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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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 Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
Why? Because I don't like to hang out with people of a certain ilk? I generally try to avoid alcoholics as well. People who frequently do cocaine are low on my friend list too.
Is that really so strange?
Here's my reasoning... I grew up in a household of smokers/drinkers/druggies and lost many family members to them.
I don't want them to be a big part of my life.
But go on with your name calling. I'm sure that makes a heap more sense than actually asking me about my rationale. |
Well, your rationale paints every smoker as lame as you indicate your family to be, which is quite the generality. Sounds like a crippling way to live, but if painting everyone with your old, thin brush makes your world more colorful, then enjoy.
BTW, Regardless of why, you are only affirming my previous statements about your apparent character. You shouldn't make smokers carry your bags; they are victims too and what with their guaranteed shortened lives and slow but certain pending health problems, you should empathize, not judge. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
I'm sorry, but if you are "that guy" who doesn't have their money ready and is asking pointless questions to the clerk or spending 5 minutes deciding between Winterfresh and Juicyfruit then you are every bit a rude line person as the line jumper.
I've seen people do the "line jump exact change exchange" in less than 2 seconds. Meanwhile I've see these bumblers who get to the counter, spend 2 minutes fishing for their wallet, 1 minute deciding whether to use a 10 or a 5er and 3 ones to pay. Then reaching in for change in their pocket. (And its not like their hands had been full- in that case I understand) then chit-chatting to the guy behind the counter. What, just because you stood in line and waited your turn that doesn't make you a time waisting jerk? At that point darn right I'm going to plunk down 5 bucks for a pack and be in and out in 5 seconds.
The line rule applies as long as the person is not a snail and negligent in maintaining line efficiency. It's like driving. If you're going 5 miles an hour below the speed limit, don't whine when I pass you and then get through the tollbooth first with my RFID pass while you pull up to the gate and fish nickels out of the cup holder.
All I'm saying is that it depends on the circumstances. Why should someone have to wait a minute in line to do a 5 second transaction? Instead of waiting for a minute they are out in 5 seconds. Meanwhile the person engaged in a minute long transaction is delayed to a minute and 5 seconds. Which is better? |
Steelrails, I know you have Korean heritage, but really? Protect what is worth protecting man, but don't try to tell anyone here that the incessant line jumping (in the rare occasions when there actually is a line as opposed to a huddle) is cool. It's not.
Thread derailed.
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:23 am Post subject: |
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| Carbon wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
I'm sorry, but if you are "that guy" who doesn't have their money ready and is asking pointless questions to the clerk or spending 5 minutes deciding between Winterfresh and Juicyfruit then you are every bit a rude line person as the line jumper.
I've seen people do the "line jump exact change exchange" in less than 2 seconds. Meanwhile I've see these bumblers who get to the counter, spend 2 minutes fishing for their wallet, 1 minute deciding whether to use a 10 or a 5er and 3 ones to pay. Then reaching in for change in their pocket. (And its not like their hands had been full- in that case I understand) then chit-chatting to the guy behind the counter. What, just because you stood in line and waited your turn that doesn't make you a time waisting jerk? At that point darn right I'm going to plunk down 5 bucks for a pack and be in and out in 5 seconds.
The line rule applies as long as the person is not a snail and negligent in maintaining line efficiency. It's like driving. If you're going 5 miles an hour below the speed limit, don't whine when I pass you and then get through the tollbooth first with my RFID pass while you pull up to the gate and fish nickels out of the cup holder.
All I'm saying is that it depends on the circumstances. Why should someone have to wait a minute in line to do a 5 second transaction? Instead of waiting for a minute they are out in 5 seconds. Meanwhile the person engaged in a minute long transaction is delayed to a minute and 5 seconds. Which is better? |
Steelrails, I know you have Korean heritage, but really? Protect what is worth protecting man, but don't try to tell anyone here that the incessant line jumping (in the rare occasions when there actually is a line as opposed to a huddle) is cool. It's not.
Thread derailed.
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People jumped line back home as well at the corner store for a pack of smokes or a can of coke. People ran in and grabbed a 3 dollar 40 and slapped down three bucks or gave a nod for a newspaper and slapped down 50 cents. Or getting a loosey for 25 cent (50 these days...) It was bang bang and no one cared as long as you could tell the person ahead was taking their time and that you were going to be exact change, single item, in and out.
