Korean Job Discussion Forums

[julian_w]

Anyone know the names and locations of juvenile delinquent centers and prisons around Seoul?

Or, by any chance, the location of one Private Andre Michael Fisher?

[winterfall]

Not sure if this is a troll post. I'll bite. Most technical high schools function as Juvenile delinquent, alternate schools. Especially the lower level ones like Wigre and Seoul Northern Technical High School (They're drop out rates hover between 50- 70%). I've heard some of them even have programs with the local police departments. The precinct subsidizes part of the school's budget if they can bring down the delinquency rate of the students.

Then there's a special class of quasi-Juvenile delinquent schools, I've only heard of one. That's nearby Jamsil. Unusual since Jamsil's a very affluent area. (I interviewed a Korean teacher that worked there.) Can't remember the name of it though.

As far as I can figure, that juvenile delinquent school by Jamsil is in about the same condition as a bottom level technical high school. Terrible by korean standards. But the severity of the problems aren't on the same scale of what you'd find in a inner city school back home.

[Captain Corea]

[Koreadays]

[ttompatz]

A member of the US military is covered under SOFA and would not be in a Korean detention center and could NEVER be in a juvenile center.

He might get life in Leavenworth but he would never serve a day in a Korean Jail.

.

[radcon]

[nathanrutledge]

http://www.wnep.com/wnep-luz-hazleton-native-arrested-in-south-korea-20110708,0,2019089.story

Do you know him or something?

I find this situation hard to believe. First, I don't believe that the Army would just let one of their soldiers get sent to prison for no reason. Second, this is the culture of blood money. He couldn't pay the guy off to drop it? That tells me that there is more to the story - i.e. violence. Third, I don't see the Korean police beating a foreigner, especially a soldier, without justification. There is danger involved in that - other soldiers get involved, the US government/Korean government get into some arguments, etc...

The whole thing comes across as really sketchy to me.

As far as your question OP, there is a detention center by Munjeong/Ogeum station, there is a full fledged prison in the Anyang/Gunpo area. I only know those two as I've driven by them before (the one in Anyang has high walls/barbed wire/guard towers - serious prison. Songpa-gu is just fence with razor wire, it's only a holding center).

Anyway, what's your interest in this???

[julian_w]

It appears you might be right, 'radcon'.

According to his sister, he was unsure of the name of the place he was in when he was first taken there, but he was initially under the impression that it was some kind of 'juvenile detention center, possibly for juveniles' - her words, and as far as i know, his - but then again she said that he'd also found out that he was in with rapists and murderers. ... I guess that's possible in a juvenile correction facility, but it really sounds more like one of the big three.

According to the nice and helpful Chun Yoh-hannah at the Expat. Help Center English language phone service in Seoul, (phone 02120 x9, x1) the big three are:
- Yeongdeungpo Prison, in Gocheok Dong, in Guro Gu,
- Sungdong Prison, in Garak 2 Dong, in Songpa Gu, and
- Seoul Prison, which is actually in Poil Dong, in Euiwang, in Gyeonggi Do.

The next question is, in which of these three are they hiding him? The good Yoh-hannah actually phoned the Korean Correctional Service for me and translated between us, and we found that there were no 'Fisher's listed, but three 'Andre's, but she didn't get to saying which one.

Oh, to answer Captain Corea's implied question, yeah, he was convicted of stealing w88,000 from somewhere. Two years seems a bit harsh to me too, so i'm guessing it was supposed to be some kind of what we in NZ would call an aggravated robbery or something involving a bit of threat of, or actual, violence, but this clip and news piece doesn't go into any of that. It does mention some bad quality sort of CCTV footage, but not whether it is conclusive. His family are completely convinced that he could in no way be considered guilty.

It's hard to say how convincing the CCTV clip is without seeing it and knowing the gears he or anyone else in the area was wearing of course, and it's hard to know the opinions and attitudes of the powers that be in the military. They seem to have been quite quiet about it, but i'm guessing that their hands are politically tied by the updated SOFA agreement that radcon was talking about.

It seems a taxi driver just walked up on the street and pointed him out. I'm guessing that as he was off base and in mufti/ out of uniform at the time, the military brass have no recourse or control, and cannot critique the quality of the 'evidence' which might well have been the taxi driver himself (herself?) dressed in a hoody... Who knows?

This is the 'original' news piece:
http://www.wnep.com/wnep-luz-hazleton-native-arrested-in-south-korea-20110708,0,2019089.story

This is the facebook support group-type thing:
http://www.facebook.com/groups/fishercominghome#!/groups/fishercominghome?id=219839688052559&notif_t=group_activity

[alwaysbeclosing100]

[CentralCali]

Bears reposting:

[northway]

[julian_w]

Thanks for your interest, everyone.

It looks like you're right, 'northway.' Latest word from his sister is that his friends said it's called something like 'Seoul Detention Center.' I guess that's just the euphamism within the translation for Seoul Prison, and your spelling for the location is fair too.

@ Nathan Rutledge:
my interest stems from a number of different things, most recently is having learned of various other examples of foreigners encountering issues with Korean taxi drivers, and then again, other foreigners having various experiences with the Korean court system. I think the western/ New Zealand law systems are imperfect tools, too, however, having a fairly extensive personal experience of different levels of the Korean and New Zealand education systems, it does make me wonder. Finally, i've long had an interest in social justice issues. Is this a social justice issue? I'm still interested in finding out more about it, which is why i'm asking initial questions hopefully leading towards being more informed. And, i agree with those who suggest that there seems to be a bit of information missing within the news reports. The whole thing seems strange.

Underpinning all of that, though, is just a pretty basic hope that the guy will be treated fairly while he's inside.
There's a pretty famous saying in Aotearoa/ New Zealand which goes something like this:
"If you should ask me what is most important, i would say 'It is people, it is people, and it is people.'"
(... It might sound a bit plain and unimpressive now reading it in English. It sounds heaps better spoken in Maori.)

[Koreadays]

[julian_w]

Yep, that's right 'koreadays'. Just heard from both the sister and the information service person again. The latter said that there is no 'Seoul Prison', and said those facing time for final convictions go to a 'Kyodo Seo', but those awaiting final conviction remain 'detained' in a 'Guchi Seo'.

Andre's sister mentioned that there is an appeal date set for August 9th, so that also fits. Ergo, he must be in 'Seoul Guchi Seo' in Poil Dong, Euiwang, Gyounggi Do.

Thanks for all the tips, information, and interest.

[northway]

I'm going to need more than a mother saying her kid couldn't possibly do anything wrong to assume there's massive injustice being perpetrated here.