|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
cdninkorea
Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Location: Seoul
|
 Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:10 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| Julius wrote: |
| "cannibalism used to be legal in Papua, so it must be OK" |
The difference is that with prostitution, both parties are consenting adults (and if they are not, the problem is not the selling of sex, but the slavery aspect of it). As George Carlin said, "why should it be illegal to sell your body when giving it away for free is legal?" (not an exact quote).
| AlastairKirby wrote: |
| But it would be political suicide for any leading scientist, policeman or politician to come out and say this. |
Ron Paul says it, and he's been elected to the US Congress something like a dozen times.
Last edited by cdninkorea on Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:11 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Swampfox10mm
Joined: 24 Mar 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| T-J wrote: |
I sincerely hope all involved that were in violation of their visas by participating in political activity are promptly deported.
|
Actually, I believe that foreigners are now allowed to take part in political activity (or the bill is in the works and soon will pass).
I'm sure that jailing and deporting a mass number of foreigners for something like this is exactly what the Korean gov't would just love to see on CNN International.
My guess is, whether or not people agree or disagree with it, they don't have anything to worry about by doing this. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Julius wrote: |
| alongway wrote: |
| there were other articles that had a shot of them walking down the street, all asian faces. |
Maybe some of the curmudgeons on here will no longer consider it stupid because it is koreans that are criticizing their own culture.
| Adventurer wrote: |
| I'm not endorsing prostitution by any means, but prostitution is legal in some Western states |
"cannibalism used to be legal in Papua, so it must be OK"
I find it refreshing that koreans are openly criticizing the dark side of their country instead of trying to hide it. |
Cannibalism is different than prostitution. There's no comparison.
If a woman or man chooses to become a prostitute, then it can't be compared to cannibalism. If Koreans want to get rid of prostitution, it's up to them. If someone is being sexually trafficked and cannot get out of the trade if he or she wants, that's another issue. When it's illegal, then you cannot really regulate it.
If you want to abolish prostitution and not simply making it illegal, I don't think it's truly possible, unless some Christian or Muslim Taliban takes over Korea and starts killing people to scare people into not engaging in such activity. However, it wouldn't eliminate it.
The protesters were disappointed the police in Korea didn't want to do much about this. However, this has long been an accepted part of the culture. The cops know about these places. They choose not to do anything because their political bosses don't want them to. Even if they do something, they'll do something symbolic as they always do to try to shut up protesters temporarily.
What about enforcing a ban on throwing those sex cards on the street so children don't see them and making sure there isn't trafficking of foreign and Korean girls?
If the Korean people want to remove all those massage parlors and what not and brothels, it's up to them. I have a feeling many of the protesters are disproportionately religious Protestants.
They don't seem to offer any kind of solution. Can you truly eliminate prostitution? I don't really know. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Julius
Joined: 27 Jul 2006
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 8:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Adventurer wrote: |
| They don't seem to offer any kind of solution. |
uhh....stay faithful to your wife?
Find a girlfriend?
Use your imagination, lol.
| cdninkorea wrote: |
| both parties are consenting adults |
thats hard to judge isn't it?
If some teenage girl is coerced or comes under strong pressure to work in order to pay of daddys gambling debt, is then saddled with indebtedness...or for lack of education has no other option..then...is that really voluntary?
No woman in the world wants to sleep with every male that walks by, and women want real jobs that do not degrade them. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="Julius"]
| Adventurer wrote: |
| They don't seem to offer any kind of solution. |
| Quote: |
uhh....stay faithful to your wife?
Find a girlfriend?
Use your imagination, lol.
|
You're assuming that everyone who goes to a brothel is cheating on someone or on their wife. You're not going to be able to stop people from cheating on their wives. Sorry, there is not a theological utopia in Korea. I knew a Korean fellow who went to a brothel. He found it to be very normal, and he was single. He wasn't cheating on someone. Some people will go to brothels while they're married just as some people have affairs.