What, someone waiting for a single cigarette should wait 4 minutes for someone to spew out their lotto numbers?
It's called multi-tasking. While you're busy counting your money someone with exact change gets their smokes and when you have your money ready they're out the door.
Now I will object if the person starts to yik and yak and buy 5 different packs of smokes and demand a bag and a receipt. In that case tar and feather them for all I care. Get to the back of the line. But if its exact change and they're in and out in the blink of an eye, and I'm still peeling off Chun Wons out of the bankroll, then who cares? Its not like you've actually been delayed and another human being gets to get on with their life.
As I said, it depends on the situation. Have your money out and ready. Don't stare off stupidly into space once you've reached the counter, debating to yourself whether or not to get that pack of Mentos.
The problem here is that the marts have to scan everything and the clerks don't seem to be able to get the whole system going where they just scan another of the same item 2 minutes later after the line has died down.
I should amend things to if its a Mart that scans, then line-jumping is a foul because the scan is too long and too much of a delay. That whole scan and ring up thing is a good 10-15+ seconds. This may be a city-country thing as most of our marts here are non-scan. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:37 am Post subject: |
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| Carbon wrote: |
| Captain Corea wrote: |
Why? Because I don't like to hang out with people of a certain ilk? I generally try to avoid alcoholics as well. People who frequently do cocaine are low on my friend list too.
Is that really so strange?
Here's my reasoning... I grew up in a household of smokers/drinkers/druggies and lost many family members to them.
I don't want them to be a big part of my life.
But go on with your name calling. I'm sure that makes a heap more sense than actually asking me about my rationale. |
Well, your rationale paints every smoker as lame as you indicate your family to be, which is quite the generality. Sounds like a crippling way to live, but if painting everyone with your old, thin brush makes your world more colorful, then enjoy.
BTW, Regardless of why, you are only affirming my previous statements about your apparent character. You shouldn't make smokers carry your bags; they are victims too and what with their guaranteed shortened lives and slow but certain pending health problems, you should empathize, not judge. |
What the heck are you going on about? Carry my bags? When the frak did I say anything of the sort.
How hard is it for you to grasp - I don't want that type of stuff in my life. I don't want it close to me. I go out of my way to avoid it. I'm not paranoid of it, but I prefer to distance myself from ppl who would do it.
If people want to get addicted to things like that, it's their call. But why do you seem to intent on pushing it on me?
As for your dig calling my family lame, go *beep* yourself. My mom died from lung cancer, and I just lost two aunts to liver sclerosis. I'm sure to you they might have been "the life of the party" at some point, but I got to witness how the diseases ravaged their bodies... and how the addictions stayed with them to the end.
No doubt you're sore because you've been schooled by me on countless threads in the past... and now you're bent out of shape because I'm attacking the one pathetic activity you still have in your life - but you're mistaken. I could care less if you smoke. In fact, I encourage it. I'm more than fine with you puffing away.
Just don't want you or your kind anywhere near me.
I've no doubt that feeling is mutual - so I really don't see the point in you disagreeing with me.
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| People jumped line back home as well at the corner store for a pack of smokes or a can of coke. People ran in and grabbed a 3 dollar 40 and slapped down three bucks or gave a nod for a newspaper and slapped down 50 cents. Or getting a loosey for 25 cent (50 these days...) It was bang bang and no one cared as long as you could tell the person ahead was taking their time and that you were going to be exact change, single item, in and out. |
Gotta' say, SR - I never saw this back home. I worked in grocery stores for over a dozen years... and I NEVER saw tis - at least never saw it tolerated . People waited in line. Heck, cashiers were not even able to do such transactions as it would be a breach of procedure for handling cash (i.e.. confusion over mixing up orders and such).
Last edited by Captain Corea on Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:40 am; edited 1 time in total |
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diver
Joined: 16 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:37 am Post subject: |
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Strawman. Your position is weak, that's why you have to create hypothetical situations.
These people (and it's always smokers) will walk in the door, elbow their way to the counter, even WHILE I AM HANDING MY MONEY OVER, interrupt whatever the clerk or I am saying and demand cigarettes.
