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eventually
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
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 Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:09 pm Post subject: hogwans: certain doom? |
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so, naively, i walked right into working at a hogwan, and i can't get any information about the school from former teachers, as this one is a new private institute, still being built, etc.
should i be worried? what can i expect? have you ever worked at a hogwan and had a GOOD experience, or know anyone who has? at this point, i am going to plan for and expect the worst; that way, anything even remotely tolerable will be appreciated. :) |
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eventually
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
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| Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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| p.s. i haven't officially signed anything so if i should jump ship, now would be the time to throw me a personal flotation device, so to speak |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:33 pm Post subject: Re: hogwans: certain doom? |
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| eventually wrote: |
so, naively, i walked right into working at a hogwan, and i can't get any information about the school from former teachers, as this one is a new private institute, still being built, etc.
should i be worried? what can i expect? have you ever worked at a hogwan and had a GOOD experience, or know anyone who has? at this point, i am going to plan for and expect the worst; that way, anything even remotely tolerable will be appreciated.  |
Experienced teacher + new hagwan = possibly do-able.
"Experienced" hagwan operator + new teacher = may be possible.
New teacher + new hagwan = recipe for disaster.
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NYC_Gal 2.0
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| It really is risky if you don't do full-out research. I lucked out and found a really nice one. The only thing that would be better would be a university job with months on end of vacation. The vacation issue aside, I work 5 or 6 hours a day, have a boss that I adore, and like the job. I'm just a bit jealous of my husband when it's winter or summer vacation and he can stay in jammies all day. |
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myenglishisno
Joined: 08 Mar 2011
Location: Geumchon
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| Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 9:24 pm Post subject: Re: hogwans: certain doom? |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
New teacher + new hagwan = recipe for disaster.
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Happened in my first year and I've heard of it happening many times. The business usually fails and they blame you for everything. |
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eventually
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
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| Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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my only saving grace is that according to my contract, if i am voluntarily let go (i.e. i don't quit) i don't have to pay them anything (including original airfare/recruitment fees)
so, i will try it, see how it goes, and if it is a big disaster, i'll just find another job, yes? |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 10:58 pm Post subject: |
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| eventually wrote: |
my only saving grace is that according to my contract, if i am voluntarily let go (i.e. i don't quit) i don't have to pay them anything (including original airfare/recruitment fees)
so, i will try it, see how it goes, and if it is a big disaster, i'll just find another job, yes? |
Sure... no problem... just walk across the street and start a new job.
not
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young_clinton
Joined: 09 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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| eventually wrote: |
my only saving grace is that according to my contract, if i am voluntarily let go (i.e. i don't quit) i don't have to pay them anything (including original airfare/recruitment fees)
so, i will try it, see how it goes, and if it is a big disaster, i'll just find another job, yes? |
You're E2 Visa is tied to your job. It will not be so easy to legally get another job if this job blows up in your face. If you haven't sent off any documents to immigration yet for this job, maybe a public school job through a non-EPIK or GEPIK recruiter is best for you, OK? |
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ayahyaha
Joined: 04 Apr 2011
Location: Seoul, South Korea
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:39 am Post subject: |
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I took a job at a new hakwon (with a newbie hakwon owner) before I knew better. It was horrible. There were no students, and the few that we did have had parents who were constantly complaining about how their old hakwon was better. I was forced to wear a sash on the street corner and yell "Hello!" at any passing person with a child.
So I quit, and managed to find another job, but it was not easy. The director of the first school held my passport and diploma hostage because she was afraid I was going to pull a runner.
You *can* get another job if this one falls through, but you'll have to explain away the first job in order to get the second, and that will be very difficult. Your boss will blame you if business is bad, and then you won't get a reference. It will be rough and you will have to scramble and it will make you really annoyed at Korea. (I know, I did it.)
No-penalty contract, whatever. It means the owners know things could go south.
Why would you knowingly subject yourself to a very uncertain and possibly awful situation when you could get a job at umpteen other hakwons? At least you would know what you were getting into. |
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Julius
Joined: 27 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:42 am Post subject: Re: hogwans: certain doom? |
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| myenglishisno wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
New teacher + new hagwan = recipe for disaster.
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Happened in my first year and I've heard of it happening many times. The business usually fails and they blame you for everything. |
Koreans should have to pass a test before they attempt to own a hogwon and a foreigner.
Unfortunately in Korea you don't need any credentials to start your own business. The english trade is a free for all. |
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Swampfox10mm
Joined: 24 Mar 2011
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| Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 5:28 am Post subject: |
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Never work for a new school if you are totally new to Korea.