I don't think you can eliminate prostitution unless you have a religious fundamentalist state, but that brings a whole host of other problems.
You mentioned that some girls are exploited. How about reducing the exploitation? If Korea's police force and government truly wants to enforce the law and stop prostitution, then that's fine. They can go ahead and do that. Why not stop the parlors from littering the street to where minors can see the fliers? Do you really think people can truly eliminate prostitution. I agree with the protesters regarding stopping places from littering the streets. Close them down, and if anyone is involved in human trafficking, send those responsible to jail for quite a long time. How about presenting something concrete like that? They didn't.
Some may argue when you force things underground it might get worse for the women, not better. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kberger
Joined: 22 Oct 2009
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Crude analogy, but I think this would be like a group of Korean college students studying in the USA going to the police and saying there are Mexican illegal immigrants doing some landscaping work. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ghostrider
Joined: 27 Jun 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Julius wrote: |
If some teenage girl is coerced or comes under strong pressure to work in order to pay of daddys gambling debt, is then saddled with indebtedness...or for lack of education has no other option..then...is that really voluntary?
|
Who's arguing that it should be legal to force a child into prostitution in order to pay off a debt? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ghostrider
Joined: 27 Jun 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Zulethe wrote: |
| What they should be protesting is the discriminatory practices of these so called prostitution rings. Many of them turn away foreigners. That really pisses me off. |
I don't think that it would make sense for a sex tourist to come to Korea (unless he wanted to experience what it was like for blacks in Alabama in the 1950s). Foreigners should boycott the prostitution industry in Korea. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dave Chance
Joined: 30 May 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ghostrider wrote: |
| Zulethe wrote: |
| What they should be protesting is the discriminatory practices of these so called prostitution rings. Many of them turn away foreigners. That really pisses me off. |
I don't think that it would make sense for a sex tourist to come to Korea (unless he wanted to experience what it was like for blacks in Alabama in the 1950s). Foreigners should boycott the prostitution industry in Korea. |
Somehow I don't think sex tourists really mind the exploitation aspect...
A Korean friend of mine told me in his neck of the woods the police use the threat of arrest as a bargaining chip for some "service" favors. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Swampfox10mm
Joined: 24 Mar 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Korea is, at least, attempting to make motions to remove prostitution. I am guessing that this has more to do with saving international face, as well as pushing sextrade areas like Yongsan out because the land is worth a heap of development money.
When it comes down to it, the "real" anti-prostitution efforts are all about real-estate. Even the big push to root out prostitution in Jangandong a few years back (which was somewhat successful, but not entirely) was openly advertised as a way to raise real-estate prices in the area.
It's all about what makes who more money. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ghostrider wrote: |
| Zulethe wrote: |
| What they should be protesting is the discriminatory practices of these so called prostitution rings. Many of them turn away foreigners. That really pisses me off. |
I don't think that it would make sense for a sex tourist to come to Korea (unless he wanted to experience what it was like for blacks in Alabama in the 1950s). Foreigners should boycott the prostitution industry in Korea. |
I remember a female complaining about how some instructors would go to brothels while they wouldn't in some of their countries. There's a stigma behind doing that in North America, but not in Korea. That's why some have a different attitude about it when they're here. For the record, I have never frequented a brothel, but I'm not here to judge mates who have done that. It's their life.
I agree with the person who said that having foreigners protesting about this rather than simply protesting about some who are trafficked sort of smacks of some puritanical lecturing of the cops.
It would be like Korean students who are on legal visas to the US insisting America deport illegal aliens from Mexico and China.
That would be viewed as bizarre. That's why some foreigners in these forums view this protest as bizarre. I don't think if someone chooses to be a prostitute that his or her human rights are being violated unless he or she is being trafficked. I'm not trying to encourage the trade and what not. I'm not for encouraging a practice that's illegal in Korea, and I prefer that prostitution be reduced and for less women to become prostitutes. I think it's connected to major sexism that has long flourished in the country.