We're not talking about a patient smoker waiting at the back of the line, who decides to go first because the guy in front isn't ready. We're not talking about scanning, or newspapers, or exact change. We're talking about first-come, first-served. Something that too many smokers in Korea don't get.
I waited for my turn at the counter, smokers can do the same. To support line jumping, and bending over backwards to justify it, really lets all of us know what kind of person you are. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:58 am Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
No doubt you're sore because you've been schooled by me on countless threads in the past... |
Countless indeed.
I don't smoke, by the way, but I appreciate your encouragement all the same. Sorry about your family members, but I'm sure they were good people and worth knowing, despite their bad habits. That's my point. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
People jumped line back home as well at the corner store for a pack of smokes or a can of coke. People ran in and grabbed a 3 dollar 40 and slapped down three bucks or gave a nod for a newspaper and slapped down 50 cents. Or getting a loosey for 25 cent (50 these days...) It was bang bang and no one cared as long as you could tell the person ahead was taking their time and that you were going to be exact change, single item, in and out.
What, someone waiting for a single cigarette should wait 4 minutes for someone to spew out their lotto numbers?
It's called multi-tasking. While you're busy counting your money someone with exact change gets their smokes and when you have your money ready they're out the door.
Now I will object if the person starts to yik and yak and buy 5 different packs of smokes and demand a bag and a receipt. In that case tar and feather them for all I care. Get to the back of the line. But if its exact change and they're in and out in the blink of an eye, and I'm still peeling off Chun Wons out of the bankroll, then who cares? Its not like you've actually been delayed and another human being gets to get on with their life.
As I said, it depends on the situation. Have your money out and ready. Don't stare off stupidly into space once you've reached the counter, debating to yourself whether or not to get that pack of Mentos.
The problem here is that the marts have to scan everything and the clerks don't seem to be able to get the whole system going where they just scan another of the same item 2 minutes later after the line has died down.
I should amend things to if its a Mart that scans, then line-jumping is a foul because the scan is too long and too much of a delay. That whole scan and ring up thing is a good 10-15+ seconds. This may be a city-country thing as most of our marts here are non-scan. |
Too many "ifs" and "whens". All of your atypical situations aside, cue jumping is lame behavior and very, very common in Korea. You are in serious denial if you can't agree to that. Then again, maybe you are right, because as I pointed out earlier, there are rarely lines to jump here.
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:20 am Post subject: |
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| Carbon wrote: |
| Captain Corea wrote: |
No doubt you're sore because you've been schooled by me on countless threads in the past... |
Countless indeed.
I don't smoke, by the way, but I appreciate your encouragement all the same. Sorry about your family members, but I'm sure they were good people and worth knowing, despite their bad habits. That's my point. |
And my point is - their habits/addictions killed them early. Robbed them of playing with their grandchildren. Created burdens for the ones that supported them. And blinded them to the dangers of the substances they were ingesting.
Good people or not, I don't want that sort in my life. I don't want my daughter to wonder "Why did _____ pee their pants?" or "Why is uncle _____ talking so funny and throwing up in the garden?" or "Why is grandma hacking into that tissue?"
I loved my family - but was careful to keep them at a distance from my daughter. I didn't let my mom smoke around her, and I refused to get into the car with a drunk or high person - no matter how much they claimed they were sober.
So yeah... I suppose they were nice. And I know I loved them. But I also know I wanted nothing to do with that part of their lives.
Just like I want nothing to do with people smoking.
So you can call it a high horse if you like - if that helps simplify things for you. But I've been pretty honest on here in sharing my reasoning - and I don't think it's all that out to lunch. |
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 5:57 am Post subject: |
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| Feloria wrote: |
One of my co-workers asked me a few weeks ago if I'd ever tried a cigarette--he said "I hate people who say they hate cigarettes and smoking
when they've never tried it."
