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DingusKhan
Joined: 18 Aug 2009
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 Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:58 pm Post subject: |
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There's no need to be curt; I'm well aware of what an apostille is.
And I fail to see how me becoming a United States congressman will change South Korean immigration policy. |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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| DingusKhan wrote: |
There's no need to be curt; I'm well aware of what an apostille is.
And I fail to see how me becoming a United States congressman will change South Korean immigration policy. |
It won't change Korean policy (immigration or MOE) but you can work toward either having the US fix their problems at the FBI and secretary of state or abandon the apostille treaty (wouldn't be the first time the US has unilaterally reneged on or ignored an international treaty).
The problem isn't with Korea. The problem is with the broken US federal systems. Fix them and your problem goes away.
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bueblo
Joined: 04 Nov 2011
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| Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 3:20 am Post subject: |
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| I don't really mind the background check requirement, but the time it takes to get one AND have it apostilled is absolutely absurd. It's funny to see my account get charged for the background check and the apostille and then months pass before they even get around to sending it. |
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Julius
Joined: 27 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:17 am Post subject: |
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I know someone who got pressured into working without a visa because her apostille had not arrived and the recruiter threatened to give the job to someone else.
When her apostille had still not arrived 2 months later they said bye bye without paying her. |
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Ribena
Joined: 07 Apr 2011
Location: UK
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| Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 11:31 am Post subject: |
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| I agree with ttompatz, the British system is pretty streamlined in terms of the check and legalisation. If the American system was as speedy I doubt there would be as many complaints. |
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rollo
Joined: 10 May 2006
Location: China
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| Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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| howexactly is the British system streamlined? how could the U.s. make their system faster? |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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| rollo wrote: |
| howexactly is the British system streamlined? how could the U.s. make their system faster? |
I don't know if streamlined is the word to use. Certainly more efficient with better customer service possible (even if the UK is usually notorious for bad service from government agencies) and quicker for getting an apostille.
It might have something to do with the fact that the UK is used to legalizing documents for use abroad (primarily Europe), has been doing so for ages and the US isn't (most of the human traffic is inbound and not outbound).
How could the US make it faster = add staff to meet demand or streamline the processes if it is not a staff problem. It is not as though "tax dollars" are used to pay for it. It is on a cost recovery basis at the federal level.
If it is talking months to legalize a document for use abroad there is something broke in the US system. Even 3rd world countries (Thailand) can manage to do it by mail in a week (including postal delivery time) and if you are willing to pay ($40) for "rush" (as compared to regular - 7 day service - $10) can do it in a couple of hours over the counter.
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liveinkorea316
Joined: 20 Aug 2010
Location: South Korea
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| Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:20 pm Post subject: |
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You are wondering about the difference between getting the CBC in US/Canada and in NZ/Aust/UK? It's like night and day!
In NZ and Australia for example, my colleagues just print off an online form, sign it and post it home to the Internal Affairs Office with a credit card number and photocopy of the passport picutre page. Takes 15 minutes. Within a month a brand new CBC arrives in our office.
The problem is not in Korea, it is in Canada and the USA. |
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Ribena
Joined: 07 Apr 2011
Location: UK
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| Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 1:14 am Post subject: |
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| rollo wrote: |
| howexactly is the British system streamlined? how could the U.s. make their system faster? |
They have dedicated agencies for doing the criminal checks. Disclosure Scotland takes about 2 weeks to do a check and as has been mentioned the Foreign Office has a special department for doing the legalisation. They usually have a next day turn around on any documents that come in. |
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isitts
Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
There is always the option of lobbying YOUR government to do something about the cost and delay time to get documents from them.
That is the problem... it's not on the Korean side and most other countries don't have the delays or costs that Americans face.
Another solution might be to change your citizenship to somewhere other than the US. It would be just about as easy to accomplish as dealing with your own dysfunctional government services:) .
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Since when does any government care about the hardships of its expatriots? Also, the FBI can and does do background checks that take a week or two via digital prints (as anyone who has applied to work in the public schools in America knows), but you can't put an apostlille on that. Personally, I think the apostlille is a bigger pain than the CBC.