Women are making many strides in this country, and that needs to be encouraged and prostitution should be discouraged, and it's not a real solution to have cops trying to arrest thousands of Korean Johns and prostitutes, IMHO. It would be a big mess. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Dave Chance wrote: |
| ghostrider wrote: |
| Zulethe wrote: |
| What they should be protesting is the discriminatory practices of these so called prostitution rings. Many of them turn away foreigners. That really pisses me off. |
I don't think that it would make sense for a sex tourist to come to Korea (unless he wanted to experience what it was like for blacks in Alabama in the 1950s). Foreigners should boycott the prostitution industry in Korea. |
Somehow I don't think sex tourists really mind the exploitation aspect...
A Korean friend of mine told me in his neck of the woods the police use the threat of arrest as a bargaining chip for some "service" favors. |
It doesn't make sense for a sex tourist to come to Korea for two reasons:
1) The sex industry is largely closed to foreigners.
2) Southeast Asia is infinitely cheaper. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
liveinkorea316
Joined: 20 Aug 2010
Location: South Korea
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
It is the political and religious conservatives who cannot budge from their principles to open their mind.
New Zealand and States in Australia have legalised prostitution. It was done because of specific causes in NZ. There was a spate of murders of prostitutes and just people near the prostitute district and the police got zero help from working girls. Furthermore police could not protect them from any further attacks because they avoided police at all costs.
That, on top of the usual sexual health and slavery and underage sex concerns led NZ to introduce the legalisation of prostitution in the early 2000's. The country has not become overrun with working girls. Brothels are registered businesses and have zoning restrictions so cannot be too near schools. Women can work from home if they want though.
Many people also call for legalisation of drugs for the same reason....I am still out on this one... but for prostitution....NZ didn't have the same problems as Korea probalby has though. Gangs were not involved. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Swampfox10mm
Joined: 24 Mar 2011
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Seriously, the sex is still there.
I've said it before....
A female very close to me has worked as a mid-level manager in various Korean and foreign companies over the years. Once you reach a certain level at some Korean companies, managers often receive a credit card meant to be used to "entertain clients" and the like. She actually has one now, but she uses it to buy lunch.
At some companies, what people charge on that card is (apparently) not questioned. It's just considered part of ones salary, but if you don't use it all that month -- you lose what's left for the month. I remember once she said a female friend of hers at another company used it for shopping, and that was OK as long as she didn't go over the limit.
This same female I know used to work for an international company that was trying to hire a new sales manager. They had a guy all picked out after several interviews, but when it got down to brass tacks, the guy ended-up not accepting the job. When pushed as to why, he said he needed a credit card with a credit line to be part of his pay. Her company, being a foreign one, didn't do that, and offered more salary instead -- EQUALING the total he asked for.
He declined.
What was the problem?
His wife (as in 60% of Korean homes these days) handled all of the finances, and he wouldn't be able to have any fun if he didn't have that card.
That being said, I think a lot of Americans would be in for a surprise if they knew the truth about the goings-on of some higher-level people in the USA, too.
As a gay friend of mine said once, "It's just far more titilating here, because they go to such lengths to try to hide it from the rest of the world." |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
alongway
Joined: 02 Jan 2012
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| As a gay friend of mine said once, "It's just far more titilating here, because they go to such lengths to try to hide it from the rest of the world." |
It's also about access by the viewers. Most of the people here have zero access back home. CEOs don't slum with what most people here would be doing back home, whatever that would be, low level positions, working at the fry hut or sports barn, etc.
here, the need to learn language crosses all levels, and you inevitably get some english teachers who end up teaching the CEOs, owners, and other higher up executives or even celebs and then start swapping stories.
In fact most people I know have at least 2-3 high-top level execs as students.
and if their students are very conversational most also have an interesting story or two.
I think that adds to at, at least in these discussions. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