Well, I've never hit myself in the head with a hammer either; but I'm pretty sure I wouldn't get much out of it! |
Hitting oneself with a hammer isn't a pleasurable experience. Smoking can be. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:53 am Post subject: |
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| Carbon wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
People jumped line back home as well at the corner store for a pack of smokes or a can of coke. People ran in and grabbed a 3 dollar 40 and slapped down three bucks or gave a nod for a newspaper and slapped down 50 cents. Or getting a loosey for 25 cent (50 these days...) It was bang bang and no one cared as long as you could tell the person ahead was taking their time and that you were going to be exact change, single item, in and out.
What, someone waiting for a single cigarette should wait 4 minutes for someone to spew out their lotto numbers?
It's called multi-tasking. While you're busy counting your money someone with exact change gets their smokes and when you have your money ready they're out the door.
Now I will object if the person starts to yik and yak and buy 5 different packs of smokes and demand a bag and a receipt. In that case tar and feather them for all I care. Get to the back of the line. But if its exact change and they're in and out in the blink of an eye, and I'm still peeling off Chun Wons out of the bankroll, then who cares? Its not like you've actually been delayed and another human being gets to get on with their life.
As I said, it depends on the situation. Have your money out and ready. Don't stare off stupidly into space once you've reached the counter, debating to yourself whether or not to get that pack of Mentos.
The problem here is that the marts have to scan everything and the clerks don't seem to be able to get the whole system going where they just scan another of the same item 2 minutes later after the line has died down.
I should amend things to if its a Mart that scans, then line-jumping is a foul because the scan is too long and too much of a delay. That whole scan and ring up thing is a good 10-15+ seconds. This may be a city-country thing as most of our marts here are non-scan. |
Too many "ifs" and "whens". All of your atypical situations aside, cue jumping is lame behavior and very, very common in Korea. You are in serious denial if you can't agree to that. Then again, maybe you are right, because as I pointed out earlier, there are rarely lines to jump here.
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Oh I agree that there are plenty of ajosshis who bump to the front and then take their time and I give them the glare.
What I'm talking about is in rural areas where everyone knows each other (as opposed to anonymous Family Mart in Seoul) and paying in exact change.
Remember this isn't about Koreans or ajosshis, its about smokers.
I said its okay only if its exact change and there's no time out for scanning and repunching in the transaction. Other than that, WAIT YOUR TURN.
| Quote: |
| I waited for my turn at the counter, smokers can do the same. To support line jumping, and bending over backwards to justify it, really lets all of us know what kind of person you are. |
Someone who hung out at the corner store back home before shifts and on break? Someone who if the situations are reversed has no problem with a guy getting their smokes and on their way while I fumble with my change or yik-yak with the guy behind the counter.
Dude, you go to a place where single cigs are sold and people know each other and you got one guy behind the counter punching in lotto numbers and yeah, you can jump up, throw 5 down for a pack of smokes and be on your way. Talking corner stores that sell roses in the tiny glass tubes and have aluminum foil at the front counter next to Swishers and Zig Zags and Brillo pads and travelers of 5-O. Places where its punched into a register by the guy who owns the place, not some corporate mart or CVS.
Everyone there is for the same reasons, to get their smokes, booze, and munchies. People are understanding if they're doing something that takes time and you have exact change and are getting a pack of smokes. They smoke too and get their drink on as well.
You think its rude to line jump and throw exact change for a pack of smokes? I think its rude to not have your cash ready and to get up there and stare at the candy or looking at all the calling cards n' stuff behind the counter for 30 seconds while everyone else is trying to get in and out.
It's like the person who has been standing in line at McD's for 5 minutes and getting up to the front without having really thought about what they want and staring stupidly at the menu for two minutes while everyone is waiting behind them and then asking if they have a Shamrock Shake in mid-October and if they could get a Mountain Dew. At McD's. Then wondering if they take Diner's Club. I know I exaggerate, but we've all been there. And you know what, if all you want is a $1 Double Cheeseburger and have your buck on you, you should be able to jump in front of them. Respect of the line goes both ways, and if people have a good idea of things, you can have polite lines, but also make exceptions for simple exact change purchases that get people on their merry way. The line is not so important that someone getting a 50 cent newspaper shouldn't be able to jump ahead of me while I'm dropping my stuff on the counter and fishing money out of my pockets. |
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Kimchifart
Joined: 15 Sep 2010
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:13 pm Post subject: |
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| northway wrote: |
| radcon wrote: |
| If your group of friends engage in any activity you can't stand, you must either endure the behavior or find new friends. Don't whine and try to change them. |
This. I smoke when I drink. If there's galbi and a bottle of soju around, I'm going to smoke. My friends and coworkers recognize this and deal with it. If the smoke is blowing in their faces, I'm going to switch places, but if I'm out with my buddy for dinner and it's just him and I, I'm not going to leave the table every time I want to have a smoke. |
I bet many of them secretly resent you and bitch about you. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
...there are plenty of [Korean] ajosshis....What I'm talking about is in rural areas where everyone knows each other...