No one's arguing that this system is "broken" or at the very least stupid, but it's more an an unforeseen result of America seeing fit to separate state and federal government. It has nothing to do with other countries' governments "doing it right". Korea is part of the problem, too, as some countries have abondoned the FBI CBC and gone back to state checks.
No one on the international forums is even talking about the FBI CBC, an indication that it's not near the problem in other countries as it is in Korea.
But thank you for sharing your so called solutions. |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| isitts wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
There is always the option of lobbying YOUR government to do something about the cost and delay time to get documents from them.
That is the problem... it's not on the Korean side and most other countries don't have the delays or costs that Americans face.
Another solution might be to change your citizenship to somewhere other than the US. It would be just about as easy to accomplish as dealing with your own dysfunctional government services:) .
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Since when does any government care about the hardships of its expatriots? Also, the FBI can and does do background checks that take a week or two via digital prints (as anyone who has applied to work in the public schools in America knows), but you can't put an apostlille on that. Personally, I think the apostlille is a bigger pain than the CBC.
No one's arguing that this system is "broken" or at the very least stupid, but it's more an an unforeseen result of America seeing fit to separate state and federal government. It has nothing to do with other countries' governments "doing it right". Korea is part of the problem, too, as some countries have abondoned the FBI CBC and gone back to state checks.
No one on the international forums is even talking about the FBI CBC, an indication that it's not near the problem in other countries as it is in Korea.
But thank you for sharing your so called solutions. |
Sorry... but NONE of the countries who qualify for an E2 have gone back to the "state system". They all, with the exception of the US, have ONE system and ONE database for checks.
The apostille is the means by which documents are authenticated between countries as agreed to by international treaty. It beats the He!! out of the old method of piecework (differing from country to country) to authenticate a document for international use.
In the international forums it hasn't become an issue for discussion because very few countries have the problems that Americans have for getting documentation in order when they want to travel or work abroad.
In most places, other than the US, it is more difficult to get a passport than it is to get a police check or an apostille.
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young_clinton
Joined: 09 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 6:17 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="ttompatz"]
| DingusKhan wrote: |
The problem isn't with Korea. The problem is with the broken US federal systems. Fix them and your problem goes away.
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I agree partially with this, but the apostille requirement is a hassle for people overseas. Why isn't the FBI stamp sufficient? |
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isitts
Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 6:39 pm Post subject: |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
In the international forums it hasn't become an issue for discussion because very few countries have the problems that Americans have for getting documentation in order when they want to travel or work abroad.
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What? I'm talking about the other Dave's forums. The ones that contain all the other countries where Americans work.
How come when you ask about FBI CBCs on the Japan forum or Taiwan forum, the other expats don't know what you're talking about? |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:02 pm Post subject: |
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| isitts wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
In the international forums it hasn't become an issue for discussion because very few countries have the problems that Americans have for getting documentation in order when they want to travel or work abroad.
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What? I'm talking about the other Dave's forums. The ones that contain all the other countries where Americans work.
How come when you ask about FBI CBCs on the Japan forum or Taiwan forum, the other expats don't know what you're talking about? |
So was I (talking about Dave's International forums).
Japan doesn't need one (cbc) for the visa process - may be an employer requirement but since it is not for government use it won't need authentication (the apostille).
Taiwan isn't a member of the apostille treaty. They require you to have a CBC validated by their trade mission in the US if they ask for one (usually only needed for teachers with proper visas - not usually done by people working in buxibans.
| young_clinton wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
The problem isn't with Korea. The problem is with the broken US federal systems. Fix them and your problem goes away.
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I agree partially with this, but the apostille requirement is a hassle for people overseas. Why isn't the FBI stamp sufficient? |
Why would it be? It is not an internationally recognized stamp, document or organization. 97 countries to keep track of. It is easier to ask for an apostille than try to keep track of all the different government stamps from 97 countries hence the convention - one document that is internationally recognized.
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thebektionary
Joined: 11 May 2011
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| Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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| at least there's no more visa interview. that was so stupid. i'm from miami and the nearest embassy is in atlanta. that's a 15 hour drive and the flight is not cheap either. my boyfriend went to new york to get his and i went to d.c., because the flights were cheaper and we had free places to stay. |
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