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ryleeys
Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Location: Columbia, MD
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 Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:07 am Post subject: Why do they think this is acceptable behavior? |
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Last night, I was out with the large foreigner contingent in Icheon... after having difficulties getting a night club to let a large group of foreigners in, we settled into one and had a good time. Then a group of the guys we were with started taking off their shirts and dancing rather crudely... That was bad enough, but then one of them started to advance on three Korean girls who were terrified... he was about to reach out and grab them in a disgusting sweaty embrace when I grabbed him and pushed him away. He kept trying to advance, but I pushed him away enough times that he got the idea and went back to making an ass out of himself with the other foreigners.
I don't see this as acceptable behavior in any country, much less when we are the guests. No wonder night clubs are reluctant to let foreigners in, when this is the type of behavior they see.
There are a group of guys here that routinely make rude comments and gestures to Korean girls (and then the incident last night) and they justify it by saying, "oh, they don't understand anyway."
Seriously, what the hell are these morons thinking? |
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just because
Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Location: Changwon - 4964
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:10 am Post subject: |
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| ryleeys wrote: |
| Seriously, what the hell are these morons thinking? |
I think the question should be not what are they thinking but are they thinking at all???
I know what you mean. Foreigners are idiots in the nightclubs here and no wonder the bouncers are reluctant to let us in. i know some of the motivation is to not upset the Korean guys too much but whenever i go to a nightclub, you'll sometimes see a foreigner that needs a good head kicking.
They just see and think the word nightclub and automatically think it is like the west where some places are no holds barred.
IMO, the nightclubs here suck big time anyway. |
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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:20 am Post subject: |
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I've never seen foreigners display this kind of behaviour. Then again, I'm not exactly a nightclub frequenter and never have been. Still, I really don't think your average drunk foreigner is any worse about forcing his attentions on poor defenseless girls than your average drunk ajossi.
So I really wish you wouldn't reduce your anecdote (which is worth posting anyway, but just as a story) to yet ANOTHER "Koreans treat foreigners rudely because we behave rudely as guests in their country" rant, which is overdone and unfair to the large majority of foreigners who behave quite nicely here. |
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phaedrus
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
Location: I'm comin' to get ya.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:26 am Post subject: |
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| Corporal wrote: |
I've never seen foreigners display this kind of behaviour. Then again, I'm not exactly a nightclub frequenter and never have been. Still, I really don't think your average drunk foreigner is any worse about forcing his attentions on poor defenseless girls than your average drunk ajossi.
So I really wish you wouldn't reduce your anecdote (which is worth posting anyway, but just as a story) to yet ANOTHER "Koreans treat foreigners rudely because we behave rudely as guests in their country" rant, which is overdone and unfair to the large majority of foreigners who behave quite nicely here. |
I would have to say a good percentage of all drunk people are asses.
I've had to endure too much attention from drunk Korean guys in the "whaddyr youuuu lookin' at" category. I don't feel I have to put up with this because I am in 'their' country. I'm actually in my wife's country.
On the other hand I agree 100% with ryleeys, and myself think that probably a higher percentage of foreigners that are in Korea exhibit inappropraite behavior like this than Korean's in Korea do. |
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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:30 am Post subject: |
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| phaedrus wrote: |
| and myself think that probably a higher percentage of foreigners that are in Korea exhibit inappropraite behavior like this than Korean's in Korea do. |
But whose fault is that?  It's a vicious circle: the vast majority of Koreans treat foreigners poorly, stare at them, laugh at them, poke at them like monkeys in the zoo...and every once in a while the less self-controlled among us foreigners lets loose and goes a little over the top...and all the Koreans who see it decide that all foreigners are drunken wild animals...and et cetera... |
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ryleeys
Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Location: Columbia, MD
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:36 am Post subject: |
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Well, I will point out that there was an issue with the foreign men behaving rudely to one of the foreign women that is new to Korea...
Also, there were a few ajoshis involved in the ridiculous dancing as well, but they weren't pushing themselves on any women.