Remember this isn't about Koreans or ajosshis...
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Conditionals and contradictions....welcome to ill-conceived world of the apologist. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Kimchifart wrote: |
I bet many of them secretly resent you and bitch about you. |
And I bet they are pretty torn up about that. Do you really worry about what others secretly think? If so, you shouldn't post about it; we might secretly think you are insecure. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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SR - you don't see the strawman in your argument? You're putting some pretty exact conditions on your statement.
-small town shop
-not a franchise
-everyone in line fumbles for money
-the place pushes lotto tickets
-the smoker always has exact change
or...
you could just admit that it's rude. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 3:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Carbon wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
...there are plenty of [Korean] ajosshis....What I'm talking about is in rural areas where everyone knows each other...
Remember this isn't about Koreans or ajosshis...
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Conditionals and contradictions....welcome to ill-conceived world of the apologist. |
So, the idea that its okay to cut to the front of the line if you're paying with exact change for a pack of smokes, is what, some major contradiction or condition?
| Quote: |
| SR - you don't see the strawman in your argument? You're putting some pretty exact conditions on your statement. |
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that having exact change for a pack of smokes is not such a rare event.
Look, it doesn't have to be a small town shop and/or franchise, but that makes it more likely to be "okay". It's just in the city it tends to be a franchise where everything is scanned.
Let's go through each criteria-
Small Town liquor store- Common. In fact this rule can also apply to ones in big cities.
Not a Franchise- Common. The main thing about it not being a big city/franchise is the use of a scanner. If they scan, it's slow and rude.
People not having their money ready- Common.
Lotto Tickets- Now this was something back home, and sorry to be sarcastic, but Lotto tickets at a liquor store? Whoda thunk it? Never see people playing the lotto at a liquor store. And I just used lotto tickets as an example of someone in line doing something that is time consuming, that should provide justification for handing over 5 for smokes (or a buck for a soda).
Smoker having exact change- 2,500 won a pack. Two for 5. Yeah, I can see exact change being a rarity there. Exactly 5,000 won. Good thing there isn't a 5,000 won bill or anything in circulation. And yeah, back home from like 2005-2008, Marlboros/Camels/Winstons came out to 4.98 with tax.
That's like saying I'm attaching a bunch of conditions for finding a good used car such as
-working engine
-non-cracked windshield
-maintenance records
-under 100,000 miles
-private seller
-minivan
Wow, how could someone ever find a car that matches all those different criteria??? What exact conditions.
| Quote: |
or...
you could just admit that it's rude. |
It's rude under certain circumstances, which are also common.
-Store uses scanner
-Customer in front buying a simple item
-Smoker does not have exact change
-smoker buying more than just smokes
-customer has money ready to be transacted with cashier
But those are such "rare" circumstances....
So I have a question? Is it rude not to have your wallet out/money ready when you reach the counter? Is it rude at a fast food joint to wait in line for a couple minutes and when you get there, not have your order ready? Is it rude to stare at the candy or chit-chat with the cashier while other people are waiting?
Or in my world, people can make allowances based on the circumstances and let someone through exact change at someone for smokes or a coke or bag of chips or a newspaper and be on their way and all it does is delay you 2 seconds while you spend another minute at the cashier.
Strict line transaction time:
Customer A: 1 minute
Exact Change Customer: 1 minute, 2 seconds.
Total time: 2 minutes, 2 seconds.
"No problem bud" transaction time:
Customer A: 1 minute, 2 seconds.
Customer B: 2 seconds.
Total Time: 1 minute, 4 seconds.
Which is the better system? |
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