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End of English, rise of Mandarin?
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northway



Joined: 05 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Juregen wrote:
creeper1 wrote:
Sigh. Not this retarded worry again.

Europe converses in English. This would be enough to cement it's status as world language.

English has Europe + USA + Canada + Australia + India.

English = completely dominant for the next 500 years AT LEAST.


What if the economic strength of China is greater than the collection of your countries, what will happen then?

Exactly.


China will still be selling their goods to English speakers.
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some waygug-in



Joined: 25 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 5:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess it needs to be said again:


I used to think China would become the next superpower and that mandarin would become the new "lingua-franca",


then I went there. Laughing


'nuff said.
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jurassic82



Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Location: Somewhere!!!!

PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

some waygug-in wrote:
I guess it needs to be said again:


I used to think China would become the next superpower and that mandarin would become the new "lingua-franca",


then I went there. Laughing


'nuff said.


Agreed. Has anybody even tried to study Mandarin. In order to read a newspaper or book in Chinese you have to have memorized over a few thousand Chinese Characters. There is no phonetic alphabet that one can learn and let's not even get into the tones. I am pretty confident that none of us will have to lose any sleep over our job security anytime in the near future. Plz. end this topic Twisted Evil
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aq8knyus



Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London

PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah I was trying to find out if reducing the emphasis on English and increasing the emphasis on Mandarin was becoming a trend within PS schools.

Whilst the subsequent discussion about the global status of the respective languages was interesting it was not really what I was after.
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thunderbird



Joined: 18 Aug 2009

PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

watcha talkin about how many chinese schools do ya see?
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jvalmer



Joined: 06 Jun 2003

PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

itistime wrote:
I tell my students that it would behoove them to be competitive
from a multilingual standpoint to learn either Chinese or Japanese.
We have a Japanese teacher at the school and I banter in Chinese
with some of the more educated pupils.

I think Japanese is not really that useful in the world perspective. Japan has hit it's peak and it's been on a flat-line for the last 20 years. Don't get me wrong, it will be one of the major players for the nest few generations, but that's all. It's basically the same level as Korean, or German, as far as usefulness.

Chinese may have potential to rival English, but English will be the language to learn, at least for westerners. Although I can see Chinese becoming the Asian language of commerce (like how it was a few hundred years ago), but if dealing with people outside of Asian it will have to be English.
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hari seldon



Joined: 05 Dec 2004
Location: Incheon

PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If Chinese is going to displace English as the lingua franca, then how come the Chinese are scrambling to learn English?
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litebear



Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Holland

PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jvalmer wrote:
itistime wrote:
I tell my students that it would behoove them to be competitive
from a multilingual standpoint to learn either Chinese or Japanese.
We have a Japanese teacher at the school and I banter in Chinese
with some of the more educated pupils.

I think Japanese is not really that useful in the world perspective. Japan has hit it's peak and it's been on a flat-line for the last 20 years. Don't get me wrong, it will be one of the major players for the nest few generations, but that's all. It's basically the same level as Korean, or German, as far as usefulness.

Chinese may have potential to rival English, but English will be the language to learn, at least for westerners. Although I can see Chinese becoming the Asian language of commerce (like how it was a few hundred years ago), but if dealing with people outside of Asian it will have to be English.


I don't think you can compare Korean and German in terms of usefulness. When applying for the jobs in Continental Europe being able to speak German well is an incredbily useful skill and occasionally a requirement.
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liveinkorea316



Joined: 20 Aug 2010
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 3:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You guys are forgetting that 60% of Korean words are actually of Chinese origin and students learn about 800 Chinese characters in highschool. I would not go so far as to say our jobs are safe because English is easier than Chinese...for Koreans...
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Redmosquito



Joined: 24 Aug 2011

PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Check out this report by Graddol for a pretty comprehensive discussion of the global position of English relative to other languages. http://www.britishcouncil.org/learning-research-englishnext.htm
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different



Joined: 22 May 2003

PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 3:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This isn't politically correct to say, but English is a more logical choice for an international language.

1) As has been pointed out, China's writing system is a pain in the ass.
2) English is a LOW-CONTEXT language, so people from different cultures don't have to get a feel for all sorts of cultural nuances in order to use English. It's a more straightforward tool.
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creeper1



Joined: 30 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want something to worry about look in the mirror and ask yourself this question - Am I an ESL bum? That is someone here getting drunk and pissing around without furthering his/her qualifications.

English will completely dominate. However, we also have to recognize that perhaps the boom time for EFL in Korea is peaking, or has already peaked. As the country develops more, more foreigners come here, standards for university jobs become more stringent, benefits for training school jobs become less generous. Market forces.

10 or 15 years ago as Korea's foreign trade was taking off and there was a shortage of really competent English speakers to work in this sector, English language skills were seen as an automatic passport to a good job and a better life. Now there are millions more university graduates than there were at that time and there are millions more reasonably competent English speakers than there were 10 years ago, but the number of jobs for them has not expanded correspondingly. As a result, English language skills are no longer seen as the automatic passport to a good job and a better life which they once were. This means that people are no longer willing to pay as much for classes, and the competition from the proliferation of English schools means that they no longer have to.

The day will come that being white and having any old degree will not suffice.

So eventually ESL bums will be kicked between the legs very hard. The price to pay for lazing around and wasting your time will be unemployment both in Korea and at home.

Laughing
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NohopeSeriously



Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Location: The Christian Right-Wing Educational Republic of Korea

PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 5:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

creeper1 wrote:
If you want something to worry about look in the mirror and ask yourself this question - Am I an ESL bum?


Thank goodness I can at least speak Korean and Russian! Razz
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aq8knyus



Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London

PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@creeper

So qualifications are 100% guaranteed to make you secure from unemployment?

The real world is a harsher place that you imagine, nothing secures you from unemployment. Just ask a former employee of Lehman�s.
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cincynate



Joined: 07 Jul 2009
Location: Jeju-do, South Korea

PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't forget that China has the most English speakers in the world. They don't mind doing business in English. English has been the dominate language for international commerce for quite some time. The west was the dominate force that started globalization. English will be the language of business for the long haul.

Quote:
What if the economic strength of China is greater than the collection of your countries, what will happen then?


That's just silly. China will never overtake that collection of countries. It will overtake the US, but not the west as a whole.
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