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whiteshoes
Joined: 14 Apr 2009
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 Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:59 pm Post subject: Sorry AL Central |
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| Prince is hungry. |
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Ridiculous heart of the order. |
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Dodge7
Joined: 21 Oct 2011
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| Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:18 am Post subject: |
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still can't/won't beat the Indians.
GO TRIBE! |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:21 am Post subject: |
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As someone who was a Tiger's fan before it was cool (Listened live to Brandon Inge belt a game-winner of Troy Percival in record-AL losses 2003), I have to say this deal is a complete disaster. An utter abomination. Fielder will implode/explode the way nearly all pudgy sluggers do come 32-33 years of age. Cabrera and Peralta and Delmon Young on the left? Porcello and Fister will see their ERAs balloon.
Could have gotten Cliff Lee for less.
Tigers will have no speed outside of AJax and only him and Avila are good enough on defense (though Peralta is at least sure handed provided the ball is hit within 2 feet of him).
The Tigers are going to have a scary lineup and be even scarier in the field.
And what will they do when VMart comes back?
I smell Adam Dunn 2K12. |
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Porksta
Joined: 05 May 2011
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| Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:36 am Post subject: |
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| Isn't VMart a catcher? So they will put him in at catcher? |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:45 am Post subject: |
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| Porksta wrote: |
| Isn't VMart a catcher? So they will put him in at catcher? |
All_Star Avila's their starting catcher. VMart has essentially turned into a DH because of his weak arm, balky (now torn) knee, and the leeriness of having a 12.5 million/yr. 32-yr old guy play catcher. Martinez will only catch on an emergency basis from this point forward. Actually, scratch that. Brandon Inge is probably more likely to emergency catch than VMart at this stage.
Because of VMart's injury this isn't a problem now, but it will be a huge one later on.
The Tigers have 3 1B-DH types (4 if you count Delmon Young, ostensibly a LF). |
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whiteshoes
Joined: 14 Apr 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
As someone who was a Tiger's fan before it was cool (Listened live to Brandon Inge belt a game-winner of Troy Percival in record-AL losses 2003), I have to say this deal is a complete disaster. An utter abomination. Fielder will implode/explode the way nearly all pudgy sluggers do come 32-33 years of age. Cabrera and Peralta and Delmon Young on the left? Porcello and Fister will see their ERAs balloon.
Could have gotten Cliff Lee for less.
Tigers will have no speed outside of AJax and only him and Avila are good enough on defense (though Peralta is at least sure handed provided the ball is hit within 2 feet of him).
The Tigers are going to have a scary lineup and be even scarier in the field.
And what will they do when VMart comes back?
I smell Adam Dunn 2K12. |
Since when has it become cool to be a Tigers fan? I've been one my whole life, and I've never been cool.
So, let's say Prince does implode at 33, that's six years from now. If we wanted him, we had to give him a long term deal, getting an all-star for six years is pretty good.
I'll give you the problems with defense and speed. But those existed before we signed Prince.
By the time VMart comes back, I think one of those three (Miggy being the other) will have been traded.
To call him Adam Dunn 2012 is beyond ridiculous. Dunn's career BA is 39 points lower than Fielder's, and Dunn averages 60 more K's a year than Fielder does. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Since when has it become cool to be a Tigers fan? I've been one my whole life, and I've never been cool. |
The Buddy Bell-Trammell years saw all the fairweather fans leave. All the lamers cared about was the Wings or college football.
As for Prince the projections based on similar players are not that good, certainly not 214 million good. Talking .260-290 average and 25-35 HRs. That's not worth 214 million.
Think back to when we made it to the Series in 06. What did we have? A great rotation (Remember Zach Miner stepping up?) and solid defense. Inge was a vacuum cleaner at 3rd. All the Inge haters should watch video of him in '06 and compare to what we'll get in '12 and see what a difference that will make. Polanco, Casey, Pudge, and Grandy were all very solid and even Guillen still could play short.
Yes we get an all-star for 6 seasons, but what kind of all-star? Is it the all-star we need? Why the impulse buy? What are we going to do down the line when we need to sign Scherzer, Porcello, Avila, Boesch, Fister, so on to arbitration/extensions? Those five are absolutely essential to our continued success. Lose Fielder and we still contend. Lose those 5 and we're a lame version of the Sox.
I see Cabrera being more durable into old age than Fielder. He's not quite so pudgy. He projects more as a Frank Thomas or Jim Thome than Fielder's Mo Vaughn. Trading him would be ludicrous. VMart? Maybe if someone took him, but he wouldn't bring much in a return if he's coming off of injury and given his age unless he was packaged with a Smyly/Crosby level prospect.
| Quote: |
| To call him Adam Dunn 2012 is beyond ridiculous. Dunn's career BA is 39 points lower than Fielder's, and Dunn averages 60 more K's a year than Fielder does. |
Look at Adam Dunn's OPS in his prime. Compares similarly to Fielder's as well as his dWAR stats. Similar husky build. I will say that Fielder is certainly more talented and motivated, and was at a different stage in his career when he moved, but once again, 32 and suffers massive decline.
So now we have a team that has no set DP-combo up the middle. 4 IFs with atrocious range, a LF with atrocious range and two of our starters are GB pitchers. This spells disaster. Innings will be extended and our pitchers will be "off" mentally because of the defense. Come postseason their arms will get probably an extra game or twos worth of pitches in because of the extended innings. Same with the bullpen.
I hope I'm wrong. Hopefully Cabrera can somehow play 3rd. Hopefully Fielder doesn't start slow because of the league change. Hopefully those 280 lbs. on his kness don't cause one to buckle. Hopefully he defies previous trends for fat sluggers and is solid through all 9 years. Hopefully we can still have the money to retain our key pieces. Hopefully the pitchers don't get frustrated with having the worst IF defense in the MLB and their arms stay fresh. Hopefully all the egos gel.
That's a lot of hope this signing has attached to it. |
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 5:20 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| I see Cabrera being more durable into old age than Fielder. He's not quite so pudgy. He projects more as a Frank Thomas or Jim Thome than Fielder's Mo Vaughn. Trading him would be ludicrous. VMart? Maybe if someone took him, but he wouldn't bring much in a return if he's coming off of injury and given his age unless he was packaged with a Smyly/Crosby level prospect. |
Unless Steve Phillips gets hired somewhere, I'm guessing that Detroit would have to throw in at least $8 million or so to move VMart, and that won't even be possible until after this season. I really don't see how they're going to get away with having Fielder and Cabrera anchoring the corners. Rick Porcello's probably going to be a great buy-low candidate going into 2013 or 2014. |
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