice regarding K-immi will stand up.
It has certainly withstood the test of time.
. |
But how can the Korean embassy be wrong here!?
I don't want to question your record, but perhaps it's possible you might be wrong for once?
I just wish I knew for certain so I can get started with the application process! |
Is it possible that I am wrong = yes. I have been wrong in the past (all of about 6 times over some 13,000 posts and after about 8 years in the foreign help center in Seoul.)
Am I wrong this time = no.
The embassies abroad are NOT tied to immigration. (They are part of the foreign affairs ministry). They often give out misleading (WRONG) advice in regards to pre-authorization (visa confirmation number applications) for visas to Korea (and not just in regards to E2).
Korean immigration (the office here in Korea) are the ones who either approve or deny your visa confirmation number (before your application ever gets near a consulate or embassy for finalization).
Korean immigration WILL INSIST that your CBC is from the SAME country as your passport or they WILL deny your visa confirmation number application so you will never get to the embassy to apply for a visa.
Western logic does NOT come into play. Do it K-immi's way or you'll never get here.
. |
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English Matt
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 11:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
| English Matt wrote: |
| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
| English Matt wrote: |
| Weetabix TEFL Certified wrote: |
I emailed Korean immigration in Ireland and they say I need the check from Ireland!?
This is getting ridiculous at this stage!
I guess I should just get the Irish one now based on this information, right? |
If the paperwork phases you then you shouldn't even bother leaving Ireland. It may be a bit of a pain, but it's so incredibly easy to get a job, that you should be thankful that the paperwork is the difficult bit and not the job hunt / interview.
From my own experience, applying for a work permit for Canada was more complicated, and even here in Germany (another EU state) it's a mountain of paperwork to get things like an apartment sorted out (something that will be taken care of for you in Korea) and once you find a job there is another ton of paperwork almost equivalent to the process in Korea.
You can apply for a subject access request (essentially a criminal record check) via mail from the police force of the area that you last lived in in the UK. Or you can spend a little more money and apply for the check (again via mail) from Disclosure Scotland (doesn't matter if you have never lived in Scotland).
http://www.met.police.uk/information/request_forms.htm
http://www.met.police.uk/information/forms/3019.pdf
http://www.disclosurescotland.co.uk/
http://www.disclosurescotland.co.uk/request/ |
With respect, Matt, my situation is a little more complicated in that I have not resided in the UK for any meaningful length of time since I was a one year old baba.
This obviously creates a number of complications.
Disclosure Scotland only accept online applications if you've resided in the UK in the previous 12 months. The postal application process is hideously time consuming and costly to boot.
Then there is the issue of the notarisation and apostille: both of these have to be done in the UK -- far from easy if you have no contacts in close proximity to Milton Keynes.
So I don't think I'm being overly melodramatic when I display my displeasure at having to possibly trudge through this swamp of bureaucracy.
It's easy for those in uncomplicated situations to berate those who find themselves in more inauspicious circumstances.
Anyway, I'm going to get the Irish check and hope for the best. |
And with respect you are being whiny. I'm not in an uncomplicated situation. I had to get an apostille for my UK wedding certificate from the FCO in Milton Keynes and I live in Germany. It took a week to get it back. I also had to wait, 40 days I think it was, to get my SAR back from the police. I did not tell you to go the Disclosure Scotland route via the online application.....I am well aware that you need to have lived in the UK within the last 12 months, which is why I told you that you could apply via the post. Finally, spending a few hundred euros to get a job that provides you with free accommodation and the chance to save thousands of euros a year, when 1 in 3 men of your age in Ireland are unemployed is not a big ask...nor is it really that expensive.
Displeasure is one thing, but when you ask for people's advice in 1 post and then in the next seem ready to throw in the towel because you have to get a few papers together makes it difficult for people to sympathise with you and you come across as a tad entitled.
Please remember that everybody on this board has had to go through the same process....and in fact for Canadians and Americans things have become a lot more complicated over the last couple of years.
Finally, why don't you just get yourself an Irish passport.....you've lived there long enough. Heck, I've never even visited Ireland and I have one! |
Matt,
I am whining not because I resent compiling the necessary documentation, but because it's both bizarre and nonsensical to get a criminal check done from a country you have never resided in for a meaningful length of time.
In fact, I would argue this policy is a dangerous one(if it's true): under this system I could be an arsonist with a reputation for cannibalism, but because of my squeaky clean UK record, I am at liberty to teach children in Korea!?!?
Regarding your last point: I don't have an Irish passport because I am not, nor do I ever intend to be, Irish. There is a crystal clear distinction between nationality and living in another country. Some teachers on here have lived in Korea for decades, does that make them Korean?
If you have difficulty comprehending this perhaps you should consider a career where teaching others isn't part of your obligations?
Yours truly,
Weetabix |
At least you've admitted to whining......we're making progress 
Where did I say I am a teacher?
You live in Ireland as a permanent resident and have lived there long enough to obtain dual nationality, most teachers in Korea are not permanent residents and, even if they are, obtaining Korean citizenship requires the renunciation of one's original citizenship (in addition, from what I have read and heard it is very difficult to get a Korean passport even for those teachers married to Koreans)......that is a crystal clear distinction. I really don't see why you wouldn't want to have an Irish passport; there are no downsides to it. You do know that you're allowed to keep the UK one? Heck, if I stay long enough in Germany, I'll definitely apply for German citizenship.
Rather than moaning about the policy, as bizarre and nonsensical as you may find it, why not just accept the fact that Korea is not going to change it's policies because of you. Many of us agree with you that the procedure is flawed, but it is the way it is and you need to work within the framework that currently exists.
Man, if you got annoyed by this, I can't wait to see your reaction to the mandatory AIDS test after you arrive in Korea. |
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