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22 hours or 22 classes

 
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plchron



Joined: 26 Feb 2011
Location: Korea

PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 1:53 am    Post subject: 22 hours or 22 classes Reply with quote

is there something definitive or written down about what constitutes a class or a class hour? In my contract it says that i will get paid extra after 22 hours, not 22 classes. But for public schools does a class, legally or in the eyes of MOE, count as an hour?

Have any of you ever had this situation happen and what was the outcome? When did you start getting paid extra money? After 22 hours or 22 classes?
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koreatimes



Joined: 07 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 2:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A typical class will last from 40-50 minutes. Anything less, teach more often, anything more, teach less often. Then, expect overtime pay. If you are in Taiwan, it seems like you haven't worked one day yet in Korea. Is this correct?

Ask how long each class is, then ask how many classes. Get it straight from the school. Try to talk with the head English teacher. Since you said 22, I think you are looking at a public school job, and probably GEPIK (maybe EPIK). In this case, what they do is schedule you for 40 hours. So, even if you teach 22 classes, you are still expected to be at the school. Realize this for public schools. For private schools called hagwons, you will have more like 30 hours, but when you are done, you are done. Same rule applies, look at the workload.

When you become an experienced teacher you can negotiate along the way relative to workload. There isn't one rule that says a class is equal to 40 minutes or 1 hour. I once had a bunch of short 17-20 minute classes for elementary school students. Another school had 2 hour classes for one class in the morning. We treated it like 3 classes. I agreed to regular overtime, so my workload was about 27 classes a week. One class stopped showing up, but my pay was already set, so I continued to get the same amount each month relative to days off.
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schwa



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Yap

PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 3:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In public schools, one class (40, 45, or 50 minutes) equals one contractual teaching hour.

Re: hagwons. Some do the same but some count every minute. Theres no regulation. Ask & know before you sign.
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plchron



Joined: 26 Feb 2011
Location: Korea

PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i am already at orientation in korea. i got the same answer up uuntil yesterday when the person giving the lecture about regulations told us that some schools go by actual hours and some schools go by the one class equals one hour rule. i am wondering if anyone can provide a link to any specific moe policy that says it is based on numberof classes, not number of actual hours. i just want to make sure that my pay is straight and i dont have any ridiculus surprises in my paycheck
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koreatimes



Joined: 07 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
i am wondering if anyone can provide a link to any specific moe policy that says it is based on numberof classes, not number of actual hours. i just want to make sure that my pay is straight and i dont have any ridiculus surprises in my paycheck


THERE ISN'T ONE

You're going to have to work, get paid, and then evaluate. Did the work you do equal the amount you are getting paid? Your pay is relative to what you work, not hours, not class number.

I gave you a few guidelines before and I will show again:

Public school - 40 hours total, 22 classes usually means 40 minutes, with a lot of office time

Private school - 30 hours total, 5-6 classes a day, they usually push teachers to give 50 minutes, but if you get a cool hagwon they let you do whatever you want

As for overtime, consider it something public schools are NOT going to schedule unless they get extra funding. In which case, they might as well make it a regular thing. Private schools will ALWAYS try to ask you to do overtime. This is a constant tug of war with them to pay up for overtime, while they give excuses on pay day why it shouldn't be considered overtime. They will make you work less the following week usually to justify not paying you at the end of the month.

My approach to this is to not do overtime for 2 months. Chances are good you will have 2 different schedules, with different total number of hours. However you will still get paid the same for each month (in theory). So for example, you do 115 classes month 1 and 118 in month 2 (with 120 mentioned in the contract). You get your agreed monthly salary both months, and then during your 3rd month they ask you for overtime. You agree to it (28, 29, 31, 27 = 115). You want to get one hour overtime for week 3, right? They tell you that you only did 115 for the month. Ask them why you got paid the same for 115 and 118. Get it in their head you are paid monthly, not hourly for your work. Don't do overtime again until they understand it.

Simple logic on their part, they will see the quality of my classes go down if I am not being compensated properly. Same if I am being overworked.

If they make you sign anything at the end of month asking for the total number of hours you worked, don't put it. Simply write "received" and note any overtime hours. You do not work hourly for them, they owe you a month's salary. Hourly rates only apply to overtime.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

koreatimes wrote:
Quote:
i am wondering if anyone can provide a link to any specific moe policy that says it is based on numberof classes, not number of actual hours. i just want to make sure that my pay is straight and i dont have any ridiculus surprises in my paycheck


THERE ISN'T ONE

You're going to have to work, get paid, and then evaluate. Did the work you do equal the amount you are getting paid? Your pay is relative to what you work, not hours, not class number.

I gave you a few guidelines before and I will show again:

Public school - 40 hours total, 22 classes usually means 40 minutes, with a lot of office time

.


Only for elementary classes.
Middle school classes are 45 minutes and high school classes are 50 minutes.
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koreatimes



Joined: 07 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Middle school classes are 45 minutes and high school classes are 50 minutes.


Don't try to confuse the issue. This person is asking repeated questions. If you looked at my first post, I put 40-50. No need to attack me on one sentence when you didn't read the thread.

If they are worried about "45" minutes or "50" we can ease their mind then. I was simply addressing the worst case scenarios where they would be assigned 45 minutes or 50 minutes when they only needed to give 40. If they had a middle school or high school position, then they would have less to worry about.
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plchron



Joined: 26 Feb 2011
Location: Korea

PostPosted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 2:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK. thanks for the replies. Has anyone ever been screwed over and not gotten paid overtime for working more than 22 classes? What was the outcome. I had someone tell me that it just depends if they like me or not.
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koreatimes



Joined: 07 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

plchron wrote:
OK. thanks for the replies. Has anyone ever been screwed over and not gotten paid overtime for working more than 22 classes? What was the outcome. I had someone tell me that it just depends if they like me or not.


Generally, at a public school, you won't get screwed. However, your chances of doing extra overtime is low. If something comes up where you need to do overtime, it will more likely happen during summer or winter breaks. Usually, this time is called "deskwarming" a period where you are not even teaching 10 classes.

So, if you have a public school job, you are worrying about nothing.

If you have a unique case where a hagwon is asking you to teach only 22 classes, then by all means let me know so I can work for them.

Quote:
I had someone tell me that it just depends if they like me or not.


This is more for renewing your contract. They are programmed to work with you for the year. Then they can decide to ditch you.
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