They often tend to go under fast... it happened to me. I joined a new school in my 2nd year here, and they went out of business just as I was ready to start. It really messed things up for me, and that was when paperwork for visas was not near the nightmare it is now.
Also, when the school isn't doing as good as they'd hoped, the first people to be blamed are often the foreigners. Sad, but true. |
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myenglishisno
Joined: 08 Mar 2011
Location: Geumchon
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| Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 6:45 am Post subject: Re: hogwans: certain doom? |
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| Julius wrote: |
Koreans should have to pass a test before they attempt to own a hogwon and a foreigner.
Unfortunately in Korea you don't need any credentials to start your own business. The english trade is a free for all. |
It's strange that there are no requirements for opening a school, yet the requirements for us for teaching in one are through the roof.
What's worse is that Korea has to be the only developed country in the world that doesn't allow foreign workers ownership of their own work visa. If we owned our visa, things like not getting paid and being totally screwed around would not happen because we could quit at any time without hassle or just work two part time jobs instead of one full time job.
It's a combination of these things that really make working here tough. You boss owns you, in a way.
If I had to choose between owning my visa and getting free airfare, I'd strongly consider the former.
| Swampfox10mm wrote: |
| Never work for a new school if you are totally new to Korea. |
I interviewed at a new school last year that I probably would've have signed on had I been abroad but having gone there in person, I'd never work there in a million years.
The owner told me that "foreigners can't be trusted and will run when work gets hard," which is why she'd hang onto their passwords, diplomas and even their ARC cards. I jokingly asked what if we needed those things and she said that she'd send an escort to go along with you so you wouldn't have to carry it. She also said she'd keep half of the paycheque for the first six months and return it as a lump sum in the end.
When I told her that those conditions were retarded (in politer terms) she scoffed at me. I told her flat out no, then a few months later she begged me to come work there because she needed my experience (read: her hagwon was failing/she had nothing but green teachers working in an expensive downtown hagwon with a moat running through the lobby).
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They often tend to go under fast... it happened to me. I joined a new school in my 2nd year here, and they went out of business just as I was ready to start. It really messed things up for me, and that was when paperwork for visas was not near the nightmare it is now.
Also, when the school isn't doing as good as they'd hoped, the first people to be blamed are often the foreigners. Sad, but true. |
Yup. Up until recently, not getting paid on account of this was so common that it happened to pretty much anybody that worked here for more than a couple years. People got stiffed on paycheques or not paid for months or not paid at all. I don't hear these stories as often now but awhile ago, it seemed that getting paid wasn't much beyond a possibility. |
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 2:21 am Post subject: Re: hogwans: certain doom? |
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| myenglishisno wrote: |
What's worse is that Korea has to be the only developed country in the world that doesn't allow foreign workers ownership of their own work visa. If we owned our visa, things like not getting paid and being totally screwed around would not happen because we could quit at any time without hassle or just work two part time jobs instead of one full time job.
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Well, now there's the D-10 visa. It gives you 3 months to find a new job.
(Trying to put the word out for this one. There's so little information about it here.) |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 4:13 am Post subject: Re: hogwans: certain doom? |
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| myenglishisno wrote: |
| It's strange that there are no requirements for opening a school, yet the requirements for us for teaching in one are through the roof. |
Untrue.
The requirements for a foreigner to legally work as a teacher are no different than those for a Korean (degree and clean record).
It is true that if you are American, proving the degree and clean record is a nightmare but that is because of the American system and NOT Korea.
| myenglishisno wrote: |
What's worse is that Korea has to be the only developed country in the world that doesn't allow foreign workers ownership of their own work visa. |
Again, untrue.
Those who immigrate and have a immigrant visa are free to change jobs in any of the developed countries (Canada - PR card, USA - green card) and Korea is no exception (F5).
Those on WORK visas (H1B) in the States as an example are TIED to their employer and are required to leave the country or pray for a change of status when their employment ends.
"The H-1B is a non-immigrant visa in the United States under the Immigration and Nationality Act, section 101(a)(15)(H). It allows U.S. employers to temporarily employ foreign workers in specialty occupations. If a foreign worker in H-1B status quits or is dismissed from the sponsoring employer, the worker must either apply for and be granted a change of status to another non-immigrant status, find another employer (subject to application for adjustment of status and/or change of visa), or leave the United States." - SAME AS AN E2.
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