@ Corporal
I'm not sure why everything I say, you feel the need to find something wrong with. Try this on for size: 2+3=5... am I wrong there too? At no point did I say that I thought Koreans were less rude than foreigners... This post was purely to discuss this one situation that occured on one evening... and low and behold, this ONE time the foreigners were behaving more rudely and outlandishly than the Koreans. I guess if I ever post anything about a single incident again, I should include a 50 page long list of disclaimers just for you. |
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phaedrus
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
Location: I'm comin' to get ya.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:36 am Post subject: |
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| Corporal wrote: |
| phaedrus wrote: |
| and myself think that probably a higher percentage of foreigners that are in Korea exhibit inappropraite behavior like this than Korean's in Korea do. |
But whose fault is that? It's a vicious circle: the vast majority of Koreans treat foreigners poorly, stare at them, laugh at them, poke at them like monkeys in the zoo...and every once in a while the less self-controlled among us foreigners lets loose and goes a little over the top...and all the Koreans who see it decide that all foreigners are drunken wild animals...and et cetera... |
I don't embrace strange women in bars because I feel that I'm in a zoo.
I think about though on a daily basis since there are so many hotties around, but my wife would get angry if I did. |
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just because
Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Location: Changwon - 4964
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:38 am Post subject: |
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| ryleeys wrote: |
| I guess if I ever post anything about a single incident again, I should include a 50 page long list of disclaimers just for you. |
Do you think that is a long enough for a know-it-all???? |
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FUBAR
Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Location: The Y.C.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:41 am Post subject: |
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| Corporal wrote: |
I've never seen foreigners display this kind of behaviour. Then again, I'm not exactly a nightclub frequenter and never have been. Still, I really don't think your average drunk foreigner is any worse about forcing his attentions on poor defenseless girls than your average drunk ajossi.
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You, yourself just said that you don't really go to Nightclubs. So, why the need to post on the topic? Are you just trying to attack Ryleeys, b/c he offended you in another post. You don't have to troll every thread on the site. |
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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:42 am Post subject: |
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Come on. Your post reeked of the same old "WHY do foreigners behave this way when we're guests in another country"? complaint. And I have to comment on this gem:
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| No wonder night clubs are reluctant to let foreigners in, when this is the type of behavior they see. |
So on the basis of a few rude GIs, Korean night clubs are justified in refusing admittance to all foreigners, no matter what color, sex, or profession? Gee, I wonder why foreigners come on Dave's ESL and complain about those sorts of things happening to them! It's like you're justifying their racism for them.
| ryleeys wrote: |
| I'm not sure why everything I say, you feel the need to find something wrong with. Try this on for size: 2+3=5... am I wrong there too? I guess if I ever post anything about a single incident again, I should include a 50 page long list of disclaimers just for you. |
Now you're just being whiny and childish. |
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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:44 am Post subject: |
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| FUBAR wrote: |
| You, yourself just said that you don't really go to Nightclubs. So, why the need to post on the topic? . |
Now now. Play nice. Work with the logic here. If you limited yourself to posting on topics about which you knew something...well, your post count would be even lower than it is. |
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ryleeys
Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Location: Columbia, MD
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:46 am Post subject: |
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Personally, I think your never ending nagging is childish...
I specifically did not mention the nationality of the foreigners involved as I don't want to single out a nationality. I also did specifically say that this was "unacceptable behavior in any country." However, I do believe that as guests anywhere, be it a home, a business, or a country, you should do your best not to offend the host.
As for this behaviour being used as justification for denying entry to foreigners, I should clarify that I do not support this, just I do understand the thinking behind it. |
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Homer
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:47 am Post subject: |
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Corp,
Now you are assuming they are just G.I.'s.....
They were drunk...they acted like pigs...it was wrong..end of story.
However the thread was about what Rylees experienced. Not about the way the drunk ajossis behave (many of them are no princes!).
I have seen this type of behavior on the part of foreigners (and koreans) on occasion and the culprit were not always G.I.'s, heck they were many teachers in the lot.
Sad but true. |
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Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:49 am Post subject: |
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I was hoping you would weigh in on this thread, Homer. Nice to see ya...  |
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ryleeys
Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Location: Columbia, MD
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| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:50 am Post subject: |
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Good point, I missed that thing about the GIs... Earlier in the night, we were at a bar and I had a rather engaging and excellent conversation with a GI. A very nice guy.
@ Corporal
In true diplomat fashion, I offer a truce. You leave me alone and I'll leave you alone. I don't really want to get into a flame war with you, all I ask is that when you feel the need to analyze my posts (in topics I being, everywhere else is fair game), you think twice and move along. I don't think that's too much to ask since we obviously have very different perspectives. |
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